New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[grassfeeder]

I've brewed many successful NEIPA's in the past but I'm looking to change things up a little bit. I want see what effect raising the level of flaked oats has and dropping a bit of the wheat out. Traditionally I have done equal amounts that add to no greater than 20% of the total grain bill. Any thoughts on how that may change the mouthfeel, appearance or texture of the beer? Here is the recipe I'm looking at doing:

Brew Method: All Grain
Style Name: American IPA
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 5.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 7.5 gallons
Boil Gravity: 1.045
Efficiency: 83% (brew house)


STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.062
Final Gravity: 1.014
ABV (standard): 6.22%
IBU (tinseth): 32.77
SRM (morey): 3.72

FERMENTABLES:
7 lb - American - Pale 2-Row (63.9%)
2 lb - Flaked Oats (18.3%)
1 lb - American - White Wheat (9.1%)
0.5 lb - Corn Sugar - Dextrose (4.6%)
0.45 lb - American - Carapils (Dextrine Malt) (4.1%)

HOPS:
0.55 oz - Columbus, First Wort,
1.5 oz - Citra, Whirlpool for 30 min at 165 °F
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Whirlpool for 30 min at 165 °F
1.5 oz - Azacca, Whirlpool for 30 min at °F
2.5 oz - Citra, Dry Hop for 3 days
2.5 oz - Mosaic, Dry Hop for 3 days
2.5 oz - Azacca, Dry Hop for 3 days

MASH GUIDELINES:
1) Infusion, Temp: 152 F, Time: 60 min
2) Sparge, Temp: 170 F, Time: 15 min
Starting Mash Thickness: 1.25 qt/lb

YEAST:
Imperial Yeast - A38 Juice
Starter: No
Form: Liquid
Attenuation (avg): 74%
Flocculation: Low
Optimum Temp: 67 - 80 F
Fermentation Temp: 66 F & Ramp to 72 F

 

[leesmith]

I've brewed many successful NEIPA's in the past but I'm looking to change things up a little bit. I want see what effect raising the level of flaked oats has and dropping a bit of the wheat out. Traditionally I have done equal amounts that add to no greater than 20% of the total grain bill. Any thoughts on how that may change the mouthfeel, appearance or texture of the beer? Here is the recipe I'm looking at doing:

Brew Method: All Grain
Style Name: American IPA
Boil Time: 60 min
Batch Size: 5.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
Boil Size: 7.5 gallons
Boil Gravity: 1.045
Efficiency: 83% (brew house)


STATS:
Original Gravity: 1.062
Final Gravity: 1.014
ABV (standard): 6.22%
IBU (tinseth): 32.77
SRM (morey): 3.72

FERMENTABLES:
7 lb - American - Pale 2-Row (63.9%)
2 lb - Flaked Oats (18.3%)
1 lb - American - White Wheat (9.1%)
0.5 lb - Corn Sugar - Dextrose (4.6%)
0.45 lb - American - Carapils (Dextrine Malt) (4.1%)

HOPS:
0.55 oz - Columbus, First Wort,
1.5 oz - Citra, Whirlpool for 30 min at 165 °F
1.5 oz - Mosaic, Whirlpool for 30 min at 165 °F
1.5 oz - Azacca, Whirlpool for 30 min at °F
2.5 oz - Citra, Dry Hop for 3 days
2.5 oz - Mosaic, Dry Hop for 3 days
2.5 oz - Azacca, Dry Hop for 3 days

MASH GUIDELINES:
1) Infusion, Temp: 152 F, Time: 60 min
2) Sparge, Temp: 170 F, Time: 15 min
Starting Mash Thickness: 1.25 qt/lb

YEAST:
Imperial Yeast - A38 Juice
Starter: No
Form: Liquid
Attenuation (avg): 74%
Flocculation: Low
Optimum Temp: 67 - 80 F
Fermentation Temp: 66 F & Ramp to 72 F

Just use 20% of the oats and take the sugar out, the wheat out and the carapils out.

Then you'll know for yourself what it's really contributing.

I get a sweetness (unique to oats that I can't quite place but it's cloying to me) from a high use of oats (actually not a fan) and it softens the mouthfeel...obviously your adding more protein so the haze may be more opaque and last longer.

 

[grassfeeder]

Just use 20% of the oats and take the sugar out, the wheat out and the carapils out.

Then you'll know for yourself what it's really contributing.

I get a sweetness (unique to oats that I can't quite place but it's cloying to me) from a high use of oats (actually not a fan) and it softens the mouthfeel...obviously your adding more protein so the haze may be more opaque and last longer.

Interesting about the sweetness from a higher usage of Oats, don't know if I've ever heard that one before honestly. As far as haze. I've never had haze drop out before. Longest a keg has ever lasted was about 2.5 months (I was away for work) and came back it was still pouring strong.

 

[leesmith]

Interesting about the sweetness from a higher usage of Oats, don't know if I've ever heard that one before honestly. As far as haze. I've never had haze drop out before. Longest a keg has ever lasted was about 2.5 months (I was away for work) and came back it was still pouring strong.

