New England IPA "Northeast" style IPA

[Braufessor]

Hello M.Braufessor,

First off all thanks for sharing your wonderfull recipe and tips. Thanks to you i've started to play with my water profile now.

I got 2 questions;

1- How do you like your recipe around 6%

2-Let's say you want to boost your recipe to make a DIPA range of 8%, what would the recipe look like.?

I like it quite a bit with a bit higher abv. in the 6% range.... probably better than when it is in the 5% range. The extra body improves it. Still not real high on abv. though either.

If I was going to do a DIPA..... I think I would just up 95% of everything to get close to desired abv. so.... say.....
*40% 2 Row
*40% Golden Promise
*15% Flaked Grains/Wheat

And, then I would throw in a pound or 5%(ish) of corn sugar to get to that final 8% abv.

I would bitter a bit more.... maybe 50ibu's of Warrior at 60. Then probably keep all the other hop additions the same or close. Perhaps around 25 ibu's centennial at 30 minutes if you wanted more bitterness.

 

[EndOfLine]

Did you notice a clarity difference in the high sulfate beer? You suggested previously that there could be.

 

[Braufessor]

Question -
I made Hophands clone recently. and was looking to increase the gravity a bit to more IPA territory.... and use more classic IPA type hops....
my thoughts were this.
80%Pils
10%flaked Oats
10%Malted Oats
Mash at 151-152F
OG around 1060

FWH15g Chinook
60min 15g Chinook
5min 50g Chinook
0min 50g Cascade
0min 50g Centennial

Dryhop - 50g each Cascade and Centennial.

Thoughts?
WY1318 yeast btw

I have not done one like that, but would be curious as to your results. Looks like a good recipe though.

 

[ThatVideoKid]

I like it quite a bit with a bit higher abv. in the 6% range.... probably better than when it is in the 5% range. The extra body improves it. Still not real high on abv. though either.



If I was going to do a DIPA..... I think I would just up 95% of everything to get close to desired abv. so.... say.....

*40% 2 Row

*40% Golden Promise

*15% Flaked Grains/Wheat



And, then I would throw in a pound or 5%(ish) of corn sugar to get to that final 8%.



I would bitter a bit more.... maybe 50ibu's of Warrior at 60. Then probably keep all the other hop additions the same or close. Perhaps around 25 ibu's centennial at 30 minutes if you wanted more bitterness.

Yeah Trillium always uses a simple sugar to bring theirs to the double IPA. Keeps the body at the right place. They use either honey or grape juice

 

[Braufessor]

Did you notice a clarity difference in the high sulfate beer? You suggested previously that there could be.

None - absolutely the same as higher chloride. I do not think chloride has anything to do with haziness of these beers.

 

[rappinduke]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1470956236.803750.jpg

Here is my latest attempt. Been spending most of my brewing time playing around with this style. Been mostly just brewing IPAs and pales. This is more of a pale ale I guess. Malt bill is pretty much a clone recipe I found for trilliums Fort Point pale ale. For hops I used Citra, El Dorado and Columbus. These hops work very well together. Came in around 5.2 % perfect for this hot weather. I have pretty much been trying a different yeast each time. I used 007 for this one and really like it. I've tried American ale yeast strains in these beers and definitely prefer an English strain. Will probably stick with 007 or 1318 going forward. It's really been a lot of fun playing with different hops and yeasts brewing these beers. Still got loads of hops combos I can't wait to try. Better get brewing. Cheers.

 

[Braufessor]

View attachment 365930

Here is my latest attempt. Been spending most of my brewing time playing around with this style. Been mostly just brewing IPAs and pales. This is more of a pale ale I guess. Malt bill is pretty much a clone recipe I found for trilliums Fort Point pale ale. For hops I used Citra, El Dorado and Columbus. These hops work very well together. Came in around 5.2 % perfect for this hot weather. I have pretty much been trying a different yeast each time. I used 007 for this one and really like it. I've tried American ale yeast strains in these beers and definitely prefer an English strain. Will probably stick with 007 or 1318 going forward. It's really been a lot of fun playing with different hops and yeasts brewing these beers. Still got loads of hops combos I can't wait to try. Better get brewing. Cheers.

