Belgian Golden Strong Ale Pink Elephant (Delirium Tremens clone)

[jesseb]

Last weekend I've decided to brew this beer again. I had all of the ingredients on hand, so why not. Back then, this recipe was actually my first AG ever and I wasn't really satisfied with the results. It was 'ok', but far from the beer I had hope to brew. With the knowledge I have today I know I made a lot of mistakes back then; no starter, too much spices, a lot of splashing/shaking of the beer and no proper maturation time.
The recipe I used is as follows:

3.1 kg (6,8 lb) Pilsener
500 g (1.1 lb) Clear candy sugar

30 g (1.05 oz) Styrian Goldings @ 60 min
15 g (0.53 oz) Saaz @ 15 min

2.4 g Grains of Paradise
2.4 g Fresh grated ginger
7.2 g Coriander seeds
(All added at 10 min)

Mash: 10 @ 52C, 45 @ 62C, 30 @ 70C, 77 mashout.
Yeast: Wyeast 1388 Belgian Strong Ale

Sparged untill 16L was collected. Pre-boil gravity of 1.048, boiled it down to about 12.5L and a gravity of 1.061. Didn't added the sugar yet. I used only one yeast. The Wyeast 1388 should be the same as the WLP570. Calculated the desired yeast count and made a 1L starter two days in advance. Added half of the sugar, 250 g on day three of primary and the other half on day four. With the starter combined I ended up with 13L in the fermenter.

I kept the temperature the first two days at 19C/66F. After adding the first sugar, I let the temp rise. It kept itself at a steady 24C/75C. The temp started to decrease slowly around day 7 or 8. Today, day 10, it sat at 21C/70F. The gravity now is 1.009.

Racked it to a 10L glass flask, and bottled the rest. As the picture shows, it was still quite cloudy. The bottles will be used for a comparison between bulk and bottle conditioning.

I didn't use the second yeast because I want to collect and reuse this yeast (and I didn't had the S-04 on hand ). The S-04 is only used to get to the low gravity right? I've use this strain of yeast before in a Duvel clone and that one ended at 1.006, so no worries. Adding the sugar in stages during fermentation also supposed to reduce the stress on the yeast and therefore results in a lower gravity.

The taste is actually quite nice, fairly light and sweet with a smell of pineapple. Most of my Belgians at this stage are more or less disgusting, so I'm confident it will turn out nice.

PS: Some of you may wonder why I used candy sugar. Well, simply because it is sold in the grocery stores here and it cost only a wee bit more than regular sugar. I don't think it matters in terms of taste, but as far as I understand candy sugar is easier digested by the yeast (less stress, lower FG).

 

[Sudz]

Just discovered DT on a trip. Eager to give this a try.
Does anyone know what the hop AA percentages were on the original recipe?

 

[Sudz]

Just popped a cap of this brew after about five weeks in the bottle. Fantastic....
I made this from the original posted recipe and must say, it's spot on as a clone of DT. Early samples were too sweet but then again they hadn't been aged. The sweetness has subsided at this point and the beer is very good even though it is still very young for this style.

Thanks jkarp for this most excellent clone.

 

[Mateusz]

Hanks jkarp for this recipe.
I am planning to brew Delirium soon.
I have an important question: should I take out the spices after 10 minutes of cooking or leave them for cooling?

cheers

 

[Sudz]

I leave mine in. No problem as far as I can tell and... I've been brewing for about 10 years and this has been my favorite brew of all. Getting it to finish out has been the only challenge I've encountered.

 

[jzimpleman]

I brewed this yesterday and my OG came in at 1.055. Not sure what I did wrong, but I suspect a didn’t get as much boil off as usual since I have almost 6 gallons in the fermentor. It’s bubbling away, but I’m worried about missing my numbers.

Should I add in some boiled sugar water?

 

[Kee]

I brewed this yesterday and my OG came in at 1.055. Not sure what I did wrong, but I suspect a didn’t get as much boil off as usual since I have almost 6 gallons in the fermentor. It’s bubbling away, but I’m worried about missing my numbers.

