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American IPA "Northeast" style IPA

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VirginiaHops1

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View attachment 692569

First full pint on day 21. Waimea, Southern Star, Barbe Rouge. Waimea definitely best smelling straight out of the bag. After a botched mash (Strike water too high, dropped thermometer into kettle) this 1.064 OG supposed to be IPA finished at a 1.020 Pale Ale.

Grain bill based on Trillium's "Dialed" series. About 70% Pils, 22% Flaked Wheat, 5% Carapils, and about 2 oz of acid malt. First fully closed transfer and that put it over the top above all the other NEIPA's I've done. White Labs 008 East Coast Ale is what I've had the best results with for these beers and curious if anyone else has tried and what their take is compared to the rest of the "normal" yeasts used for the style. Thanks all for the tips, this one will go fast 👍
I used WLP east coast ale in 4 straight batches awhile back. It performed well for me. It seemed to have pretty low esters because in those beers the hops really shined. It's on my list to circle back around to eventually.
 

BobbyC14

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Has anyone ever used Vienna to add a little malt backbone to a NEIPA. I’m toying with the idea to breakaway from my usuals Golden Promise, Flaked Oat and White Wheat.

also going to test out Hornidal Kviek as the yeast at about 92* 😬
 

echoALEia

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Has anyone ever used Vienna to add a little malt backbone to a NEIPA. I’m toying with the idea to breakaway from my usuals Golden Promise, Flaked Oat and White Wheat.

also going to test out Hornidal Kviek as the yeast at about 92* 😬
I use Vienna and Munich (under 10L) in most of my NEIPA recipes and love what they add. I personally try to aim for an SRM between 5-6.
 

couchsending

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Has anyone ever used Vienna to add a little malt backbone to a NEIPA. I’m toying with the idea to breakaway from my usuals Golden Promise, Flaked Oat and White Wheat.

also going to test out Hornidal Kviek as the yeast at about 92* 😬
Golden Promise adds a lot of “malt backbone” on its own. Make the same beer with American 2row as your base malt and I think you’d be surprised at the difference. Golden Promise is much sweeter than 2row. Also keep in mind a lot of the English malts are much lower in protein than American grown barley. So if your goal is haze (or protein contribution) you’re already at a disadvantage on the largest percentage of malt in your grist.
 

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I have decided to go ahead and make a version of this, based on this post in this thread. It will be my first attempt at this style. It's essentially the same, but I am planning to do 1 oz. of hot side hops and also adding some lactose to help give it a "milkshake" feel. I have already bought all the ingredients, but haven't started the brew.
 

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You will get some bitterness out of the flame out hops unless you let the temperature drop before you add those hops. Most opinions seem to be to drop below 170F unless you want the added bitterness.
 

ChiknNutz

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You will get some bitterness out of the flame out hops unless you let the temperature drop before you add those hops. Most opinions seem to be to drop below 170F unless you want the added bitterness.
For the flameout hops, my plan is to not add those 'til it gets below 160. I also have a more detailed recipe with instructions I created in Word so I don't miss some stuff as I brew. I still feel a bit inexperienced and this will be the most advanced batch I've done so far.
 

VirginiaHops1

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Most of the pros add their whirlpool hops at near boiling temps or pretty hot temps because it's hard for them to cool and they don't pull excessive bitterness, so you shouldn't be too scared of it. As you dial in your recipe I would try various temps and see what you like best. I top off a little at the end of my boil to get to my target fermenter volume and my temp is usually in the 185-195 range after that. I've cooled lower before adding whirlpool hops but I tend to like the results from just adding at that temp.
 

tld6008

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I have decided to go ahead and make a version of this, based on this post in this thread. It will be my first attempt at this style. It's essentially the same, but I am planning to do 1 oz. of hot side hops and also adding some lactose to help give it a "milkshake" feel. I have already bought all the ingredients, but haven't started the brew.
fyi, I made this one and was very happy with the results
 

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Ive been double dryhoping and doing so loose for the past 4 years. It definitely aids in extraction in most cases. Extraction is all about surface area contact with the wort. By breaking the hops in two does, you are providing each addition more contact with the wort. Typically when a large dryhop is used in one addition, a good portion of the hops float about the wort and don’t make contact. This is the main reason pro brewers are splitting them up and using co2 to rouse them.

