Man, I love Apfelwein

[jamesbsmith]

I couldnt agree more with the love of apple wine! I love it!

I like using grape juice with apple juice. I think the two create a synergy which is better than either a grape juice wine or an apple juice wine alone.

Here is a 22.5L (Carboy) Versatile Recipe which I always stick to when making wine, which I thought fit into this I Love Apple Wine Thread!:

Note - Grape Juice - Use red, white or both!

5L Grape, 10L Apple & 3Kg Sugar OR

7.5L Grape, 7.5L Apple & 2.8Kg Sugar OR

10L Grape, 5L Apple & 2.5Kg Sugar

For tropical Notes:

Add 1L of Pineapple Juice OR replace 3L of the apple / grape juice with 3L Rubicon Passion Fruit / Lychee Juice.

For Further Complexity - Add late:

10 Bananas / 1Kg Gooseberries / Currants / Raspberries / Forest Fruits / Cherries / Blueberries / 8 X 410g Tins Fruit: Strawberries / Peaches / Apricots / Pears.

Honey - Replace 1Kg sugar with 1.25Kg clear honey for honey flavour

 

[Dominic1920]

I couldnt agree more with the love of apple wine! I love it!

I like using grape juice with apple juice. I think the two create a synergy which is better than either a grape juice wine or an apple juice wine alone.

Here is a 5 Gallon Versatile Recipe which I always stick to when making wine, which I thought fit into this I Love Apple Wine Thread!:

Note - Grape Juice - Use red, white or both!

5L Grape, 10L Apple & 3Kg Sugar OR

7.5L Grape, 7.5L Apple & 2.8Kg Sugar OR

10L Grape, 5L Apple & 2.5Kg Sugar

For tropical Notes:

Add 1L of Pineapple Juice OR replace 3L of the apple / grape juice with 3L Rubicon Passion Fruit / Lychee Juice.

For Further Complexity - Add late:

10 Bananas / 1Kg Gooseberries / Currants / Raspberries / Forest Fruits / Cherries / Blueberries / 8 X 410g Tins Fruit: Strawberries / Peaches / Apricots / Pears.

Honey - Replace 1Kg sugar with 1.25Kg clear honey for honey flavour

Jamesb: This really sounds good, I'm giving it a try. You need to add it to the recipes section.

 

[GCarrabs]

It'll have this symbol,

Here's some of the other codes....and some info.

1. PET or PETE – Light gauge containers such as store bought pop bottles should be a one time use only. Heavier gauge containers show no evidence of leaching chemicals.

2. HDPE – not known to leach unwanted chemicals.

3. PVC or V – Bad – Strong evidence to show the leaching of DEHA, a known human carcinogen.

4. LDPE – not known to leach unwanted chemicals although not as widely recycled as #1 or #2.

5. PP – not known to leach unwanted chemicals although not as widely recycled as #1 or #2.

6. PS - suspected to possibly leach harmful carcinogens

7. Assorted but usually polycarbonate – Bad – may contain leaching BPA.

Basically though 1 is the best 2 is ok....the other ones besides leaching problems are also the most succesible to oxygen permeability.

So, I just realized that the Motts 1 gallon bottles are PETE 1. Does this mean I can use them as a primary fermenter??? What about as a secondary for 3-4 weeks? Would primary be under two weeks for a bottle like this?

 

[jamesbsmith]

The PET article is very interesting. I have been worried about the oxygen permeability of PET too.

What I do is ferment in 1 (UK) Gallon glass demijohns, until dry, and then syphon into 5L PET water bottles. I then leave them in these to age, with the plan on leaving my elderberry wines in them for at least a year. I do this so that I can free up my glass demijohns which I just find nicer for fermenting in.

I have read that the oxygen permeability of PET means that those mini bottles of wine you get on planes has a shelf life of only 3 months! I think that the article has a good point in that the thicker PET bottles (such as those I am maturing my wines in) are less permeable. Also, the smaller a vessel, the greater the surface contact the wine has with the sides of the bottle. In a 5 or 23L PET container, the surface contact is MUCH less than these small 1 glass bottles you get on planes.

Glass bottles with corks are recognised as the best things for storing wine in, but cork itself is oxygen permeable. Some commercial wine producers actually allow a monitored amount of oxygen ingress as they believe this helps the maturation process!

I therefore feel OK in leaving my wines in 5L PET bottles for up to a year and maybe a little longer, but time will tell! Maybe a little SO2 / campden should be added every 3 or 6 months?!