This is a great example of the contribution of yeast to haze..... it does not need to contribute at all. 007 drops like a rock and produces crystal clear beer easily. I think this is a good example that the "haze" is not reliant on yeast as much as it depends on dry hopping and pH.

 

[rappinduke]

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1470962223.786370.jpg

Exactly. This beer I used 1272. I find that no matter what yeast I use I still get a hazy beer. I think it's mostly the hop oil and flaked ingredients that give the beer the haze. Regardless of the yeast I get very similar results. I do like the esters the English strains give the beer compared to the American strains though.

 

[Braufessor]

View attachment 365940

Exactly. This beer I used 1272. I find that no matter what yeast I use I still get a hazy beer. I think it's mostly the hop oil and flaked ingredients that give the beer the haze. Regardless of the yeast I get very similar results. I do like the esters the English strains give the beer compared to the American strains though.

I have one going with 1272 also.... dry hop keg tomorrow for it I think.

 

[rappinduke]

Be cool to see how yours turns out. Definitely not a bad yeast. Produces a nice clean beer. Just felt like it was missing something that I like in this style of beer.

 

[Braufessor]

Be cool to see how yours turns out. Definitely not a bad yeast. Produces a nice clean beer. Just felt like it was missing something that I like in this style of beer.

Will let you know soon enough. Every once in a while I like to try a different yeast and run it through all my base beers..... I got a pack of 1272 a couple weeks ago and brewed my Blonde. Harvested yeast from it and have brewed my IPA, Amber and Brown Ale with it - all getting kegged in the next week. Going to brew another IPA and a Porter with it as well this week. Eager to see how they all turn out.

 

[g-star]

This is a great example of the contribution of yeast to haze..... it does not need to contribute at all. 007 drops like a rock and produces crystal clear beer easily. I think this is a good example that the "haze" is not reliant on yeast as much as it depends on dry hopping and pH.

Have to disagree with you here. Yeast certainly plays a role to some degree…we know Conan and 1318 are low flocculators, but the primary drivers I think are high levels of protein from wheat and/or other flaked grains in combination with heavy whirlpooling/dry hopping.

Chemically, I don’t understand your comments about pH. We are talking about differences ultimately in the 0.2 – 0.4 pH unit range near a target of pH 4.5. That will not be enough to move the needle in terms of protonation/de-protonation of the suspended hop polyphenols (pKa values near 9-10), which in turn lead to the electrostatic interactions with all of those proteins, and ultimately suspension in solution causing haze. I agree; however, that final beer pH will affect flavor perception…just not appearance.

 

[Braufessor]

Have to disagree with you here. Yeast certainly plays a role to some degree…we know Conan and 1318 are low flocculators, but the primary drivers I think are high levels of protein from wheat and/or other flaked grains in combination with heavy whirlpooling/dry hopping.

Chemically, I don’t understand your comments about pH. We are talking about differences ultimately in the 0.2 – 0.4 pH unit range near a target of pH 4.5. That will not be enough to move the needle in terms of protonation/de-protonation of the suspended hop polyphenols (pKa values near 9-10), which in turn lead to the electrostatic interactions with all of those proteins, and ultimately suspension in solution causing haze. I agree; however, that final beer pH will affect flavor perception…just not appearance.

I don't know. I use Conan 40-50 times a year. It drops clear as a glass in my blonde ale.... It is clear coming out of the fermenter with no cold crash and no fining. After a week kegged/in the fridge it is brilliantly clear. Yeasts like 1056, 007, 1272..... they all produce very clear beers..... but, when taken through a beer like this, the beer is quite hazy - but not "murky" with lots of yeast in suspension.