Now if your dryhoping in a keg and are able to invert the keg and ensure the hops are completely in contact with the wort, it will most likely be similar.
Thanks for the input! So since I'm dry hopping in the keg, sloshing it around a couple times a day to mix up which hops are at the top of the "pile" would likely accomplish the same goal as doing multiple dry hop additions? This is basically what I did for my last batch, and did get a decently strong hop character out of it, but it comes off as being a "sharper" hop flavor than what I'd like in this style. It was also my first experience using malted oats though, so I'm guessing it's more likely to be the change in grain bill contributing to this. In your double dry hop process, do you usually remove the spent hops from the 1st addition before the 2nd? Or just putting the second in on top of the first?
 

Dgallo

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Thanks for the input! So since I'm dry hopping in the keg, sloshing it around a couple times a day to mix up which hops are at the top of the "pile" would likely accomplish the same goal as doing multiple dry hop additions? This is basically what I did for my last batch, and did get a decently strong hop character out of it, but it comes off as being a "sharper" hop flavor than what I'd like in this style. It was also my first experience using malted oats though, so I'm guessing it's more likely to be the change in grain bill contributing to this. In your double dry hop process, do you usually remove the spent hops from the 1st addition before the 2nd? Or just putting the second in on top of the first?
I just toss them in on top, the first one had typically sunk or dissipated to a thin layer on top of the wort.

if you are fermenting in the same keg your dryhoping in, I would advise against inverting the keg. Then your throwing all the trub back into suspension and that will lead to a slew of problems such as oil stripping, increasing the potential of hopcreep and hop burn. If you transferring to a purged dryhop keg specifically, then when you invert it, do it very gentling, all your looking to do is get the hops resuspended or in contact with the wort. If you agetate too vigorously you can actually increase your extraction on polyphenols and lead to increased hopburn
 

BobbyC14

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Golden Promise adds a lot of “malt backbone” on its own. Make the same beer with American 2row as your base malt and I think you’d be surprised at the difference. Golden Promise is much sweeter than 2row. Also keep in mind a lot of the English malts are much lower in protein than American grown barley. So if your goal is haze (or protein contribution) you’re already at a disadvantage on the largest percentage of malt in your grist.
Thanks for the input. I was going to split the 75% Base Malts between GP and 2Row like I did with my Milkshake and my last American IPA which both turned out great and nice and hazy. Wasn't sure if substituting a pound of Vienna for 1/2 of each of my base would add anything to the flavor profile or if the hops would just over take anything the malt would give. I'm still playing with my hop ratios but I have 8oz each of Moteuka, Citra and Azacca to play with and I still have 1/2 left of Warrior for a 10-20 minute addition.
 

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Thanks for the input. I was going to split the 75% Base Malts between GP and 2Row like I did with my Milkshake and my last American IPA which both turned out great and nice and hazy. Wasn't sure if substituting a pound of Vienna for 1/2 of each of my base would add anything to the flavor profile or if the hops would just over take anything the malt would give. I'm still playing with my hop ratios but I have 8oz each of Moteuka, Citra and Azacca to play with and I still have 1/2 left of Warrior for a 10-20 minute addition.
Doubt you’d notice much difference in Vienna over Golden Promise... A pound of Munich 1 maybe. A lot of brewers combine a certain percentage of Munich with standard 2 Row in hopes of replicating a more English malt profile but at the cost of 2row. I believe Firestone does it a lot.
 