Yeah maybe it's me. I just haven't preferred the beers I've used flaked oats in as much. Even the Saisons I've made with it and those get real dry. Could be my process or I confuse the body they give with sweetness. I use white wheat all the time and enjoy it.


There's a great article by Scott Janish about using oats:

http://scottjanish.com/case-brewing-oats/

Edit: It is a flavor thing for me though...like a artificial sweetener taste that lingers from the finish of the beer that I get. It's very subtle but I've tasted it in Tired Hands Hop Hands (I know it's just malted oats) and a hoppy beer from Hill Farmstead that used oats in it...one of the Grassroots Beers I think.

 

[Beerdrinker85]

I did this exact same recipe 3 weeks ago. Kegged it last Saturday and I must say that this is my best recipe for an NEIPA.
I went with 113 Sulfate and 171 Chloride. My next water profile will be the one from your updated post:

Ca = 100
Mg = 5
Na = 13
Sulfate = 147
Chloride = 80
Bicarbonate = 16

Look at this wonderful perfect color.

Cheers and thanks for the recipe.

This keg is about to be kicked... It was so good that I am gonna brew this exact grainbill recipe again but I have 3 oz of Nelson Sauvin that is waiting to be used.
I never used Nelson Sauvin before what do you think about Citra/Mosaic/Nelson Sauvin ???

 

[crusader1612]

This keg is about to be kicked... It was so good that I am gonna brew this exact grainbill recipe again but I have 3 oz of Nelson Sauvin that is waiting to be used.

I never used Nelson Sauvin before what do you think about Citra/Mosaic/Nelson Sauvin ???

If you've got galaxy. Make it a 4way.
Nelson works well. IMO

 

[Braufessor]

Some good information and basic considerations:
https://areamanthinks.wordpress.com/2017/06/10/from-the-homebrewing-files-new-england-ipa-tips/

 

[jammin]

Some good information and basic considerations:
https://areamanthinks.wordpress.com/2017/06/10/from-the-homebrewing-files-new-england-ipa-tips/

Solid but they lead all their good points with suggesting a 5 minute addition stating it will yield low bitterness. I strongly disagree with this and highly advise against it. Save those hops for the dry hop for this style. Actual IBU's would be way higher than anything I like to target (30-35 IBU's) assuming you use a controlled 60min addition already.

I also think that 30min is way overkill for a whirlpool @ 170* and actually detrimental to the desired hop chararistics. Volatile compounds dissolve & aromatize quickly. I get great results in as little as 10min with pellets starting @ 160*.

 

[Ashevillain]

X331 Experimental hop NE SMASH Pale Ale. This hop puts out super fruity and dank notes at the same time, its kind of like a mix of simcoe and citra. Lots of tangerine and passion fruit. I noticed that before the 2nd dry hopping it was much more fruit forward so next time i may take it easy on the quantity! A whole LB went into this one...

Briess 2-Row Malt
X331 Hops
London ale III Yeast

Want to try with pilsner malt and maybe some flaked oats or wheat. Also, does anyone think that this style tastes better with say WLP001? I am curious to hear yeast alternatives that are a bit more thirst quenching if that makes sense. I mean ripe fruit is great but 1318 can be a bit cloying IMO.

 

[stickyfinger]

Some good information and basic considerations:
https://areamanthinks.wordpress.com/2017/06/10/from-the-homebrewing-files-new-england-ipa-tips/

interesting about the "burning throat" character. i've had that in some of my super murky neipas. it doesn't seem to be a problem in some other styles though, such as saison and belgian golden strong ale, where the murkiness from yeast actually makes the beer taste good to me with now burning character. i wonder if it isn't more of super-high level of some hop particulates that creates the burn?

 

[Torrefaction]

I think the hop pellet particles cause the burn. A non-floccing yeast + oats + no finings + a pound of hops = burning hop dust in suspension (chew a raw hop pellet! you'll see), which subsides with time...

 

[Projectfdw]

X331 Experimental hop NE SMASH Pale Ale. This hop puts out super fruity and dank notes at the same time, its kind of like a mix of simcoe and citra. Lots of tangerine and passion fruit. I noticed that before the 2nd dry hopping it was much more fruit forward so next time i may take it easy on the quantity! A whole LB went into this one...

Briess 2-Row Malt
X331 Hops
London ale III Yeast

Want to try with pilsner malt and maybe some flaked oats or wheat. Also, does anyone think that this style tastes better with say WLP001? I am curious to hear yeast alternatives that are a bit more thirst quenching if that makes sense. I mean ripe fruit is great but 1318 can be a bit cloying IMO.

Where did you get the x331?

 

[crusader1612]

Anyone seen alesoftheriverwards post about oat milk. Anyone got thoughts on it??

 

[Ashevillain]

Where did you get the x331?

http://www.farmhousebrewingsupply.com/

nestar:nestar:nestar:nestar:nestar:
Currently sold out, try to check in about once a week. I had to wait like 2 months.

