NZ IPA Critique Needed

[scallopking]

Hey everyone. I could use some of the good feedback from you folks on this recipe. Haven't used these hops before. Does this look like it would turn out good, especially the hops and schedule? I also have on hand Rakau too if you think I should swap something but want to keep it all NZ.

Thanks for the help!!

IBU - 56
Color - 5.5
ABV - 6.1

12 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 84.8 %
1 lbs 4.0 oz Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 8.8 %
10.4 oz Acid Malt (3.0 SRM) Grain 4.6 %
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 30L (30.0 SRM) Grain 1.8 %

1.00 oz Waimea [17.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 23.0 IBUs
5.00 oz Kohatu [6.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 180 30 min Hop 33.0 IBUs
6.00 oz Wai-iti [3.00 %] - Dry Hop 4.0 Days Hop 0.0 IBUs

1.0 pkg California Ale V (White Labs #WLP051) [35.49 ml] Yeast

 

[Build]

It looks very very good. A huge flavor blast from all the late addition. I've had beers with those three hops and they were like nothing else I've tasted. I haven't brewed with them, but plan on it when the fresh crop is in.

Let us know how it turns out. Looks like a winner to me.

 

[Electrake]

so your only boil addition is the 1oz at 15min?

 

[scallopking]

so your only boil addition is the 1oz at 15min?

I think so, I heard a few things about Waimea that pushed me to use only one bittering addition late in the boil. Thoughts?

 

[scallopking]

It looks very very good. A huge flavor blast from all the late addition. I've had beers with those three hops and they were like nothing else I've tasted. I haven't brewed with them, but plan on it when the fresh crop is in.

Let us know how it turns out. Looks like a winner to me.

thank you!! i haven't any beers with these hops so really excited to try this. i reworked this recipe a few times now and ended up here. The amount of kohatu and wai-iti scared me a little!

 

[Electrake]

I think so, I heard a few things about Waimea that pushed me to use only one bittering addition late in the boil. Thoughts?

I dont have any personal experience either with these hops or not adding a 60 min addition, it never even occured to me to try this! I've ventured into FWH and a few other practices of adding hops early on, but I'd be curious to know how this turns out for you.

I do feel that you would have to add an unnecessary amount of hops to get the same bitterness you would get at an early addition... However, I feel the flavors would more than make up for it :rockin:

Beersmith is my savior, if it says it'll work, it'll work

 

[Shade]

The comments I've seen around here suggest you don't get huge utilization in hopstands so 33IBUs from that bit might be optimistic. Some folks plug in 1% utilization for that bit. You may want to consider increasing boil hops to ensure your bitterness is right.

Interesting hop choice. They aren't as high profile at Nelson Sauvin, Riwaka and Motueka, be interesting to hear how they go.

 

[WesM63]

At 180F you'll get some Isomerization (bitterness) but at a much reduced rate (~10% utilization). I don't think the current version of beersmith calculates hop stand/whirlpool correctly.

Personally, I would either add a small 60min/FW charge or increase up your 15min addition. (My last ipa was 60 IBU. 17 IBU at FW and 43 at 20min, from what I can tell, it's close to 60 IBU)

 

[scallopking]

I dont have any personal experience either with these hops or not adding a 60 min addition, it never even occured to me to try this! I've ventured into FWH and a few other practices of adding hops early on, but I'd be curious to know how this turns out for you.

I do feel that you would have to add an unnecessary amount of hops to get the same bitterness you would get at an early addition... However, I feel the flavors would more than make up for it :rockin:

Beersmith is my savior, if it says it'll work, it'll work

Thanks. I've made a couple IPA lately with a very late bitter addition with high alpha hops and turned out good so trying it again.

 

[scallopking]

The comments I've seen around here suggest you don't get huge utilization in hopstands so 33IBUs from that bit might be optimistic. Some folks plug in 1% utilization for that bit. You may want to consider increasing boil hops to ensure your bitterness is right.

Interesting hop choice. They aren't as high profile at Nelson Sauvin, Riwaka and Motueka, be interesting to hear how they go.

Maybe I'll move the 15 up early then at 30 or 45. I have a very nice IPA recipe with Nelson and I love me some Nelson hops but want something different. Yeah, I'll let you know. Brewing it today maybe.

 

[scallopking]

At 180F you'll get some Isomerization (bitterness) but at a much reduced rate (~10% utilization). I don't think the current version of beersmith calculates hop stand/whirlpool correctly.