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Doubt you’d notice much difference in Vienna over Golden Promise... A pound of Munich 1 maybe. A lot of brewers combine a certain percentage of Munich with standard 2 Row in hopes of replicating a more English malt profile but at the cost of 2row. I believe Firestone does it a lot.
I've recently landed on 80% 2-row, 20% Vienna for my west coast IPAs and haven't looked back. Super clean, lets the hops shine, but adds enough backbone and sweetness to not be boring. I think supplementing some 2-row with Vienna would work well in a NEIPA too.
 

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I did a beer 50/50 2-row and vienna and Vic Secret. It was only hopped at 1oz/gal so not my usual hop-bomb levels and I was shooting for more of a hoppy pale ale but it came out intensely tropical fruity. I feel like the vienna sweetness may have amplified the vic secret. Might be worth playing around with in NEIPA haze bombs.
 

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Has anyone ever used Vienna to add a little malt backbone to a NEIPA. I’m toying with the idea to breakaway from my usuals Golden Promise, Flaked Oat and White Wheat.

also going to test out Hornidal Kviek as the yeast at about 92* 😬
GP adds a lot of malt character compared to 2-row. I noticed the difference between Simpsons GP and Rahr 2-Row when I switched up base malt. I may buy a sack of GP, as it’s been a few sacks since I used it. Thanks!

PS. Don’t fear Hornindal. When I need a new keg in less than two weeks it’s my go to. I just drop a tablespoon of goop from my Hornindal mason jar.
 

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GP adds a lot of malt character compared to 2-row. I noticed the difference between Simpsons GP and Rahr 2-Row when I switched up base malt. I may buy a sack of GP, as it’s been a few sacks since I used it. Thanks!

PS. Don’t fear Hornindal. When I need a new keg in less than two weeks it’s my go to. I just drop a tablespoon of goop from my Hornindal mason jar.
Good to know! Just a tablespoon? So I shouldn't pitch the whole pack. Someone was telling me the other day the same thing, put I can't find a pitch rate calc to factor in the Hornindal's intensity. I mean what's the worst that can happy my blowoff assembly from my SS Brewbuck gets a little filled up lol
 

VirginiaHops1

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Good to know! Just a tablespoon? So I shouldn't pitch the whole pack. Someone was telling me the other day the same thing, put I can't find a pitch rate calc to factor in the Hornindal's intensity. I mean what's the worst that can happy my blowoff assembly from my SS Brewbuck gets a little filled up lol
I worked with Hornindal last year and made a starter out of the pouch and split into like 5 mason jars and pitched those. Fermentation seemed fairly normal. I got some Voss this summer and have done one batch with it and just pitched about tablespoon or so of slurry from the pouch. It took off like a missile and was the craziest blow-off activity I've ever seen. So yeah I think these kveiks love to be underpitched by a lot especially if you're fermenting hot
 

Dgallo

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Good to know! Just a tablespoon? So I shouldn't pitch the whole pack. Someone was telling me the other day the same thing, put I can't find a pitch rate calc to factor in the Hornindal's intensity. I mean what's the worst that can happy my blowoff assembly from my SS Brewbuck gets a little filled up lol
All depends on what your looking for as your final flavor profile. Last summer into the fall I used Hornindal pretty religiously in hoppy beers to get a feel for it. A healthy pitch of 1 table spoon in enough to take a 1.074 - 1.012 in about 50-60 hours. My only issue with the lower pitch rate and running 85+ with Hornindal, is the esters completely dominated the beer. You could taste hops but the character from specific varieties would not show. I did a single hop double ipa with Galaxy and there was zero Galaxy profile to speak of. When I increased my pitch rate to 3 tablespoons with a single hop pale ale using Galaxy, I got the Galaxy notes paired with Hornindal. Very similar experience with Voss, however those beers weren’t single hopped beers, so there were other variables in the mix. In my experience, kviek yeast are great if you do not have temp control or you need a beer done quickly for an event (I’ve gone grain to glass with double dryhopping and crashing in 7 days) but it takes some balance and finesse to get the esters and the hops to shine at the same time.
 