Would blend with something that offers a just a little pine/resin/grapefruit like cascade, but does great on its own. I might try a cleaner pale ale or hoppy pilsner with 1/4 the x331 hops next time to see if i can make it less heavy. This strain is seriously stone fruit and melon juicy even in small amounts, and can get verrry dank in large amounts. Will be a really big name if it can make it to the point of getting named.

 

[jerbrew]

Got my first solid pour from my first NEIPA today. Tastes great looks amazing. Used this thread for a lot of inspiration.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1497201666.668373.jpg

 

[Ashevillain]

That looks pretty tasty right der.

 

[JohnConnor]

Solid but they lead all their good points with suggesting a 5 minute addition stating it will yield low bitterness. I strongly disagree with this and highly advise against it. Save those hops for the dry hop for this style. Actual IBU's would be way higher than anything I like to target (30-35 IBU's) assuming you use a controlled 60min addition already.

I also think that 30min is way overkill for a whirlpool @ 170* and actually detrimental to the desired hop chararistics. Volatile compounds dissolve & aromatize quickly. I get great results in as little as 10min with pellets starting @ 160*.

In combination with a bittering hop I agree. I've been running some hop bursting 15 - FO w/o a bittering hop and love it. The bitter is super smooth and just enough to balance the hop juice.

 

[Oldskewl]

Anyone seen alesoftheriverwards post about oat milk. Anyone got thoughts on it??

Not sure how different it is than adding oats to the mash. Cooler temp is really the only difference. More of a steep than a mash I guess.

 

[bolus14]

I am curious to hear yeast alternatives that are a bit more thirst quenching if that makes sense. I mean ripe fruit is great but 1318 can be a bit cloying IMO.

I have been using WY1272 in quite a few styles and liking it lately. Stouts/porters, a couple ambers, and 3 DIPA's (one more NEIPA like). If you have some wheat/oats in the grain bill and add the hops with 4-5 points left in fermentation it finishes cloudy, nice mouthfeel, and not overly fruity/sweet. I didn't start using the 1272 until I was on generation 3 of harvesting so using it right from a smack pack I don't know how it will be.

 

[crusader1612]

Not sure how different it is than adding oats to the mash. Cooler temp is really the only difference. More of a steep than a mash I guess.

True, although its definitely a slightly different take on the whole oats in beer craze thats going on. Having had oat milk recently, i can tell you its quite a potent flavour contribution, so it'd be interestingto see what sort of flavour it contributes.

interesting also, that he add 10% malted oats to the mash as well.

 

[DefinitelyJon]

Latest NEIPAView attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1497308480.907029.jpg

 

[DefinitelyJon]

W/ Citra N El Dorado

 

[Ashevillain]

What does the el dorado bring to the table? I've had limited experience brewing with it.

 

[Ashevillain]

I have been using WY1272 in quite a few styles and liking it lately. Stouts/porters, a couple ambers, and 3 DIPA's (one more NEIPA like). If you have some wheat/oats in the grain bill and add the hops with 4-5 points left in fermentation it finishes cloudy, nice mouthfeel, and not overly fruity/sweet. I didn't start using the 1272 until I was on generation 3 of harvesting so using it right from a smack pack I don't know how it will be.

Thanks I will definitely be trying WY1272 and will get back on this thread. WLP001 is my favorite so far but it just didn't seem especially suited to the style.

Also regarding the post i saw above about hopping 15 - FO to give a smooth bitterness to balance the juices, spot on. For 5gal I think you need to add an ounce or more of a high AA% hop around 10mins. The X331 I posted was the 3rd in a series of 3 SMASH pale ales and the first two I brewed consecutively with no boil additions or whirlpool additions above 170. I thought it was going to be great but I now feel there is something to be said about a balance of isomerized alpha acids in almost any style.

The X331 I hopped with 1.5oz over the last 15mins and it was much more balanced.

 

[RevKev]

Just added 4oz dry hops. Plan on kegging this Thursday hopefully

 

[RevKev]

Bc people like pictures

View attachment 1497313198779.jpg

 

[isomerization]

What does the el dorado bring to the table? I've had limited experience brewing with it.

I just made a mango milkshake DIPA with Citra, Galaxy and El Dorado. Very pronounced candied tropical fruit flavor and aroma.

 

[BrewinSoldier]

I just made a mango milkshake DIPA with Citra, Galaxy and El Dorado. Very pronounced candied tropical fruit flavor and aroma.

That looks pretty darn good. What yeast did you use? What was your final gravity? I think all of mine so far have just been lacking that sweetness from the malt. Going to try to mash higher next time to see if it helps.

 

[JohnConnor]

Bc people like pictures

Morning shots of hops. That's a true man right there!

 

[Ashevillain]

I keep hearing words candy and el dorado in parallel... I need to give el dorado another go. Man, i've been on all these Kolshes and Milds lately but I think its time for more hops!