 

[bleme]

Aren't the oak barrels that everything used to be made in oxygen permeable?

 

[jamesbsmith]

I dont think white oak is oxygen permeable. Red is, but barrels arent made from red. Still, alcohol does manage to permeate the oak and the volume does decrease slightly over time. The contents are monitored and therefore opened so small amounts of oxygen does get in that way. Wine does require a certain amount of oxygen for it to mature, but not too much otherwise the rate of change will produce unfavourable flavours or oxidise.

As far as I can tell, there hasnt been the research as to how much oxygen the PET containers we use will let in. Surely if PET is used for water and other drinks, it cant be too bad for wine? I just dont know for sure, but Im willing to take the risk in storing my elderberry wines in 5L PET for a year. Im sure it will be safe.

 

[jamesbsmith]

... I am yet to hear someone say that fermenting or storing their wine in PET spoilt the wine, although people do usually keep quiet about their not so successful wines!

Ill certainly keep everyone posted if my gets spoilt!

I have developed a mentality in my wine making where if I am not happy with my wine I bin it. I make a lot of wine, and life is too short to get frustrated with every sip you take of a poor brew. The key is to learn the lessons and put them into practice. Saying this, I have found I bin less and less wine these days. This mentality I think actually gets you making decent wine sooner as you learn more quickly!

 

[GCarrabs]

Just started a 1 gallon batch of Apfelwein at around 8% and a 1 gallon batch of Apple Wine at 12%. Used Motts apple juice, table sugar, and EC 1118 yeast.

Going to leave the apfelwein in primary for a month and rack to another 1 gallon jug and possible back sweeten to my liking before I bottle about a month later.

Apple wine I will rack after 6 days into secondary then back sweeten and bottle.

Hope it works out!! First time ever making wine.

 

[endorphine44]

I couldnt agree more with the love of apple wine! I love it!

I like using grape juice with apple juice. I think the two create a synergy which is better than either a grape juice wine or an apple juice wine alone.

Here is a 22.5L (Carboy) Versatile Recipe which I always stick to when making wine, which I thought fit into this I Love Apple Wine Thread!:

Note - Grape Juice - Use red, white or both!

5L Grape, 10L Apple & 3Kg Sugar OR

7.5L Grape, 7.5L Apple & 2.8Kg Sugar OR

10L Grape, 5L Apple & 2.5Kg Sugar

For tropical Notes:

Add 1L of Pineapple Juice OR replace 3L of the apple / grape juice with 3L Rubicon Passion Fruit / Lychee Juice.

For Further Complexity - Add late:

10 Bananas / 1Kg Gooseberries / Currants / Raspberries / Forest Fruits / Cherries / Blueberries / 8 X 410g Tins Fruit: Strawberries / Peaches / Apricots / Pears.

Honey - Replace 1Kg sugar with 1.25Kg clear honey for honey flavour

How "late" do you add the tins of fruit? I'm thinking a week, let primary fermentation slow down then add fruit?

I started with 4.5gal of Apple Juice + 1gal of White Grape and Mangrove Jack's M02. I'm going to add 4 x 15oz cans of peaches (no sugar added) and 2 x 15oz cans of apricots (no sugar added).

my wife and her friends like sweet wines, i considered saving the juice and using it to back sweeten before I bottle it instead of adding it to ferment.

Any thoughts? or better ideas about how to do that?

 

[jamesbsmith]

Yes! Wait until it slows down, mash it up with a sterile masher and add it. Leave it in there for a couple of days and strain it back out.

Yes, back sweeten with juice or sugar, but you will need more juice (about ten times the volume) of juice to sweeten as you would sugar, which will dilute the wine down. Add 1g potassium sorbate and a crushed campden tablet / gallon of wine when back sweetening to stop it re-fermenting, or add to each bottle prior to drinking.

 

[jamesbsmith]

Id probably use a gallon less juice there, so maybe dont use the grape at all. With the grape the acidity will be approx 0.79% (a bit on the high side), without it it will be just below 0.7% (perfect).

I am currently drinking a wine from just apple juice and apricots, and it is excellent, so you wont miss the grape. If you are planning on back sweetening quite a bit, it will hold up to the additional acidity though!

 

[endorphine44]

Id probably use a gallon less juice there, so maybe dont use the grape at all. With the grape the acidity will be approx 0.79% (a bit on the high side), without it it will be just below 0.7% (perfect).