Should I add in some boiled sugar water?

That's one of those 50/50 questions, with no right or wrong answers. When I miss my numbers, I usually just go with it.

 

[Sudz]

+1. Generally you do more harm than good with a fix. You'll have a decent beer at 1.055, just light on the alcohol...

 

[Chicago_Eric_]

Just moved this to secondary. OG 1.072 to 1.004. Problem is that it's hot as hell here in Spain. Going to be 95-100 the over the next week. I'm loading up the cooler with frozen water bottles but so far have only been able to get it down to the high 50s. Am I doing anything productive trying to lager at that temp? What should I do if I can't get it low enough.

 

[BrewCityBaller]

Just moved this to secondary. OG 1.072 to 1.004. Problem is that it's hot as hell here in Spain. Going to be 95-100 the over the next week. I'm loading up the cooler with frozen water bottles but so far have only been able to get it down to the high 50s. Am I doing anything productive trying to lager at that temp? What should I do if I can't get it low enough.

I had to double check what thread I was replying to! I had no idea the original poster recommended a lager... and I have no idea why.

WLP570 has an optimal ferm temp of 68-75*F. Other than crashing out the yeast, I can't fathom what a two week "lager" will do when using ale yeast.

If it were me I wouldn't bother bringing it an lower. Save yourself the ice.

 

[cgoldberg3]

The fact that homebrewing isn't economical seems to be a running joke. But this recipe looks like it actually could be, considering that the stores where I live charge $25 for a 4-pack of 12oz bottles of Delirium! Might make this for my next batch.

 

[cgoldberg3]

Brewed this today as a 5 gallon batch. Used OP’s revised directions to just do a protein test and 156f mash, plus a 172 mash out. Used Wyeast 3787 because that was the only one my grain source had available, and skipped the S04 yeast since most people who’ve made this recipe seem not to like the taste of it. Pitched yeast at 68f and I’m letting it ride at ambient temp in a closet like OP.

Edit: forgot my OG was 1.085 with the hydrometer and refractometer read 18.5 brix. If this finishes dry it’s gonna be like a wine lol. Hopefully the 156 mash is high enough to keep it from getting too dry.

 

[Kee]

Edit: forgot my OG was 1.085 with the hydrometer and refractometer read 18.5 brix. If this finishes dry it’s gonna be like a wine lol. Hopefully the 156 mash is high enough to keep it from getting too dry.

I would expect the WY3787 to bring it down to around 1.012, give or take. And you are doing the right thing to let the temperature rise, especially at that OG,. Should be a good brew that will improve with a little aging.

 

[cgoldberg3]

After about 24 hrs after pitching, the carboy blew the blowoff tube + rubber stopper off, and puked krausen all over the carboy exterior and floor. Never seen a blowoff tube fail but I guess it was too much gas for too small of a tube. Wiped it off, let it open ferment for a few hours to calm down, and put the blowoff tube back on.

12 hours later it was still attached though it clearly has been forcing krausen through the tube and into the bucket of sanitizer, which now looks like muddy water. Carboy looks like it has at least 2 pints less liquid than it did at pitch. Never had such a vigorous fermentation, but this is my first Belgian so maybe that's normal. I will definitely either brew a smaller batch next time, or brew it in a larger vessel because this recipe needs at least a full gallon of headspace to expand into.

 

[Kee]

Never had such a vigorous fermentation, but this is my first Belgian so maybe that's normal.

WY3787 is famous for that.

 

[cgoldberg3]

10 days on, completely simmered down. Starting to clear up just a little bit, and the krausen has completely fallen. Carboy is sitting on a heating pad that has brought it up to the 72-75F range. I thought I could let it go ambient the entire time but spring decided to take a vacation around the time I started the batch and from what I've read here, getting the fermentation chamber into the 70s is necessary for proper Belgian flavor. Probably won't bother taking gravity readings till day 14 at the earliest.