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I also used hornindal a lot last year along with Voss and Stranda (hothead) I tried significantly under pitching a couple times and also pitching in the whole pack. I will say that under pitching will definitely give you more of the esters especially if you ferment it on the hot side. There were a couple times that I used Hornindal and got some really aggressive sulfur/rotten egg kind of smells. It disappeared a few times in the final beer but there was also a couple times where it translated into the final beer and I really didn’t care for it. I’m not sure what led to that but I’ve seen some other people say they’ve gotten the same thing.

I recently used the white labs Opshaug strain which is supposed to be a very clean fermenting kveik and I absolutely loved the result of the beer. If fermented fast and hot and has very little ester contribution into the final beer. I also have a beer fermenting now with the omega Lutra Kveik which is also marketed as shockingly clean. I’m currently crashing it before dry hopping but I have high hopes for it as well. The more I brew these hoppy styles the more I feel like I want less ester contribution from my yeast. I just want something that will ferment quickly and cleanly and then allow the malt and the hops to shine.

I should add that for both of the opshaug and Lutra I pitched the whole pack and fermented it at about 85 to 86 for the whole time. They were both done in three days. OG of 1.070 and 1.072.
 

Dgallo

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I also used hornindal a lot last year along with Voss and Stranda (hothead) I tried significantly under pitching a couple times and also pitching in the whole pack. I will There were a couple times that I used Hornindal and got some really aggressive sulfur/rotten egg kind of smells. It disappeared a few times in the final beer but there was also a couple times where it translated into the final beer and I really didn’t care for it. I’m not sure what led to that but I’ve seen some other people say they’ve gotten the same thing.
Those off flavors are associated with stress, especially sulfurous notes. Hornindal requires more nutrients than most yeast. So if your pitch count is high and/or your gravity is on the lower end, it will cause some stress. You should add some yeast nutrient in the beers you pitch the whole pack or if under pitching, beers below 1.065
 

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Those off flavors are associated with stress, especially sulfurous notes. Hornindal requires more nutrients than most yeast. So if your pitch count is high and/or your gravity is on the lower end, it will cause some stress. You should add some yeast nutrient in the beers you pitch the whole pack or if under pitching, beers below 1.065
Agreed. I’ve been aware of the nutrient requirements of Kveik for a while. Even last year I was giving them twice the recommended amount of the wyeast nutrient. Still got the disgusting rotten eggs a few times. I pushed them pretty hot a few times like over 100 so maybe that had something to do with it.
 

secretlevel

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I'm experimenting with Cashmere and mash temps. Mashed around 158F to get 1.062 OG and 1.021 FG with London Ale 3. Turned in at 5.5% to be a nice summer sipper. High FG adds a good deal of body and complements the esters a bit.

Whirlpool: 1oz Citra, 1.5oz Cashmere

Dry hops:
6.5oz Cashmere
2.5oz Citra
1.5oz Simcoe

Tasting notes:
Banger of a pale ale, but not quite an all out NEIPA that it should be with 2oz/gal of dry hops. Cashmere is nice, but just a bit too mellow for this style. The 1.5oz Simcoe was added to keg 2 weeks in, after I wasn't quite happy with the beer. Overnight, this beer just turned into an absolute cantaloupe bomb. Loving all the overripe peach, passionfruit and cantaloupe flavors.

2018 Simcoe from YVH was a banger... I'll miss it and hope that this year's Simcoe can live up to the superb fruity character that crop had.

Cashmere-Citra NE Pale.jpg
 

BongoYodeler

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I'm experimenting with Cashmere and mash temps. Mashed around 158F to get 1.062 OG and 1.021 FG with London Ale 3. Turned in at 5.5% to be a nice summer sipper. High FG adds a good deal of body and complements the esters a bit.

Whirlpool: 1oz Citra, 1.5oz Cashmere

Dry hops:
6.5oz Cashmere
2.5oz Citra
1.5oz Simcoe

Tasting notes:
Banger of a pale ale, but not quite an all out NEIPA that it should be with 2oz/gal of dry hops. Cashmere is nice, but just a bit too mellow for this style. The 1.5oz Simcoe was added to keg 2 weeks in, after I wasn't quite happy with the beer. Overnight, this beer just turned into an absolute cantaloupe bomb. Loving all the overripe peach, passionfruit and cantaloupe flavors.

