Oxi Clean for Homebrewing?

[NFamato]

I've read some forums about guys using Oxi Clean instead of PBW for cleaning their equipment. Is that true? If so, did I purchase the right stuff. Picture is below.

Also, this does not sanitize equipment just cleans. Correct? And how much much Oxi Clean do I use per 1 Gallon?

Looking for any advise.

 

[pizzaisgood]

Yes. You want to use the oxi clean free. And it only cleans and you wanna make sure to rinse very well. And as far as strength, I just use bout around a teaspoon or so per gallon. I don't uses whole lot, so far has worked well for me. But others can probably tell u the right dose.

 

[JohnnyO]

Yes, I use that exact same stuff. You're correct. It's used to clean, but not sanitize.

I'll use it in fermenters after fermentation to clean the gunk off the walls and to remove odors. It also works great to remove labels off bottles.

In a gallon, you should use a teaspoon or two.

 

[TimpanogosSlim]

Yes, I use that exact same stuff. You're correct. It's used to clean, but not sanitize.

I'll use it in fermenters after fermentation to clean the gunk off the walls and to remove odors. It also works great to remove labels off bottles.

In a gallon, you should use a teaspoon or two.

Point of order - sodium percarbonate (aka sodium carbonate peroxide) -- the "Oxy" part of Oxy-Clean -- produces hydrogen peroxide when mixed with water, which is absolutely a sanitizing agent.

If you were to wash your equipment with nothing but oxyclean and hot water, and rinse with hot tap water (twice) immediately prior to use, your chances of infection would be pretty low.

But a no-rinse sanitizer such as star-san or one-step or to a lesser extent iodophor (which evaporates) has the advantage of not requiring a rinse stage after which the surface is potentially vulnerable to reinfection.

Medieval monks who's idea of sanitation was pouring the chamber pot out the window successfully made beer for hundreds of years.

That said, yes, I use star-san. I also use home-made PBW to wash stuff, and i soak glass and plastic in a 50ppm bleach solution when not in use, if it's small enough to fit in the bucket.

 

[hefehawk]

Is this something for people to use that do a lot of brewing? I've only done a few brews, but have used very little PBW so far.

 

[triangulum33]

i soak glass and plastic in a 50ppm bleach solution when not in use, if it's small enough to fit in the bucket.

For 5G, I calculate this to be 128oz x 5G x 50ppm / 1000000 = .032oz of bleach.
Is this correct?

 

[NFamato]

Point of order - sodium percarbonate (aka sodium carbonate peroxide) -- the "Oxy" part of Oxy-Clean -- produces hydrogen peroxide when mixed with water, which is absolutely a sanitizing agent.

If you were to wash your equipment with nothing but oxyclean and hot water, and rinse with hot tap water (twice) immediately prior to use, your chances of infection would be pretty low.

But a no-rinse sanitizer such as star-san or one-step or to a lesser extent iodophor (which evaporates) has the advantage of not requiring a rinse stage after which the surface is potentially vulnerable to reinfection.

Medieval monks who's idea of sanitation was pouring the chamber pot out the window successfully made beer for hundreds of years.

That said, yes, I use star-san. I also use home-made PBW to wash stuff, and i soak glass and plastic in a 50ppm bleach solution when not in use, if it's small enough to fit in the bucket.

Home-made PBW?

 

[triangulum33]

Wikipedia says that a 2% solution will sanitize for brewing. That would be about 12oz per 5G....

 

[Golddiggie]

Is this something for people to use that do a lot of brewing? I've only done a few brews, but have used very little PBW so far.

Depending on what I need to remove from the items, I mix up anywhere from 1oz to 2oz per gallon (PBW to water solution). Using hot tap water does a great job too.

I've found that PBW rinses far easier than oxyclean. I believe that those that 'make PBW' at home add TSP to oxyfree... From my own past experiences, TSP is a solid cleaner. We used to use it to clean concrete decks when I lived in FL... With a long handled brush (think very stiff, short width, push broom) it did a great job. Didn't take much to wash it away either.

 

[TimpanogosSlim]

Home-made PBW?

The search term you are looking for is "red devil tsp". PBW is a mixture of sodium carbonate, sodium percarbonate, and sodium metasilicate. Red Devil TSP/90 TSP Substitute is straight sodium metasilicate and is available at Ace hardware stores. You can make your own PBW by mixing OxyClean Versatile Free and Red Devil TSP/90.

fwiw the red devil product is so far the only known product you can buy off a shelf in a chain store that is nothing but metasilicate. Other "TSP Substitute" products have totally different formulas.