PS this whole process reeks, never made such a farty-smelling beer before.

 

[cgoldberg3]

21 days on, first gravity reading is 1.012, for 85% apparent attentuation and 9.5% abv. Spot on to what Kee estimated. Think I’ll call this good and cold crash + gelatin fine. Either gonna bottle this coming week (if I have enough empties) or keg.

 

[Trevor Mack]

Even if you keg, I'd throw some into any empty bottle you have and store off somewhere and forget about em for several months to the better half of a year. I'm sure you will thank me in 2022 when you crack one open.

 

[cgoldberg3]

Even if you keg, I'd throw see into any empty bottle you have and store off somewhere and forget about em for several months to the better half of a year. I'm sure you will thank me in 2022 when you crack one open.

That’s probably a good idea. I’m gonna “lager” this ale for probably a month after it finishes carbonation anyway since most people complain about the beer tasting green when it’s young.

 

[cgoldberg3]

Found exactly enough empties to bottle the whole batch today. Between lost volume from blow-offs and the sizeable trub, I got about 3.7 gallons in the bottling bucket. Primed with about 4.7 ounces of white table sugar, which is hopefully enough to make it a strongly carbonated Belgian but not too much so for my bottles to handle. Currently sitting at 70F in a closet, where they’ll stay for the next 3 weeks.

I’m happy with the color of the beer and the results of the gelatin fining so far, which you can see in the pics below.

 

[cgoldberg3]

Three weeks in the bottle and they are completely uncarbonated. Like, not even a tiny bit. IDK what went wrong here. It's like the yeast just totally died. Really wishing I would have kegged right about now.

How do I salvage this? Pitch more yeast into each bottle?

 

[Kee]

Three weeks in the bottle and they are completely uncarbonated. Like, not even a tiny bit. IDK what went wrong here. It's like the yeast just totally died. Really wishing I would have kegged right about now.

How do I salvage this? Pitch more yeast into each bottle?

The method I use is to uncap the bottles and sprinkle in some dry yeast, something like Lavin EC-1118 that works on simple sugars but not so much on maltose.

 

[cgoldberg3]

Month 2 in the bottles and there's a dusting of yeast in the bottom of every bottle, but not much. I think I'll give it another month to a month and a half before I look into using champagne yeast or something. According to some of the older threads on here, people have seen Belgian strong ales take as much as 3 months to carb.

Regardless though, next time I'm kegging any high OG beers.

 

[Dancy]

Three weeks in the bottle and they are completely uncarbonated. Like, not even a tiny bit. IDK what went wrong here. It's like the yeast just totally died. Really wishing I would have kegged right about now.
How do I salvage this? Pitch more yeast into each bottle?

I’ve brewed a couple of Belgian Dark Strong Ales in the last 5 months. Initially used Mangrove Jack’s M41 for one and M31 for the other (2 pks each, 5G batches). At bottling time, when I gently stirred corn sugar into the bottling bucket, I also stirred in hydrated LalBrew CBC-1 yeast. The carbonation turned out great.

 

[cgoldberg3]

I’ve brewed a couple of Belgian Dark Strong Ales in the last 5 months. Initially used Mangrove Jack’s M41 for one and M31 for the other (2 pks each, 5G batches). At bottling time, when I gently stirred corn sugar into the bottling bucket, I also stirred in hydrated LalBrew CBC-1 yeast. The carbonation turned out great.

Didn’t know they had yeast specifically for bottle conditioning. Definitely good to know for next time.

 

[laurentobias]

Thanks so much to everyone for your contributions to this thread. I decided to try my hand at a belgian strong, starting with HuRRiC4Ne's extract version and (obviously) making my own adjustments and mistakes. OG hit 1.073 but I think I pitched the WLP570 too low - of course, this is the time I finally got my wort chiller to cool down to 60. I didn't use the S-04. 13 days into fermentation (without temp control - and it's winter), FG is down to 1.02. What do I do from here? Call that done and keg it? I've tasted and the beer is pretty good... I would happily drink it, but admittedly my palate isn't quite awakened to things like greenness. I had planned to cold crash in the kegerator for 2 weeks before letting it age a little longer outside of the fridge, but am I overthinking it?

