Original Gravity Low for All Grain

[blewinski]

Greetings -

I have just transitioned to All Grain from extract and have done 3 batches. In all 3 batches my OG was below the expected recipe target (anywhere from .022 to .014 lower). Any ideas why this may be happening or how I can get it up where it needs to be. Below are the steps I am following.

1. Heat Water to 165 - 170 degrees.
2. Heat MLT with 2 - 3 gallons of hot water from tap. (MLT is 70 qt).
3. Drain 1.25 quarts per lbs of grain to MLT (using roughly 5 - 6 gallons).
4. Stir in grain.
5. Get temp to 152 degrees (I have been right around 150 - 152).
6. Mash for 1 hour.
7. Drain off 1 - 2 gallons and recirculate.
8. Slowly drain to brew pot.
9. Sparge with 3 - 4 gallons of water at 165 - 170 degrees.
10. Let settle for 5 minutes.
11. Drain off 1 - 2 gallons and recirculate.
12. Slowly drain to brew pot.
13. Brew as usual.

Boil has been starting with 6 - 7 gallons and finishing with 4 - 5 gallons. Any light anyone can she would be welcomed and appreciated.

Thanks in advance!
Brett

 

[Clonefan94]

First thing I would look at is your crush. That's usually the first culprit in low efficiency.

 

[GASoline71]

That and not stirring in long enough. You gotta stir the crap out of the mash initially for about 2 to 4 minutes.

Gary

 

[stevo155]

I would also say crush, but mash PH may be affecting it too. Have you 3 all grain batches been the same (or similar) grain bills?

 

[chickypad]

That and not stirring in long enough. You gotta stir the crap out of the mash initially for about 2 to 4 minutes.

Gary

In addition to this since you are batch sparging you need to really stir like crazy after adding the sparge water. No need to drain slowly, just let it flow.
Can you post a picture of your crush?

 

[blewinski]

Thanks for all the reply's, I appreciate it. As for the grain bill here is what I had.

O-Fest
Weyermann Vienna
Weyermann Dark Munich
Weyermann Caramunich I
Munton & Fison Carapils

Winter Warmer
Briess 2-Row
Briess Crystal
Munton & Fison Carapils
Munton & Fison Roasted Barley

Celebration
Briess 2-Row
Briess Crystal
Munton & Fison Carapils

Here is a pic of the grains I am using for a Chocolate Porter. They were crushed by the homebrew shop.

Thanks!
Brett

 

[Clonefan94]

Looks like you have a lot of uncrushed grains in there. Do you have your own mill? If it's from an LHBS, I'd run it through twice, see if that helps. You don't want any whole kernels that are uncracked.

After than, then as others have said, stir the crap out of it.

 

[rklinck]

It would also help to know how you got to your "expected" OG. If you are using recipes that expect fly sparging, you will undershoot when you batch sparge.

Until we know the exact recipe and your OG, we can't say whether the issue is with your process or your expectation.

 

[duboman]

Thanks for all the reply's, I appreciate it. As for the grain bill here is what I had. O-Fest Weyermann Vienna Weyermann Dark Munich Weyermann Caramunich I Munton & Fison Carapils Winter Warmer Briess 2-Row Briess Crystal Munton & Fison Carapils Munton & Fison Roasted Barley Celebration Briess 2-Row Briess Crystal Munton & Fison Carapils Here is a pic of the grains I am using for a Chocolate Porter. They were crushed by the homebrew shop. Thanks! Brett

that crush is horrible! Start by fixing that for sure

 

[Francus]

Crush for sure. Maybe look at sparge volume as well. I sparge with .5 gallon/lb of grain.

 

[duboman]

Crush for sure. Maybe look at sparge volume as well. I sparge with .5 gallon/lb of grain.

It's not so much sparge volume but mash, 1.25-1.5 qts/lb for mash and then sparge should only be the amount of water you need to hit your pre-boil volume.

In this case though crush will make a huge difference because there are a lot of whole grains in the crush posted. If I was his LHBS I would be embarrassed.....

 

[chickypad]

It would also help to know how you got to your "expected" OG. If you are using recipes that expect fly sparging, you will undershoot when you batch sparge.

I would say not necessarily, I get the same 77-79% efficiency on my two different systems one batch and one fly sparging. But the point is well taken, you need to know what the recipe effiiciency is set to with 70 to 75% being typical.

Agree with the others, that crush is horrible and likely the main issue.

 

[blewinski]

Thanks for all the feedback, it is appreciated.

I took the advice of you guys went back to the homebrew shop (don't have a mill of my own yet) and asked them to run the grain back through their mill. The employee who did it the first time was new and didn't know what they were doing I was told. After the re-milling the grains looked totally different, wish I had a picture of them.

On brew day I heated the mash water (5 gallons) to 170 degrees and stirred the crap out of the grain for about 5 minutes. When I closed the mash lid the temp was 153, right what the recipe called for. After an hour I drained and batch sparged with water heated to 170 degrees (3 gallons), again I stirred the crap out of it for 5 minutes. Then drained and brewed as usual.

Once the brew was done and cooled and took a gravity reading, it came out to be 1.064. The recipe I got called for 1.065, I was pretty stoked to see that. The recipe came with the all grain kit I got from the brewshop, it has OG and final Gravity listed on it, one of you all asked that before. My final volume was a touch over 5 gallons which was awesome too.

Thanks again to all who helped me out, I truly appreciate it!

Thanks!
Brett