I don't think you need lots of yeast in suspension to make these beers and make them well. To be honest, the "yeastier" the beers are, the less I tend to like them. Some of the commercial examples I see that are murky/yeasty/milky..... I just don't think that is what the well brewed versions of this are all about. I sense people sometimes get caught up in chasing a yeast like 1318 because "you need it to make the beer hazy/cloudy." I think seeing a hazy beer that used 007 is a perfect example of that not being the case...... "Haze" comes from things beyond just having lots of yeast left in your beer. "Murky" generally comes from yeast. Often, when beers like this fail, it is because they end up overly "yeasty" as opposed to simply being hazy.

I can't tell you the chemistry behind the pH..... but, I can tell you my personal experience says 1-2 tenths of a pH on finished beer pH does seem to make a difference. I think Brulosopher's recent experiment (even though he was testing something a bit different) shows a similar thing.... If you scroll down in the experiment, look at the two beers when he measured final pH..... 4.39 vs. 4.50. The 4.50 has significant haze in it. The 4.39 is clear. I notice the same type of thing in my beers as well.
http://brulosophy.com/2016/08/08/water-chemistry-pt-5-boil-ph-in-an-ipa-exbeeriment-results/

Not to say there is no yeast left in suspension at all with conan, or other yeast.... I just don't think it is the significant player it is made to be sometimes. I also wonder if that higher pH locks up protein/hop oil/polyphenol along with holding some yeast in suspension????

 

[vance]

Braufessor, have you ever tried Motueka in this recipe? I'm thinking of doing a single hop batch for ****s and giggles... what does the recipe in the original post come out to ABV wise?

 

[grassfeeder]

Braufessor, have you ever tried Motueka in this recipe? I'm thinking of doing a single hop batch for ****s and giggles... what does the recipe in the original post come out to ABV wise?

I used Motueka in my last batch. Love it. Combined with Mosaic and El Dorado.

 

[Braufessor]

Braufessor, have you ever tried Motueka in this recipe? I'm thinking of doing a single hop batch for ****s and giggles... what does the recipe in the original post come out to ABV wise?

OP comes in around 1.050-1.053 kind of range.... but, that is with 84% mash efficiency, so need to adjust that your system. That comes in around 5.3% (ish) abv. I have been bumping it up to about 1.060 recently have have liked that. - coming in around 6% or a so.

I have not used Motueka.

 

[vance]

OP comes in around 1.050-1.053 kind of range.... but, that is with 84% mash efficiency, so need to adjust that your system. That comes in around 5.3% (ish) abv. I have been bumping it up to about 1.060 recently have have liked that. - coming in around 6% or a so.

I have not used Motueka.

Hmm, I'll probably have to adjust the grain amounts then. Not entirely sure on my mash efficiency but I use BIAB and have only done a few batches so far so I doubt it's great. Thanks! All the local stores are out of Motueka it turns out, but I'll find something to brew it with.

 

[vance]

I used Motueka in my last batch. Love it. Combined with Mosaic and El Dorado.

Damn, that sounds good. My first batch was a Centennial/El Dorado mix that's not half bad for my first brew. I was planning to make a single hop Motueka brew with this grain bill, but every homebrew store near me is out of Motueka so I'll have to reconsider.

 

[Braufessor]

Hmm, I'll probably have to adjust the grain amounts then. Not entirely sure on my mash efficiency but I use BIAB and have only done a few batches so far so I doubt it's great. Thanks! All the local stores are out of Motueka it turns out, but I'll find something to brew it with.

I would maybe assume 65-70% and keep 1 lb of extra light DME on hand to adjust gravity if you undershoot it.

 

[jjw5015]

Brewing up a Citra/Mosaic/Azacca version of this. Planned on using Conan/Vermont/1318 but my LHBS had a shipping snafu this week and was real thin on yeast supply. Had to pick up Mangrove Jack M07, anyone ever use for this?

 

[WrQth]

I don't know. I use Conan 40-50 times a year. It drops clear as a glass in my blonde ale.... It is clear coming out of the fermenter with no cold crash and no fining. After a week kegged/in the fridge it is brilliantly clear. Yeasts like 1056, 007, 1272..... they all produce very clear beers..... but, when taken through a beer like this, the beer is quite hazy - but not "murky" with lots of yeast in suspension.