Personally, I would either add a small 60min/FW charge or increase up your 15min addition. (My last ipa was 60 IBU. 17 IBU at FW and 43 at 20min, from what I can tell, it's close to 60 IBU)

Thanks for the input. I'm thinking now I'll adjust and move it earlier to boil it longer. I think that would work. I'm scared of using too much Waimea.

 

[crusader1612]

Thanks for the input. I'm thinking now I'll adjust and move it earlier to boil it longer. I think that would work. I'm scared of using too much Waimea.

I wouldnt be concerned with too much waimea.
the only part that concerns me is your 6oz dryhop! thats quite alot, i realise ti AA of these hops is low, but the oil content in wai-iti is quite high, almost riwaka like. i'd drop it back a touch, as nz hops gets real grassy real quick.

 

[scallopking]

I wouldnt be concerned with too much waimea.
the only part that concerns me is your 6oz dryhop! thats quite alot, i realise ti AA of these hops is low, but the oil content in wai-iti is quite high, almost riwaka like. i'd drop it back a touch, as nz hops gets real grassy real quick.

thanks, I didn't realize that. Maybe I'll go with a 3-4oz dry hop then. good thing I didn't make it yesterday but wouldn't dry hop anyway at this point.

 

[stru]

thanks, I didn't realize that. Maybe I'll go with a 3-4oz dry hop then. good thing I didn't make it yesterday but wouldn't dry hop anyway at this point.

Honestly, I like the 6 oz dry hop, but I'd split it. 3 oz 3 days into fermentation, 3 oz 7 days before packaging.

I'd also like to see 10-15 ibu at 60 minutes and wyeast 1318 as your yeast of choice, but it's not my beer! Hahaha!

Let us know how it turns out.

 

[scallopking]

Honestly, I like the 6 oz dry hop, but I'd split it. 3 oz 3 days into fermentation, 3 oz 7 days before packaging.

I'd also like to see 10-15 ibu at 60 minutes and wyeast 1318 as your yeast of choice, but it's not my beer! Hahaha!

Let us know how it turns out.

thanks....why the wyeast 1318, I've never used that before? I never have done a double dry hop either- interesting idea.

 

[stru]

thanks....why the wyeast 1318, I've never used that before? I never have done a double dry hop either- interesting idea.

On the surface it seems like a strange choice for an ipa, but it lends itself perfectly to hop forward beers. If you care at all about clear beer, don't use it! It doesn't flocculate very well.

I double dry hop all of my hoppy beers. The first dry hop, which allows the hop oils to mingle with the yeast, gives you multiple layers of hop flavor. If you are dropping the dry hop addition to 3oz i would keep your normal schedule, but if you are staying with 6oz I would split it.

 

[crusader1612]

Honestly, I like the 6 oz dry hop, but I'd split it. 3 oz 3 days into fermentation, 3 oz 7 days before packaging.

I'd also like to see 10-15 ibu at 60 minutes and wyeast 1318 as your yeast of choice, but it's not my beer! Hahaha!

Let us know how it turns out.

I've not used the yeast, but heard good things for hoppy styles.

the reason I suggest lowering the Dryhop is the OP looks to be doing it in one, but halving and dryhopping twice is certainly an topnion, but shorten the timings to 3 days a piece.

 

[scallopking]

Here's the new recipe!

11 lbs Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 1 80.9 %
1 lbs 12.0 oz Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 2 12.9 %
9.6 oz Acid Malt (3.0 SRM) Grain 3 4.4 %
4.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 30L (30.0 SRM) Grain 4 1.8 %

0.40 oz Waimea [17.50 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 5 18.2 IBUs
0.60 oz Waimea [17.50 %] - Boil 15.0 min Hop 6 13.5 IBUs
4.00 oz Kohatu [6.50 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 30.0 min Hop 7 25.9 IBUs

1.0 pkg American Ale (Wyeast Labs #1056) [124.21 ml] Yeast 8 -

3.00 oz Wai-iti [3.00 %] - Dry Hop 4.0 Days Hop 9 0.0 IBUs (I'll put this in a bag and remove it at 4 days)
3.00 oz Wai-iti [3.00 %] - Dry Hop 3.0 Days Hop 10 0.0 IBUs

IBU - 58
SRM - 5.7
ABV - 6.4

Let me know what y'all think. Thanks again!

 

[jjeffers09]

Motueka Is a nice citrusy hop that would go well with Waimea. Kohatu is a little too dank for me for a WP hop. Plus the lemon peel motueka and spicyness would complement the Wai-iti

 

[scallopking]

good to know, thanks....maybe next time since I don't have any motueka on hand - try to use some of this up first.