My First Brett Saison

[dantheman13]

Are you sure is a krausen and not a pellicile?

I was thinking the same thing. I've had Brett create a pellicle/krausen 7 days after adding fresh wort. It looked like a pellicle, but it completely subsided in 3-4 days.

Here is what it looked like: [ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaG4gAlV87c[/ame]

 

[Cadrian]

I decided to take a sample today for gravity check. It seems it was only a big build up of c02 was definity not a pecille. It went down soon as theif went in.

Gravity was only 1.010, how long should I wait to take another reading?

It tasted amazing... aroma of pineapple and slight hay. Tasted like grapefruit pineapple juice for the most part. Really want to get it in a bottle and get to share it.

 

[jrfehon]

I would wait at least until they're three months old, if not six. My brett saisons are all at 6 months now and I actually just dry hopped them and will bottle next week. All four 2.5 gallon batches are between 1.004 and 1.006. That's what they were at 3 months as well as now at 6 months. You're using two strains of yeast that attenuate very well. You should get closer to 1.004 before you start thinking about bottling, imo.

 

[Cadrian]

Ya I am definitely waiting till I am at 1.004, Guess ill check it again at 4 months and see where its at, this was the first check at 10 weeks.

 

[jrfehon]

I'm now drinking my brett saisons - 2 halves of an all citra hop saison, 1 with brett brux in the secondary and the other with brett lamb. I brewed the same batch with centennial, split, and added the same strains of brett. Each were fermented in the primary with 3724. I reracked and added the brett strains in December, so these beers are all over 7 months old.

First, they taste amazing! All four halves are dry, crisp, and demonstrate the flavor profiles well of the hops I used, both in the boil and dry. However, the brett funk is still nonexistent. I should note that these were two of the last extract beers I brewed - not that it possibly made a difference. So my question is why no funk? Is 7 months in a secondary carboy with brettanomyces not long enough? I'm hoping someone like SweetCell might be able to help me figure this out. We know that brettanomyces when used as the secondary yeast strain can eat pretty much anything, including the byproducts of saccharomyces. Knowing this, I transferred a bit of the yeast cake when I reacked to the secondary vessels. One batch when I reracked had a gravity of 1.021 and the other 1.007. Both batches were fermented around 75 degrees.

The good news is I have some really good saisons on my hands. The drawback (if there is one) is that the flavor isn't exactly what I was shooting for. My guess is the brett funk will appear but it might take more time in the bottle. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Thanks.

 

[Thorpe429]

One initial possibility is that the Brett has contributed a decent amount, but that the hop character is covering up anything that is distinctly noticeable as Brett. Fruity characteristics could all just be blending together.

Otherwise, in terms of funk, Brett will generally act fast once it's under pressure. I haven't read through the whole thread, but are these bottled or in kegs now? Also, what's the final gravity? If in bottles, the Brett should develop faster now based on my experience and what I've heard from Chad Y and Gabe at Anchorage.




Blog: spontaneousfunk.blogspot.com

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[sweetcell]

brewers make wort, yeast make beer. according to this line of thinking, this is the beer the yeast decided to make... we only have so much control over it.

to be a little less esoteric, perhaps your saison just didn't have the building blocks for brett to take off and do their thing. 3711 isn't the most exciting saison yeast, maybe it didn't produce enough by-products for the brett to transform (RE: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f127/understanding-brett-flavors-298943/)

One initial possibility is that the Brett has contributed a decent amount, but that the hop character is covering up anything that is distinctly noticeable as Brett. Fruity characteristics could all just be blending together.

not a bad theory.

Otherwise, in terms of funk, Brett will generally act fast once it's under pressure. I haven't read through the whole thread, but are these bottled or in kegs now? Also, what's the final gravity? If in bottles, the Brett should develop faster now based on my experience and what I've heard from Chad Y and Gabe at Anchorage.

right, but i believe the "works faster" observation is when the brett is added at bottling (i.e. first introduced to the beer). in this beer's case, the brett has had plenty of time in secondary to do its thing... and it hasn't (or it has done it, and it isn't what the brewer wanted). maybe pressure will change things, but i suspect that the brett has already done whatever it is that it will do.

 

[Thorpe429]

right, but i believe the "works faster" observation is when the brett is added at bottling (i.e. first introduced to the beer). in this beer's case, the brett has had plenty of time in secondary to do its thing... and it hasn't (or it has done it, and it isn't what the brewer wanted). maybe pressure will change things, but i suspect that the brett has already done whatever it is that it will do.

I haven't really thought/read about whether it's for the first time at bottling or just the pressure at any time, but I've experienced it changing plenty more in the bottle after being in primary.

I typically primary with saison yeast and Brett, and tend to see plenty of additional Brett character development after bottling although, to be fair, I'm generally bottling much sooner than is the case here. Although, since Brett changes beer for years, I would think that it could still potentially change faster under pressure than it would sitting in a carboy for additional months. No?

 

[jrfehon]

Thanks for the thoughts. The final gravity was around 1.005. I used 3724 not 3711. I'm not sure if that would make a difference. I did transfer some of the yeast cake in hopes that the Brett could eat what was in there. Maybe now that the beer is bottled the Brett character will come out more? Regardless these are incredibly dry, clear and crisp saisons which is what I like.

 

[Thorpe429]

If it finished at 1.005 and that's where you bottled, the Brett will continue to do work. The question is how much and whether the current character of the beer will cover up any additional Brett character.

One thing to keep in mind is that if you bottled at 1.005, you'll need to keep an eye on carbonation, especially if you didn't use heavy bottles. Each degree of gravity that it drops will create about half a volume of CO2, so if that drops to 1.000, you could end up with an additional 2.5 volumes of CO2 (also stated as one volume for every half degree Plato). See Kaiser's post in this thread: https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=2177.0


Blog: spontaneousfunk.blogspot.com

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[jrfehon]

If it finished at 1.005 and that's where you bottled, the Brett will continue to do work. The question is how much and whether the current character of the beer will cover up any additional Brett character.

One thing to keep in mind is that if you bottled at 1.005, you'll need to keep an eye on carbonation, especially if you didn't use heavy bottles. Each degree of gravity that it drops will create about half a volume of CO2, so if that drops to 1.000, you could end up with an additional 2.5 volumes of CO2 (also stated as one volume for every half degree Plato). See Kaiser's post in this thread: https://www.homebrewersassociation.org/forum/index.php?topic=2177.0


Blog: spontaneousfunk.blogspot.com

Sent from my iPhone using Home Brewing

I didn't use heavy bottles but I don't think the gravity will drop any further. I pitched brett six month prior to bottling. At three months I checked the gravity and it was the same when I bottled. Reading up on all this beforehand, I know that doesn't mean the gravity won't drop more but I think it's less likely.

 

[Cadrian]

Just took a sample of my Saison.... guess I am ready to bottle. When I took sample I have a very very thin bubbly peliccle sitting on top, I assume that can be expected.

Lower than 1.000

So after 5 months.... There is enough brett floating around still for conditioning correct?

 

[jrfehon]

Just took a sample of my Saison.... guess I am ready to bottle. When I took sample I have a very very thin bubbly peliccle sitting on top, I assume that can be expected.

Lower than 1.000

So after 5 months.... There is enough brett floating around still for conditioning correct?

Yes, the brett is still viable and will carb up your beer. My saison carbed in two weeks and it was over 6 months old when I bottled.