For 5G, I calculate this to be 128oz x 5G x 50ppm / 1000000 = .032oz of bleach.
Is this correct?

Sort of. The variable you are missing is that household "bleach" is 5.95% sodium hypochlorite.

4 tablespoons for 5 gallons = somewhere between 50 and 100ppm. Most health inspectors consider this a minimum concentration for sanitizing.

Keep in mind that the contact time required is several minutes, and items must be pre-washed (like with dish detergent) and rinsed. Also, metals and hypochlorite don't get along.

Wikipedia says that a 2% solution will sanitize for brewing. That would be about 12oz per 5G....

Wikipedia can say anything i want it to in 10 minutes.

And you'd never get the smell of bleach off anything at that concentration.

 

[helibrewer]

Rinsing the OxyCleaned items with StarSan helps get the OxyClean rinsed off well. OxyClean is very basic and StarSan is about pH 2 so the acid rinse really helps get the OxyClean film off.

 

[triangulum33]

Rinsing the OxyCleaned items with StarSan helps get the OxyClean rinsed off well. OxyClean is very basic and StarSan is about pH 2 so the acid rinse really helps get the OxyClean film off.

This is how I clean my keg lines.
I put 1G or so of hot PBW in the dirty keg, put it on gas and push some through the lines every few min for 30 min. Then hook up a clean keg with star san and rinse the lines with the SS. Then disconnect the clean keg, pour out excess SS, rack beer into keg, connect gas only and carb. Then in a couple weeks, connect beer out, push SS out of the lines with beer!

Sqeeeky clean!!!

 

[triangulum33]

You can see the PBW dissolve crud in the lines as its pumped through that the star san wont touch.

 

[mmarty1]

The search term you are looking for is "red devil tsp". PBW is a mixture of sodium carbonate, sodium percarbonate, and sodium metasilicate. Red Devil TSP/90 TSP Substitute is straight sodium metasilicate and is available at Ace hardware stores. You can make your own PBW by mixing OxyClean Versatile Free and Red Devil TSP/90.

fwiw the red devil product is so far the only known product you can buy off a shelf in a chain store that is nothing but metasilicate. Other "TSP Substitute" products have totally different formulas.

Can you tell me what the mixture ratio would be to blend the Oxyclean Free and Red Devil? Also is this the same as 1 Step Cleanser from Maltriversupply.com (ST-1S-01). PBW was mentioned and I wasn't sure if these were the same.

 

[wormraper]

Can you tell me what the mixture ratio would be to blend the Oxyclean Free and Red Devil? Also is this the same as 1 Step Cleanser from Maltriversupply.com (ST-1S-01). PBW was mentioned and I wasn't sure if these were the same.

heck, you don't even need to use Red Devil TSP. regular TSP is just fine (as long as it has phosphates in it. the brand of regular tsp I have is 6.1% phosphates). it should be a 2-1 ration on the Oxyclean (Sun cleaner is walmarts off brand for 1/4 the price) to TSP.

 

[mmarty1]

Thanks for the response and just one more question. Would blending both Sun cleaner and TSP still be a no rinse cleaner, biodegradable and non-toxic the same as the PBW?

Loving reading through all the knowledge on this forum!

 

[befus]

Thanks for the response and just one more question. Would blending both Sun cleaner and TSP still be a no rinse cleaner, biodegradable and non-toxic the same as the PBW?

Loving reading through all the knowledge on this forum!

Whoa! I do not believe PBW is no rinse in any form, I always rinse mine anyway. Star San is no rinse, iodophor and One Step are no rinse (I think), but Oxyclean and tsp, and PBW would definitely call for rinsing.

 

[mmarty1]

Whoa! I do not believe PBW is no rinse in any form, I always rinse mine anyway. Star San is no rinse, iodophor and One Step are no rinse (I think), but Oxyclean and tsp, and PBW would definitely call for rinsing.

I'm just going from the website copied here and what it says on my container. I guess it doesn't matter much because I use Star San as a final step anyway. But its good to know if general practice is to rinse the PBW.

http://beerpartswarehouse.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=0&products_id=74

Thanks!

 

[bleme]

I'm just going from the website copied here and what it says on my container. I guess it doesn't matter much because I use Star San as a final step anyway. But its good to know if general practice is to rinse the PBW.

http://beerpartswarehouse.com/store/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=0&products_id=74

Thanks!

That ad is for one-step, not PBW. That symbol stands for BeerPartsWarehouse, again not PBW.

 

[tryn2brew]

You can see the PBW dissolve crud in the lines as its pumped through that the star san wont touch.

Remember Star San is a sanitizer, not a cleaner. I would not expect it to dissolve the crud in the lines.