 

[madscientist451]

If you can, move the fermenter into a warmer environment for 3-4 days or longer and maybe it will go a little lower, then cold crash and keg. I’d probably let it age a month after kegging, but if you like it as is, go ahead and enjoy it.

 

[laurentobias]

Will try that, thanks! And thanks for replying in such an old thread!

 

[jdubdvdt]

Just brewed a batch of this (or similar enough to it, this thread inspired it)

5.5 gal fermenter batch
12lb Dingemans Belgian Pilsner
1lb 1oz Simplicity Candi Syrup
1lb Dextrose
4oz D-45 Candi Syrup

0.4oz Magnum 14% AA at 60' min
1oz Saaz 2.5% AA at 10 min
0.5oz Styrian Goldings 2.5% AA at 10 min
13.2g ground coriander seeds at 10 min
4g ground grain of paradise seeds at 10 min
4.5g freshly chopped ginger at 10 min

Water - Ca 40, Mg 7, Na 30, Cl 75, SO4 75, pH to 5.44 (lactic acid to adjust)
Mash 125 (15min), 144 (45min), 158 (30min), 168 (10min)
90 minute boil

Ended up with 1.082 OG on accident. 24 IBU
Pitched directly on my Belgian Tripel yeast cake of Mangrove Jack's M31 Tripel Friday night at 11pm. Currently roughly 60 hours later it is 1.010 and slowly chewing this morning. Planning to transfer to a keg at 14 days and age for a minimum 3 months.

I thought I had candi sugar and I had already started the mash so I had to make it work with candi syrup and dextrose. Should be fine. My Styrian goldings was waaaay too low AA to use for bittering and I would have had a lot of vegetal matter in the beer. I pushed the late hop additions closer to flame out. Looking forward to this one. Thanks for the recipe.

 

[HazzyJ]

Righto... I came and joined just to get this of my chest.
Firstly I would like to thank the OP for his recipe and the dedication he put to answering everyone early on in this thread. He really created a juggernaut that has powered on for over 15 years
After watching and reading this thread for over a year now, I decided to brew as close as I could get to this. I'm in Australia (excuse the metric measurements), so liquid yeast from the US is getting harder to source, and we don't see Dingemans malts much anymore.
My recipe is as follows for a 60L batch:
90L RO water with minerals for Antwerp water in mash.
13.5kg Weyermann Floor Malted Pilsner
2kg Cane sugar (in boil)
Followed original step mash with HERMS temp control.
90 min boil.
35g Warrior @ 60 (16.6 IBU)
70g Saaz @ 15 (4.3 IBU)
At 10 mins:
30g Coriander
10g Fresh grated ginger
10g Alligator Pepper (GoP)
4 sachets of Mangrove Jacks M41 Belgian Ale, starting at 20c and rising 1c per day.
OG 1.066 (overshot total volume by ~8L!)

It's been down for a week now and it seems to be fermenting along nicely. Current gravity is 1.009 and still dropping. I can't tell you how it smells of tastes as I am away for work over 2000 miles from the beer, and won't be back there for another 12 days. It should be going through the cold crash by the time I get there to taste it.
Thank god for WiFi fermentation pills and tools!

Thanks again to the OP, and all you who have chimed in for the feedback on your brews. Normally this isn't my jam to comment, but this thread really meant a lot to me.

