OG too high?

[daphatgrant]

Hey HBT, I made two 5gal brews today, a Black IPA and a Cream Ale, both MoreBeer kits, and I was about a full. 010 high on the OG on both. I need to clarify that my hydrometer jar is MIA so I ended up using the tube that the hydrometer came in. That couldn't have changed the reading could it? I made sure that it was floating centered and not touching the walls, tested multiple times, correct temp etc.

My final volumes were right were I wanted them (aprox) 5.75gal for the Black IPA, I shot high as I'll be dry hopping and lose a little and 5.25gal for the Cream Ale. It seems that whenever I make a kit beer my OG is almost always a little high. I grind my own grain if that makes a difference.

Anyways, I don't really know what I can do about it now as my volumes are right. I guess I'll just have some stronger brews?

Thanks for any thoughts.

Black IPA was supposed to be between 1.065 and 1.07, mine was 1.076
Cream Ale was supposed to be between 1.051 and 1.055, mine was 1.065

 

[Yooper]

It's odd that both would be 0.010 high- did you check the hydrometer in plain water to make sure it reads 1.000?

 

[daphatgrant]

It's odd that both would be 0.010 high- did you check the hydrometer in plain water to make sure it reads 1.000?

Sorry, I went back and double checked, the Black IPA wasn't a full .010 higher but .060 higher than the max. Checking the hydrometer in water now.

 

[camonick]

BIAB or multi vessel? I BIAB and when I plug the MoreBeer ingredients into beersmith, with my equipment profile, it always shows a high estimated OG. My system is more efficient than what the recipe is designed for. I just back off a little base malt to make it the same as their brew sheet or leave it as is for a stronger version like you’ve ended up with.

 

[daphatgrant]

It's odd that both would be 0.010 high- did you check the hydrometer in plain water to make sure it reads 1.000?

Hydrometer with just water is reading 1.002 so it appears it's a little off. Thanks for that! I should have been able to come up with the water test on my own.

BIAB or multi vessel? I BIAB and when I plug the MoreBeer ingredients into beersmith, with my equipment profile, it always shows a high estimated OG. My system is more efficient than what the recipe is designed for. I just back off a little base malt to make it the same as their brew sheet or leave it as is for a stronger version like you’ve ended up with.

Multi-vessel/all grain/self milled and I've had the same experience with them always being at least somewhat higher than expected. Good to hear that someone is having the same or similar results.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

Perhaps your mash efficiency is higher than what Morebeer expects.

Can you provide the grain bill (types and pounds)?

Also, do you know the preboil volume and gravity?

Assuming by final volume you mean what is in the kettle after boiling, then based on the data you provided you collected...

Cream ale - 341 points
Black IPA - 437 points

 

[daphatgrant]

Perhaps your mash efficiency is higher than what Morebeer expects.

Can you provide the grain bill (types and pounds)?

Also, do you know the preboil volume and gravity?

Assuming by final volume you mean what is in the kettle after boiling, then based on the data you provided you collected...

Cream ale - 341 points
Black IPA - 437 points

I don't have the preboil gravity, I have the rest though. And by final volume I was referring what I was able to put in the fermenter, the kettle was essentially empty so pretty much the same thing I guess. I'm thinking that my efficiency is just higher than MoreBeer expects, can't complain if that's the reasoning .

Black IPA - 13# 2 Row Pale, 12oz Crystal 60L, 8oz Carafa Special II, 8oz Pale Chocolate, 8oz Victory, Preboil volume 8gal.
Cream Ale - 5# 2 Row Pale, 5# Pilsner, 1# Flake Corn, 8oz Corn Sugar 5min left in boil. Preboil volume 7.25gal

I lost some of the wort to the hop bag in the IPA and may have had the heat cranked a little higher as well. The Cream Ale kept foaming up so I had the heat a little lower.

 

[bracconiere]

man you made me work, lol

for the cream ale:

i get 1.056 at 75% effec in beersmith, and at 85% effec i get what you got...and i usually pull around 88% with a two step mash, and 83% with single. so totaly belivable.

most people pull about 75%, consider yourself one of the proud and few.

 

[VikeMan]

It seems that whenever I make a kit beer my OG is almost always a little high.

What about when you don't make a kit beer? If your OG is where you expect it for non-kit beers (i.e. where you are weighing your grains), but always high for kit beers, then there are probably two things going on. First, your mash efficiency is higher than what you have told your software it is. And second, the scale you use to measure your (non-kit) grains is off (measuring high, thus you're using less grains, effectively offsetting the delta in efficiency).

Another possibility (less likely) is that your scale is fine, and your efficiency is what you told your software, but your kit manufacturer is providing too much grain.

 

[daphatgrant]

What about when you don't make a kit beer? If your OG is where you expect it for non-kit beers (i.e. where you are weighing your grains), but always high for kit beers, then there are probably two things going on. First, your mash efficiency is higher than what you have told your software it is. And second, the scale you use to measure your (non-kit) grains is off (measuring high, thus you're using less grains, effectively offsetting the delta in efficiency).

Another possibility (less likely) is that your scale is fine, and your efficiency is what you told your software, but your kit manufacturer is providing too much grain.

Non beer kit recipes (only tried a few) are usually pretty close to the OG that was intended, maybe slightly higher, I've never missed my OG. Other than ciders that I've made I'm pretty sure all of my OG's were at least a few points above the target OG or range. I bought beersmith a while ago but haven't learned to use it yet, I've pretty much been winging it and just trying to get the process down. It sounds like it might be time to sit down and take a deep dive into learning how beersmith works.

 

[Holden Caulfield]

I looked up what efficiency MoreBeer targets for their kits and what I read was 70%.

Dropping the black IPA recipe into my beer recipe builder and setting the system values to...

5.75 post boil kettle volume
1.065 target OG
70% efficiency

Then building the recipe with the same percentages, I ended up with exactly the number of pounds MoreBeer says they provided you with (my program generates pounds from beer target and system inputs) - go figure. Below is the snapshot of the brew day worksheet. Note the green ovals around the efficiency, kettle volume, pounds, and OG.

I typically obtain >82% efficiency in my cooler/modified batch sparge process. After updating the efficiency to 82% and the target OG to what you realized (snapshot below), I end up with exactly the same pounds.

Based on this, I would say that the cause of exceeding your target OG is MoreBeer's conservative efficiency number - kudos to them for providing more than enough grain to hit your target (you can always pour off points, it is more difficult to add them). In other words, your tools and measurement are correct, your mash efficiency is just better than the recipe planner's expectation.

Going forward, If you want to hit your target, you can check your preboil volume and gravity and pour off extra point. Just add back the same volume of water.

 

[VikeMan]

I bought beersmith a while ago but haven't learned to use it yet, I've pretty much been winging it and just trying to get the process down. It sounds like it might be time to sit down and take a deep dive into learning how beersmith works.

If you're not actually using the software, where is your expectation for the OG coming from? If it's coming from the kit instructions, it will be wrong (too high or too low) for most brewers. I'd recommend boning up on mash efficiency. Here's a primer:
http://sonsofalchemy.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/04/Mash_Efficiency_and_Brewhouse_Efficiency.pdf