 

[triangulum33]

Remember Star San is a sanitizer, not a cleaner. I would not expect it to dissolve the crud in the lines.

Did I state that SS is a cleaner? I use PBW to dissolve the crud and SS to sanitize after.

 

[befus]

Did I state that SS is a cleaner? I use PBW to dissolve the crud and SS to sanitize after.

Yes you did. You indicated Star San would not get 'crud' out of your lines PBW would. The clear insinuation is that Star San is not as good a cleaner as PBW. This might well confuse newbies that Star San is a cleaner, just not as good as PBW, when in fact they are products with totally different purposes. IMHO.

 

[triangulum33]

Yes you did. You indicated Star San would not get 'crud' out of your lines PBW would. The clear insinuation is that Star San is not as good a cleaner as PBW. This might well confuse newbies that Star San is a cleaner, just not as good as PBW, when in fact they are products with totally different purposes. IMHO.

I apologize for the confusion. I didnt realize I was inferring SS was to be used as a cleaner.

**biting my tongue***

 

[johnsonbrew]

I use a far more scientific approach when using my oxy clean free. I fill my carboy half full of hot water, use about half a scoop of the measuring tool that comes with it. Shake the crap out of it, use my carboy brush to scrub the sides, rinse with hot water at least 3 times or until there are no more sudsy bubbles while filling the carboy, let air dry, cover the carboy mouth with a stopper and let sit in my storage area until brew day. Then I fill half of the carboy with cold water, use a capful of iodophor, shake the crap out of it a half a dozen so times while brewing, dump the solution into a bucket to sanatize the rest of the equipment, rinse the carboy and fill with wort when done boiling and go about my business. I have not had any issues yet. Long story short, Oxy Clean Free is way cheaper than PBW. I have not used star-san or whatever, my LHBS does not carry it, just iodophor.

 

[bleme]

At 1 ounce to 5 gallons iodopher doesn't need rinsed. It is preferred not to as some bacteria could be growing in your faucet.

 

[TimpanogosSlim]

Yes you did. You indicated Star San would not get 'crud' out of your lines PBW would. The clear insinuation is that Star San is not as good a cleaner as PBW. This might well confuse newbies that Star San is a cleaner, just not as good as PBW, when in fact they are products with totally different purposes. IMHO.

Considering that the active ingredients in Star San are phosphoric acid and, essentially, dish detergent, it sort of is a cleaner.

But Star San and PBW do have completely different appropriate uses. They are complementary in nature. PBW to remove the gunk, Star-San to remove whatever PBW left behind.

 

[mmarty1]

That ad is for one-step, not PBW. That symbol stands for BeerPartsWarehouse, again not PBW.

Thanks, for the clarification! I'm going to give the Oxy Free and TSP a try as discussed above and then rinse well before using my Star San.

 

[TimpanogosSlim]

Thanks, for the clarification! I'm going to give the Oxy Free and TSP a try as discussed above and then rinse well before using my Star San.

Keep in mind that they mean Red Devil TSP/90, which contains no Tri Sodium Phosphate at all. Just Sodium Metasilicate. You can get it at Ace hardware stores.

 

[rhys333]

Are there any reports of changes to walmart brand oxi-clean? I use this to clean bottles and I'm experiencing problems with the box I recently purchased. The crystals have recrystalized on the bottom of all my bottles, and I'm having a hell of a time getting it off! Bottling on hold while I attempt a hot water soak to get this crap off! Its doing the opposite of what its supposed to do. Anyone else?

 

[StevieB603]

Personally I use the stuff you have there to peel labels off bottles for use brewing. Get a big tub. I use a plastic sliding drawer like you would see on one of those three drawer standing laundry bins. Fill it with water (about 2.5 gallons) and put 4 tbsp of that stuff. Soak like 12 or so bottles overnight and when you wake up the labels will be floating.

 

[ba-brewer]

I use a far more scientific approach when using my oxy clean free. I fill my carboy half full of hot water, use about half a scoop of the measuring tool that comes with it. Shake the crap out of it, use my carboy brush to scrub the sides, rinse with hot water at least 3 times or until there are no more sudsy bubbles while filling the carboy, let air dry, cover the carboy mouth with a stopper and let sit in my storage area until brew day.

I do something similar with my carboys, but because they are plastic I dont use a brush. I fill with enough hot water that when I turn it upside down into a small bucket of water the oxyclean liquid is above the krausen ring. I let it sit overnight then rinse. Usually the ring is gone by the next morning. I also use just enough oxyclean to just cover the bottom of the scoop even when I am soaking big buckets. The small amount still works just fine and it seem to rinse off easier.