Cheers all,

Hazzy

 

[jdubdvdt]

Righto... I came and joined just to get this of my chest.
Firstly I would like to thank the OP for his recipe and the dedication he put to answering everyone early on in this thread. He really created a juggernaut that has powered on for over 15 years
After watching and reading this thread for over a year now, I decided to brew as close as I could get to this. I'm in Australia (excuse the metric measurements), so liquid yeast from the US is getting harder to source, and we don't see Dingemans malts much anymore.
My recipe is as follows for a 60L batch:
90L RO water with minerals for Antwerp water in mash.
13.5kg Weyermann Floor Malted Pilsner
2kg Cane sugar (in boil)
Followed original step mash with HERMS temp control.
90 min boil.
35g Warrior @ 60 (16.6 IBU)
70g Saaz @ 15 (4.3 IBU)
At 10 mins:
30g Coriander
10g Fresh grated ginger
10g Alligator Pepper (GoP)
4 sachets of Mangrove Jacks M41 Belgian Ale, starting at 20c and rising 1c per day.
OG 1.066 (overshot total volume by ~8L!)

It's been down for a week now and it seems to be fermenting along nicely. Current gravity is 1.009 and still dropping. I can't tell you how it smells of tastes as I am away for work over 2000 miles from the beer, and won't be back there for another 12 days. It should be going through the cold crash by the time I get there to taste it.
Thank god for WiFi fermentation pills and tools!

Thanks again to the OP, and all you who have chimed in for the feedback on your brews. Normally this isn't my jam to comment, but this thread really meant a lot to me.

Cheers all,

Hazzy

Awesome. Keep us posted. I'm not going to sample mine again until September most likely. The small sip I did have was good!

 

[HazzyJ]

Awesome. Keep us posted. I'm not going to sample mine again until September most likely. The small sip I did have was good!

Cheers
I look forward to hearing updates on how yours turned out with the D-45, and Simplicity! I had 2X sachets of the Simplicity that I think I bought to use, but decided to go with the sugar in case I didn't get the fermentability of the wort. Now that I look at the way the ferment is going, and the expected FG of 0.999, I am kinda wishing I did use it!

 

[Peteinno]

It's been down for a week now and it seems to be fermenting along nicely. Current gravity is 1.009 and still dropping. I can't tell you how it smells of tastes as I am away for work over 2000 miles from the beer, and won't be back there for another 12 days. It should be going through the cold crash by the time I get there to taste it.

I brewed a recipe similar to this for my Delerium clone using a combination of 1388 and S-04. I left it in the fermenter for 3 weeks and wished I left it in longer. I started fermentation at 70 and let it rise to 78. OG was 1.074 and final gravity was 1.008. It had a Sulphur odor and taste that took away from it's enjoyment. After about 2 months in the keg the Sulphur finally started to dissipate but it was still detectable. Anyone else have a Sulphur problem?

 

[jdubdvdt]

Cheers
I look forward to hearing updates on how yours turned out with the D-45, and Simplicity! I had 2X sachets of the Simplicity that I think I bought to use, but decided to go with the sugar in case I didn't get the fermentability of the wort. Now that I look at the way the ferment is going, and the expected FG of 0.999, I am kinda wishing I did use it!

Well, as much as I thought I had D-45 and Simplicity, I did find out right after I brewed it that LD Carlson was making their own out of corn syrup and the flavors are not exactly the same as what CSI was making. LD Carlson is definitely pushing the limits of a potential lawsuit with their packaging and how it essentially was swapped on the distribution side without notifying home brew stores.
I bought it through my LHBS and they were blown away that it had changed and no one said anything on the distribution side. Sounds illegal.

See this link -> https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/candi-syrup-is-it-real-does-it-matter.735380/
if it does not come in the pouch and say the ingredients are "beet sugar" and "water" then it is not real candi syrup. I am pissed.

I brewed a recipe similar to this for my Delerium clone using a combination of 1388 and S-04. I left it in the fermenter for 3 weeks and wished I left it in longer. I started fermentation at 70 and let it rise to 78. OG was 1.074 and final gravity was 1.008. It had a Sulphur odor and taste that took away from it's enjoyment. After about 2 months in the keg the Sulphur finally started to dissipate but it was still detectable. Anyone else have a Sulphur problem?