I don't think you need lots of yeast in suspension to make these beers and make them well. To be honest, the "yeastier" the beers are, the less I tend to like them. Some of the commercial examples I see that are murky/yeasty/milky..... I just don't think that is what the well brewed versions of this are all about. I sense people sometimes get caught up in chasing a yeast like 1318 because "you need it to make the beer hazy/cloudy." I think seeing a hazy beer that used 007 is a perfect example of that not being the case...... "Haze" comes from things beyond just having lots of yeast left in your beer. "Murky" generally comes from yeast. Often, when beers like this fail, it is because they end up overly "yeasty" as opposed to simply being hazy.

I can't tell you the chemistry behind the pH..... but, I can tell you my personal experience says 1-2 tenths of a pH on finished beer pH does seem to make a difference. I think Brulosopher's recent experiment (even though he was testing something a bit different) shows a similar thing.... If you scroll down in the experiment, look at the two beers when he measured final pH..... 4.39 vs. 4.50. The 4.50 has significant haze in it. The 4.39 is clear. I notice the same type of thing in my beers as well.
http://brulosophy.com/2016/08/08/water-chemistry-pt-5-boil-ph-in-an-ipa-exbeeriment-results/

Not to say there is no yeast left in suspension at all with conan, or other yeast.... I just don't think it is the significant player it is made to be sometimes. I also wonder if that higher pH locks up protein/hop oil/polyphenol along with holding some yeast in suspension????

Here is another experiment where pH had an affect on clarity through it was not the point of the experiment

http://www.hoptomology.com/2013/07/15/the-effect-of-ph-on-hop-character-the-results/

 

[mattywwilson]

I've had my mosaic/citra/equinox version in the keg for about 10 days now. I've been drinking some everyday, afraid of losing a lot of the hop aroma and punch. However, today the beer has definitely hit a new level. A creamsicle, milkshake quality is coming through that I'm really digging. This is the first time I've used equinox and was a little worried using so much, but so far so good.

 

[rappinduke]

I was just about to ask about Equinox I have half a pound in the freezer that I have been holding out on using because I'm worried about the green pepper flavor people say it gives. I've also heard that the hop can be very tropical. I guess I'll go ahead and give it a go. Thinking citra/Mosiac/ Equinox or citra/Galaxy/Equinox. Did you use equal hop amounts throughout?

 

[IMXELITE]

So I was planning of brewing this again and noticed I might have brought the wrong stuff with my last batch. Question:

Should the type of white wheat I be using be malted or raw white wheat? Milled or no?
Also should I have milled the following: Flaked barley, Flaked Oats and the Flaked Wheat?

 

[mintyice]

So I was planning of brewing this again and noticed I might have brought the wrong stuff with my last batch. Question:

Should the type of white wheat I be using be malted or raw white wheat? Milled or no?
Also should I have milled the following: Flaked barley, Flaked Oats and the Flaked Wheat?

Looks like malted white wheat milled, and you don't have to mill flaked barley, oats, wheat, etc

 

[IMXELITE]

Thanks. I used malted white wheat on my last brew but milled all of the flaked grains. Will not do it next time. Thanks

 

[mattywwilson]

I was just about to ask about Equinox I have half a pound in the freezer that I have been holding out on using because I'm worried about the green pepper flavor people say it gives. I've also heard that the hop can be very tropical. I guess I'll go ahead and give it a go. Thinking citra/Mosiac/ Equinox or citra/Galaxy/Equinox. Did you use equal hop amounts throughout?

I'm not getting a lot of green pepper at all. I did use equal additions of all three hops. Two whirlpool additions and two dry hops.

 

[mattywwilson]

Rappinduke...I think either one of these combos you mentioned sounds great though

 

[mintyice]

I'm not getting a lot of green pepper at all. I did use equal additions of all three hops. Two whirlpool additions and two dry hops.

I did a 100% NEwhatever and it definitely had that green pepper thing happening.

 

[rappinduke]

Think I'll go Citra/Galaxy/Equinox. I'll report back with the results. Maybe if I catch the green pepper before dry hopping I'll leave the Equinox out of the dry hop.