2018 Simcoe from YVH was a banger... I'll miss it and hope that this year's Simcoe can live up to the superb fruity character that crop had.

View attachment 693070
Looks great. Interested in hearing what if any precautions you took to limit O2 when keg hopping mid-stream. My first attempt at a neipa, currently about 2/3 of a keg remaining is good but lacks hop-punch. I've been kicking around the idea of adding more hops.
 

hopfenstopfen

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I'm experimenting with Cashmere and mash temps. Mashed around 158F to get 1.062 OG and 1.021 FG with London Ale 3. Turned in at 5.5% to be a nice summer sipper. High FG adds a good deal of body and complements the esters a bit.

Whirlpool: 1oz Citra, 1.5oz Cashmere

Dry hops:
6.5oz Cashmere
2.5oz Citra
1.5oz Simcoe

Tasting notes:
Banger of a pale ale, but not quite an all out NEIPA that it should be with 2oz/gal of dry hops. Cashmere is nice, but just a bit too mellow for this style. The 1.5oz Simcoe was added to keg 2 weeks in, after I wasn't quite happy with the beer. Overnight, this beer just turned into an absolute cantaloupe bomb. Loving all the overripe peach, passionfruit and cantaloupe flavors.

2018 Simcoe from YVH was a banger... I'll miss it and hope that this year's Simcoe can live up to the superb fruity character that crop had.

View attachment 693070
Elaborate on the tasting notes on the cashmere-dominant mix? Read they are subtle. Bought 1/2 lb was thinking of using them much like you did, but with mosaic in place of citra. Unsure of 3rd hop, might go huell melon.
 

secretlevel

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Looks great. Interested in hearing what if any precautions you took to limit O2 when keg hopping mid-stream. My first attempt at a neipa, currently about 2/3 of a keg remaining is good but lacks hop-punch. I've been kicking around the idea of adding more hops.
Nothing fancy, honestly. I used a sanitized hop sack, suspended it with flavorless floss, then purged the keg 3 times. I used to do this more in past and never had too many issues.

Elaborate on the tasting notes on the cashmere-dominant mix? Read they are subtle. Bought 1/2 lb was thinking of using them much like you did, but with mosaic in place of citra. Unsure of 3rd hop, might go huell melon.
Cashmere was dominant by weight, but not in flavor. It was a mellow Citra beer with some notes of cantaloupe/peach. Cashmere is pretty low on oil content and while in some cases low oil hops can stand out, this one doesn't stand out too much. I think it would be nice in a fruity pilsner or a cream ale. I would probably do 60/40 Citra/Cashmere if I tried this again.

Full disclosure - this is YVH 2019 Cashmere. You may have a different crop that could be much more pungent.
 

HopsAreGood

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Tons of options but sort of depends on the hops themselves....Which ones you think smell the best.. Im sure the LUPOMAX stuff they’ve released so far is all pretty good quality cause they want to get people fired up on the product.

Idaho 7 can be interesting and it can be really earthy/black tea. I did a 60/40 Strata/I7 beer that was really cool. Tasted and smelled like no beer I’d ever had. It was almost like it was brewed with hops from AUS/NZ. Is the Nelson you have really good? Or is it diesely? How’s the Strata? Most everything I’ve bought from YVH has been a bit onion/garlic.
I ended up going with 2 ounces of Nelson and 2 ounces of strata for the first DryHop, then 24 hours later I did another 3 ounces of Nelson and 2 ounces of Citra LupoMax. It’s sitting at 61° right now and I’ll probably give it another 24 hours or so before crashing it out. We’ll see how it turns out.