Sulfur is typically produced by lager yeasts - especially when stressed. Although S-04 is an ale yeast I would imagine that the yeast was stressed with that combination of temperature and gravity. Did you use a yeast nutrient, oxygenate the wort, etc? I always use yeast nutrient regardless of the beer or yeast. It is a silly habit, but a happy yeast is a happy beer dad.

I have always tried to maintain no higher than 68F with S-04, but honestly my notes are so old I can't find out what temperature range I actually liked. I haven't used it since 2015-2016ish. It has the capacity to do higher gravities, but above the max recommended temperature, high gravity, and maybe without yeast nutrient? I would a think you'd have a stressed yeast.

I originally misread and missed that you used a WY1388 as well. I don't know if one took off before the other or if you underpitched the belgian yeast. If the belgian yeast was underpitched and the S-04 took off, then maybe that is where the sulfur came from.

Let me know what you think, but those are my initial thoughts.

 

[Kee]

Well, as much as I thought I had D-45 and Simplicity, I did find out right after I brewed it that LD Carlson was making their own out of corn syrup and the flavors are not exactly the same as what CSI was making. LD Carlson is definitely pushing the limits of a potential lawsuit with their packaging and how it essentially was swapped on the distribution side without notifying home brew stores.
I bought it through my LHBS and they were blown away that it had changed and no one said anything on the distribution side. Sounds illegal.

When CSI candi syrup apparently became unavailable at retail (somebody correct me if they know a source) I thought I had found it on Amazon, the item info described it as such. When it arrived it was LD Carlson syrup with different ingredients. I posted a comment on the item and Amazon informed me that my comment did not meet their editorial approval, which makes no sense. I was only relating facts.

So, buyer beware.

 

[Peteinno]

I originally misread and missed that you used a WY1388 as well. I don't know if one took off before the other or if you underpitched the belgian yeast. If the belgian yeast was underpitched and the S-04 took off, then maybe that is where the sulfur came from.

Let me know what you think, but those are my initial thoughts.

Thanks for your thoughts. I think a pouch each is plenty of yeast and usually the liquid takes off before the dry. I may have pitched too warm and let it rise too high. Next attempt I'll pitch around 66 and only let it get up to 74. The S-04 may not have liked the high temps.

 

[Trevor Mack]

I've been in contact with a few homebrew stores and linked them to the source to be able to inventory themselves as they also don't like the LD Carlson product (or at least their customers don't - those that know better).

https://www.candisyrup.com/ is the source company - feel free to message them as they may be able to do one off bulk orders (8 bottles at 2.5lb each). They no longer pack in the 1lb pouch we have grown so used to they now use a bottle for packaging.

 

[Man_the_Dan28]

I brewed this batch on May 31st and hit an original gravity (OG) of 1.075. I pitched WLP570 at 68°F, and by June 6th, the gravity had dropped to 1.022. This is only my second brew, so I decided to purchase a Tilt hydrometer to monitor fermentation more closely. On June 6th, I CO2 purged the fermenter, added the Tilt, and also pitched 2.5 grams of S-04 along with enzymes to help push it through the final stretch. As of today June 14th, the gravity has reached 1.001, so I’ve started the cold crash.This is definitely going to be stronger than a standard Delirium Tremens, but the sample I pulled tastes just like it, I had some on hand for comparison, and it’s spot on. I plan to cold crash for two weeks, then add Biofine Clear. After letting it sit another week, I’ll transfer to a clean keg and force carbonate using a carb stone

 

[VTMongoose]

Duvel yeast (1388/570/WB-06) reliably reaches a final gravity of 1.004 every batch in my experience for reference on what to expect. Like all diastatic yeasts, it is a very slow crawl to the finish. Warm it up and give it at least a couple weeks and keep an eye on your tilt.

It's funny the LD Carson "imitations" of the CSI candi syrup were mentioned in here. That stuff is an abomination. I ruined two Belgian Dubbels with it back to back before I realized what had happened. My latest two on the other hand brewed with the authentic CSI syrups available at https://www.brewhardware.com/ are absolutely wonderful.