I am currently drinking a wine from just apple juice and apricots, and it is excellent, so you wont miss the grape. If you are planning on back sweetening quite a bit, it will hold up to the additional acidity though!

well, I'm a little impatient and I had already mixed up the juice and pitched the yeast before I saw your reply...so hopefully .79% isn't too high when it's all done.
How are you estimating that acidity (trying to learn).

I might split the batch and just sweeten half of it. I'll drink it either way, but the girls are partial to sweet wine (peach Moscato in particular).

 

[jamesbsmith]

Do you have a one gallon demijohn? You could take out a gallon of the wine and put it into the gallon demijohn and see how that works out. You could then add 800g of sugar to the main batch and top it up with water when ferm slows. That would give you an acidity of approx 0.67 and the addition of the sugar would bring the ABV back up.

I use the Wine Calcs Spread sheet which is free from http://www.yobrew.co.uk/ to design recipes. It is without a doubt the best and most reliable wine making guide I have ever found! It cant stop the user chosing silly ingredients which just dont go, but if you know what flavours go (which is sounds like you do), it helps you know how much fruit, juice and sugar to put in to give you the right acid, tannin and alcohol levels.

 

[rwgaro]

Brewed this in July 2014, bottled in Oct, had a very noticeable kind of sour aftertaste / finish (almost like vinegar). The weird taste gotten more subtle, but still has this weird flavor now. Anyone else get this? Does it eventually go away?

 

[Pyg]

Brewed this in July 2014, bottled in Oct, had a very noticeable kind of sour aftertaste / finish (almost like vinegar). The weird taste gotten more subtle, but still has this weird flavor now. Anyone else get this? Does it eventually go away?

I bottled in early dec, every bottle I have tried far has that flavor.
Don't know why!

 

[jamesbsmith]

If its a vinegary taste it may have oxidised :-(. Apples are very prone to oxidation (note how quickly they brown one you bite into them). If you make from real apples, one you cut them, make sure you pop them into some water and campden until you juice them, then treat the juice with a bit more. If using juice or apples, make sure as little oxygen gets to your must and wine at all times, i.e. Syphon over pouring. When using carboys, there can be more chance of air gaps then using glass and rubber, so make sure these are sealed. When you bottled, did you use one crushed campden per 5L?

Sorry to hear about that, especially if u made 5 gallons worth. I wouldnt have thought the recipe was at fault. Here are some possible faults and cures for winemaking

 

[jamesbsmith]

If its a vinegary taste it may have oxidised :-(. Apples are very prone to oxidation (note how quickly they brown one you bite into them). If you make from real apples, one you cut them, make sure you pop them into some water and campden until you juice them, then treat the juice with a bit more. If using juice or apples, make sure as little oxygen gets to your must and wine at all times, i.e. Syphon over pouring. When using carboys, there can be more chance of air gaps then using glass and rubber, so make sure these are sealed. When you bottled, did you use one crushed campden per 5L?

Sorry to hear about that, especially if u made 5 gallons worth. I wouldnt have thought the recipe was at fault. Here are some possible faults and cures for winemaking

View attachment FAULTS AND CURES.pdf

View attachment LESSON7 -FaultsAfter Dinner.pdf

 

[endorphine44]

Do you have a one gallon demijohn? You could take out a gallon of the wine and put it into the gallon demijohn and see how that works out. You could then add 800g of sugar to the main batch and top it up with water when ferm slows. That would give you an acidity of approx 0.67 and the addition of the sugar would bring the ABV back up.

I use the Wine Calcs Spread sheet which is free from http://www.yobrew.co.uk/ to design recipes. It is without a doubt the best and most reliable wine making guide I have ever found! It cant stop the user chosing silly ingredients which just dont go, but if you know what flavours go (which is sounds like you do), it helps you know how much fruit, juice and sugar to put in to give you the right acid, tannin and alcohol levels.

Thanks jamesbsmith, that's a handy little spreadsheet. I do have an empty 1 gal I can use so I'll give that a shot and see how they turn out with different acidity levels (and I'll know what not to do next time).

 

[edroberts]

Just bottled a spur-of-the-moment run of Apfelwein from 6 weeks ago.
... this...