So in summation:
1oz Nelson, 1oz Strata at 10
2oz Nelson, 2 oz Strata at 170 WP
2oz Nelson, 2oz Strata DH1
3oz Nelson, 2oz Citra Lupomax Dh2

14 pounds 2-row
.5 pounds c-10
Omega Lutra yeast at 85

I also adjusted my water for 230 ppm chloride and 4 ppm sulfate. I’ve never gone this extreme on the ratio but after verdant posted that they do this sometimes I figured I’d try it out. Keeps me from getting bored.

I’ll post back once it’s carbed and ready.
 
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BongoYodeler

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The 1.5oz Simcoe was added to keg 2 weeks in, after I wasn't quite happy with the beer. Overnight, this beer just turned into an absolute cantaloupe bomb. Loving all the overripe peach, passionfruit and cantaloupe flavors.

View attachment 693070
Looks great. Interested in hearing what if any precautions you took to limit O2 when keg hopping mid-stream. My first attempt at a neipa, currently about 2/3 of a keg remaining is good but lacks hop-punch. I've been kicking around the idea of adding more hops.
Nothing fancy, honestly. I used a sanitized hop sack, suspended it with flavorless floss, then purged the keg 3 times. I used to do this more in past and never had too many issues.
I decided to go ahead and add some hops to the keg. I added 1oz of Galaxy and 1oz of Azacca to my ss hop tube. Purged a half dozed times. I'll probably wait a day or two before trying it, and then drink it as quickly as I can in an attempt to stay ahead of any due to oxygen.
 

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Double Brew Today

Brew 1:

Pale Ale testing some of the hop that are supposedly high in “Survivables”. YCh released this study earlier this spring and Scott Janish has written about it since. Beer is also based on a few other Thiol studies.

5% 1.013 FG Pale Ale

2oz Cascade at 30
- 3MH has been shown to increase in the boil. Certain yeast can transform 3MH into 3MHA (passion fruit/guava)

1oz MT Hood at 5
- one of the most random hops in the Survivable chart

WP @ 162 (cooled a little too low)
- 1.5oz Milleniumm
- 2oz Mosaic
- Millenium was again one of those odd hops that was really highly on the Survivable chart.

Most likely DH with Citra + (something)

Brew 2: 6.5% IPA with fresh 2020 Australian hops. Simcoe @ 30, Galaxy with 25% HPA-016 in WP. DH probably mostly HPa-016 but maybe a 50/50 split between the two. Just opened the bag of Galaxy and it’s insane!

Trying to see if a really soft water profile helps the reduce the harshness from these hops.
 
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VirginiaHops1

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Elaborate on the tasting notes on the cashmere-dominant mix? Read they are subtle. Bought 1/2 lb was thinking of using them much like you did, but with mosaic in place of citra. Unsure of 3rd hop, might go huell melon.
For me cashmere gives off citrus flavors with a subtle lemon/lime thing. It's not a powerful hop so can be overshadowed but I like it
 

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Nothing fancy, honestly. I used a sanitized hop sack, suspended it with flavorless floss, then purged the keg 3 times. I used to do this more in past and never had too many issues.



Cashmere was dominant by weight, but not in flavor. It was a mellow Citra beer with some notes of cantaloupe/peach. Cashmere is pretty low on oil content and while in some cases low oil hops can stand out, this one doesn't stand out too much. I think it would be nice in a fruity pilsner or a cream ale. I would probably do 60/40 Citra/Cashmere if I tried this again.

Full disclosure - this is YVH 2019 Cashmere. You may have a different crop that could be much more pungent.
I’ve got a “kolsch” with cashmere now. Ended up in a similar boat and added two more ounces of dry hops after it was done. Really really subtle. Even with the extra dry hop I think I’d stick to late boil, like 10 minutes as we’ve been discussing lately. The peach ring ish character is most apparent in the taste of this beer. It was bursted from 20 to 0
 

Dgallo

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If anyone finds this in their beverage center from civil society, be sure to pick it up. Great expression on strata hops and great example of their profile.
8BCEC1E3-97DE-4188-8B42-AD50893A9FC7.jpeg
 

SteveLupoMax

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I’ve done quite a bit of different ratios with them and all were good. I tend to go between 2 or 3 to 1 nelson to Citra, since I want nelson in the lead by just a tad (I base it off total oil ml/100gr). You really can’t go wrong though
How do use this to decide the ratio you use?
 