 

[rhys333]

Are there any reports of changes to walmart brand oxi-clean? I use this to clean bottles and I'm experiencing problems with the box I recently purchased. The crystals have recrystalized on the bottom of all my bottles, and I'm having a hell of a time getting it off! Bottling on hold while I attempt a hot water soak to get this crap off! Its doing the opposite of what its supposed to do. Anyone else?

Okay, I'm pretty sure at this point that Walmart Oxi clean formula HAS changed. It does the opposite of what it used to do. I used it to soak 25 bottles last night and this morning I have hard crystals stuck to the bottoms of ALL bottles that cannot be removed, except with a bottle brush attached to a drill. I'm not a happy brewer atm.

My advice to all is to stop using this product as a pbw substitute. It no longer works.

 

[TheMadKing]

Okay, I'm pretty sure at this point that Walmart Oxi clean formula HAS changed. It does the opposite of what it used to do. I used it to soak 25 bottles last night and this morning I have hard crystals stuck to the bottoms of ALL bottles that cannot be removed, except with a bottle brush attached to a drill. I'm not a happy brewer atm.

My advice to all is to stop using this product as a pbw substitute. It no longer works.

Did you put the powder directly in the bottles? Or did you soak them in a premade solution. Also, if you rinsed your bottles thoroughly after you used them, there's no need to use oxy clean.

The purpose of pbw and oxiclean is as an alkaline cleaner to remove stuck on organic matter. I just rinse my bottles well and then dunk them in star san immediately before I fill them, never had an issue.

 

[rhys333]

Did you put the powder directly in the bottles? Or did you soak them in a premade solution. Also, if you rinsed your bottles thoroughly after you used them, there's no need to use oxy clean.

The purpose of pbw and oxiclean is as an alkaline cleaner to remove stuck on organic matter. I just rinse my bottles well and then dunk them in star san immediately before I fill them, never had an issue.

I made an oxi solution in the sink, ensuring all the crystals are disolved as I always have done before. Basically, the chemicals precipitated overnight and formed a hard crust on the bottom of each bottle.

I triple rinse bottles right after pouring, but I use a lot of low floc strains (kolsch, saison) that leave a residue no matter what. Whenever I do, an oxi soak is necessary.

I have to assume at this point that they've altered the product. It came in a new container the last time I purchased some, and I'm guessing packaging isnt the only change.

 

[wormraper]

use the LA's Awesome stuff that you can get from most 99cent stores or dollar trees. stuff is GREAT and I've been using it for years

 

[oakbarn]

You could likely use Star San to get rid of the crystals. I know it gets rid of the chalky residue.

 

[rhys333]

Yeah, they really buggered the walmart stuff up. It even left a crusty film on the sink I mixed it in. Seriously doubting if I even want to use it for laundry at this point!

 

[Toga]

this is a really old thread....

The crystallization and clinging to the side of everything can be caused by hard water. I have really hard water and if I run out of salt in my softener many cleaning detergents give this result. I had it happen last week with oxyclean, cascade dishwasher detergent, and even pbw.

For cheap oxygen cleaner the Sun brand works great as does the Kroger store brand.

The other option is to simply buy Oxyclean. Costco runs a sale about ever 3 months on a huge box for around $10. The huge box works out to be way cheaper than buying any of the off brands in smaller quantities.

 

[govner1]

Point of order - sodium percarbonate (aka sodium carbonate peroxide) -- the "Oxy" part of Oxy-Clean -- produces hydrogen peroxide when mixed with water, which is absolutely a sanitizing agent.

If you were to wash your equipment with nothing but oxyclean and hot water, and rinse with hot tap water (twice) immediately prior to use, your chances of infection would be pretty low.

But a no-rinse sanitizer such as star-san or one-step or to a lesser extent iodophor (which evaporates) has the advantage of not requiring a rinse stage after which the surface is potentially vulnerable to reinfection.

Medieval monks who's idea of sanitation was pouring the chamber pot out the window successfully made beer for hundreds of years.

That said, yes, I use star-san. I also use home-made PBW to wash stuff, and i soak glass and plastic in a 50ppm bleach solution when not in use, if it's small enough to fit in the bucket.

One-Step is a cleaner & not a sanitizer.
I use B-Brite for cleaning & StarSan for sanitizing.
I also flush my lines & pump w/ SaniClean at the end of a brew day.

 

[akthor]

I use oxi clean free or whatever the name of the scent free stuff is. I'll use no name stuff for laundry or regular cleaning but for my beer stuff I get the name brand.