 

[jamesbsmith]

The spread sheet really is brilliant! I think there is a version with imperial and US measures which will make things easier for you. It takes a little while to get used to the spread sheet but I use it all the time now! I run every single recipe I think up through it and it helps me stay within drinkable parameters! I am currently drinking a wine which is very similar in ingredients to the one you are making, and its one of the best ones Ive made yet! I was really suprised how much just like sauvignon blanc it tastes when it doesnt have any grape in it!

For a UK gallon (4.5L) I used:
Apple Juice 3 litres
Canned Apricots (2 Tins) 820g
Sugar 620g
Gervin No. 5 yeast & Nutrient

For a US gallon, that would have been:
Apple Juice 2.5 litres
Canned Apricots (2 Tins) 680g
Sugar 515g
Gervin No. 5 yeast & Nutrient

I have put a load of recipes for wines I have made onto a website, which the calcs were invaluable in producing. The site has received quite some slating on here, mainly due to its incorrect title of BREW book! www.thewinemakersgoodbrewbook.com

 

[Viper2k3sr]

Finished bottling a Gewürzapfelwein (apple pie spiced apple wine) a couple weeks ago, really proud of my first attempt at an Apfelwine

 

[Dominic1920]

I have a Hansens apple strawberry version of this started right now. I'm looking forward to it.

 

[bwdilli]

I made a 6 gallon batch on 12/13/14. Tried it at a month and it was very good. Let it age in the primary and tried it again today (2/14/15) and it was even better. Keep hearing that it will blow your mind at 6 months and it has me wondering. I like it a bit too much now, how's it going to be then.

Wife is having a strange reaction to it though. She describes it as severe heartburn. Hasn't had this reaction to other forms of alcohol. I'm wondering if I use a different yeast if this reaction will go away. Used the original recipe to the letter.

 

[bwdilli]

I made a 6 gallon batch on 12/13/14. Tried it at a month and it was very good. Let it age in the primary and tried it again today (2/14/15) and it was even better. Keep hearing that it will blow your mind at 6 months and it has me wondering. I like it a bit too much now, how's it going to be then?

Wife is having a strange reaction to it though. She describes it as severe heartburn. Hasn't had this reaction to other forms of alcohol. I'm wondering if I use a different yeast if this reaction will go away. Used the original recipe to the letter.

 

[jamesbsmith]

I have read that apple wines are best drunk young (between 3 and 6 months aging), due to apples tendency to oxidise quite readily. I.e. the quick browning of apples when you have bitten them.

The addition of acid to a bitten apple (eg lemon juice) slows the oxidation process. The recipe for Apfelwein uses pure apple juice with no water added (unlike most apple wines which will use about 3/5th apple juice), which will mean that the acidity of the Apfelwein will be very high (approx 1.5% acidity is gained from fermentation, also the reason why sweetening it works). Apfelwein therefore probably does get better and better for quite a while after fermentation due to being less prone to oxidation, so after 6 months itll probably be excellent if it is great already!

The high acidity may also be the same reason for your wifes heartburn. Funnily enough I have been getting quite a bit of heartburn lately. I havent made Apfelwein, but I have been drinking more wine and strong coffee lately which can cause it. I just eat Rennies to neutralize the acidity. Id prefer to do this than drink less! I love wine and coffee (not together though)!

 

[brew_tq]

Wow. I finally got my keezer built (still need to stain and tile, but it's working!). This is one of the first two things on tap. First glass I was like mmmm, this is decent. Third glass and I'm buzzing and it's delicious!!!

 

[HebrewedsoIbrew]

Hey guys I have a question, my apfelwein came out with a very high acid taste, not sure if that's normal but it is tasty still. I was wondering what food pairings would go well with it? can anyone help me out?

 

[Dominic1920]

I noticed the acid was high with certain batches myself, back sweetening and aging seems to mellow out the harshness somewhat. but be careful if you sweeten it with more juice or concentrate with ascorbic acid. I sweetened a harshly acidic batch with bartenders simple syrup that really mellowed well and it brought the apple flavor out well.

 

[HebrewedsoIbrew]

Ah, I didn't back sweeten, I just carbonated with dextrose, I guess I can always serve it half and half with applejuice or something else sweet, it's been aging almost a year now so maybe some of it has dropped out.

 

[Dominic1920]

Ah, I didn't back sweeten, I just carbonated with dextrose, I guess I can always serve it half and half with applejuice or something else sweet, it's been aging almost a year now so maybe some of it has dropped out.

I like mixing it with 50-50% ginger ale, really makes a nice tonic. Maybe a splash of vodka and lime. yum.