Dgallo

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How do use this to decide the ratio you use?
So I look at total oil content per 100 grams of hops (all varieties have this information in ranges and I’ll take the average.) Citra average total oil content is usually around 2.0-2.5 ml per 100 grams and Nelson is usually 1.1-1.5 ml per 100 gr. Since most of the flavor and aroma comes form these oil (yes there are thiols and other compound that contribute, but different oils are what’s most prevalent). The oil amounts tell me that Citra has on average 1.5-2.5 times the amount of oil that Nelson has, meaning it has potential to dominate the flavor. So if I want the Nelson and Citra to both contribute equal amounts of the flavor an aroma I need an average ratio of 1.5 - 2 : 1 nelson to Citra. Since I personally enjoy more nelson with this combo I will up my nelson to 2.5 - 3 : 1 to the Citra.

I am doing this with all the hops in the combos I use and have found it actually has given me far more control over the flavor and aroma i plan for or envision and I get very close to the profile I was hoping to achieve in the finished beer.

i honestly can’t back this up by science but in my last 8 beers that I’ve been playing with this concept, it’s proving to work.
 
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BongoYodeler

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So I look at total oil content per 100 grams of hops (all varieties have this information in ranges and I’ll take the average.) Citra average total oil content is usuoally around 2.0-2.5 ml per 100 grams and Nelson is usually 1.1-1.5 ml per 100 gr. Since most of the flavor and aroma comes form these oil (yes there are thiols and other compound that contribute, but different oils are what’s most prevalent). Thea oil amounts tell me that Citra has on average 1.5-2.5 times the amount of oil tht Nelson haas, meaning it has potential to dominate the flavor. So if I want the Nelson and Citra to both contribute equal amounts of the flavor an aroma I need an average ration of 1.5 - 2 : 1 nelson to Citra. Since I personally enjoy more nelson with this combo I will up my nelson to 2.5 - 3 : 1 to the Citra.

I am doing this with all the hops in the combos I use and have found it actually has given me far more control over the flavor and aroma i plan for or envision and I get very close to the profile I was hoping to achieve in the finished beer.

i honestly can’t not back this up by science but in my last 8 beers that I’ve been playing with this concept, it’s proving to work.
Interesting....
 

Dgallo

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Interesting....
It really is. I’d honestly like some folks in this thread to give it a try so we can find out how well it really works.

I’m not saying it makes a better ipa per say but it helps make good decision on hop combos and ratios. For example say you want a beer that’s is citrus forward but firm dank undertones, you could use this concept to make a good decision on a good ration that is based on the hops and their oil content
 

couchsending

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It really is. I’d honestly like some folks in this thread to give it a try so we can find out how well it really works.

I’m not saying it makes a better ipa per say but it helps make good decision on hop combos and ratios. For example say you want a beer that’s is citrus forward but firm dank undertones, you could use this concept to make a good decision on a good ration that is based on the hops and their oil content
I understand your theory on it and I’ve heard breweries like Hop Butcher speak about it but I think there are so many other variables that apply. Nelson is a perfect example. It might not be as high in oil content but it’s packed with Thiols, maybe more than almost any hop.

Riwaka is another one that’s only like .8g/l oil content and 4-7% alpha yet paired 50/50 with Citra in my mind it would stand out above Citra.

Sultana (Denali) is another where the total oil is I think second highest to only Galaxy. Yet Citra might still overshadow it at 50/50. Sultana’s oil content might be high but it’s Thiol content isn’t near what Citra is.

There are just so many variables I find it hard to apply any sort of equation to it. Then there’s the whole issue with the actual quality of the hops you have. In my opinion. The one that smells the best is the one you should use the most of (especially on the dry hop).
 
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