Mai Bock and lager questions...

[Stlheadake]

I've brewed an Austin Homebrew MaiBock and Negro Modelo Extra Special lager extracts for my annual Cinco party. I have followed the directions to a T, and have hit the OG nearly perfect on both. After very vigorous fermentations in the primary (at room temps of around 65-68) for a week, I racked to secondary. I put them in my keezer and have them sitting at 52 degrees. My plan was to let them sit there until May at that temp.

I think I am concerned about the difference in yeasts. I used a White Labs German Bock 833 in the Maibock and Wyeast Bohemian Lager 2124 in the lager. The lager yeast obviously likes it more cool, but what about the Maibock? Is that too warm for holding them for that long? Should I cool it down a bit? I started to get them down around 48, but opted to leave them a little warmer. I don't know.

This is really my first time 'lagering' for any real length of time. I've brewed plenty of stouts and ale's that I have just let 'rest' in the secondary in the basement. But nothing ever like this at a cool temp. I just want it to come out right for my big 'reveal'.

Your thoughts are appreciated...

 

[Yooper]

I've brewed an Austin Homebrew MaiBock and Negro Modelo Extra Special lager extracts for my annual Cinco party. I have followed the directions to a T, and have hit the OG nearly perfect on both. After very vigorous fermentations in the primary (at room temps of around 65-68) for a week, I racked to secondary. I put them in my keezer and have them sitting at 52 degrees. My plan was to let them sit there until May at that temp.

I think I am concerned about the difference in yeasts. I used a White Labs German Bock 833 in the Maibock and Wyeast Bohemian Lager 2124 in the lager. The lager yeast obviously likes it more cool, but what about the Maibock? Is that too warm for holding them for that long? Should I cool it down a bit? I started to get them down around 48, but opted to leave them a little warmer. I don't know.

This is really my first time 'lagering' for any real length of time. I've brewed plenty of stouts and ale's that I have just let 'rest' in the secondary in the basement. But nothing ever like this at a cool temp. I just want it to come out right for my big 'reveal'.

Your thoughts are appreciated...

Both of those strains are lager yeast. Since they were fermented at 68 degrees, it doesn't really matter what you do with them now. Maybe lagering them will help clean them up a bit and get rid of some fruitiness. But probably not much.

From White labs:
WLP833 German Bock Lager Yeast
From the Alps of southern Bavaria, this yeast produces a beer that is well balanced between malt and hop character. The excellent malt profile makes it well suited for Bocks, Doppelbocks, and Oktoberfest style beers. Very versatile lager yeast, it is so well balanced that it has gained tremendous popularity for use in Classic American style Pilsners. Also good for Helles style lager beer.
Attenuation: 70-76%
Flocculation: Medium
Optimum Fermentation Temperature: 48-55°F

I don't know how good a steam beer made with that yeast will be, as I've never attempted it. But the Wyeast strain is supposed to be ok for making a steam beer. I've never tried that, either, though.

 

[zgoda]

W34 (Wyeast 2124) can handle short spikes to 61F without being too estery, just a bit more floral. It gets really nasty over 63F. Lagering may help a bit.

 

[osagedr]

Both of those strains are lager yeast. Since they were fermented at 68 degrees, it doesn't really matter what you do with them now.

This. I'm puzzled as to why, if you have the ability to hold a temp at 52, you wouldn't have fermented there--it would have been perfect!

 

[Stlheadake]

HOLY CRAP! I knew/know that the lager yeast like it cooler, but I thought that was more AFTER if got going. I guess I'm in for it now. I hope that it's not too bad. I did taste both when I racked them over, and they were pretty tasty, I didn't notice any fruityness, but I'm not sure that I would so early.

Thanks, now I'm scared. I'm going to drop them to 45, and hope for the best! Thanks for the replies...I'll keep biting my nails.

 

[osagedr]

Hang in there--we all have lots to learn!

 

[Stlheadake]

This. I'm puzzled as to why, if you have the ability to hold a temp at 52, you wouldn't have fermented there--it would have been perfect!

I can hold the temps there in my keezer. The issue is/was I had perishables in the keezer (now a fridge) at the time, and had to keep the temps down. When I built the keezer it was with the express understanding that it wouldn't become a fridge, but you know what they say "best laid plans". s

Now for my next lager, should I get it down to lower temps immediately? Obviously I'd wait until the fermentation process started, but how quickly then do you drop the temps? Does the cooler temps then slow the fermentation process as well? Since I'm not going to be drinking the beer until May, I could have just left it in the primary for a month, then racked over to secondary later....

So stupid, I should have planned better. I was in a hurry to get started. I didn't think the whole thing through. Well there's always next time!

 

[osagedr]

My advice for your next lager is to pitch a boatload of yeast at fermentation temperatures, or even a few degrees below as opposed to pitching above then cooling. The latter will let you get away with underpitching a bit but it's not the best practice. Try to achieve 1.5 million cells per ml per degree Plato, pitch in the mid-40s, and let it rise to the mid-to-high 40s for fermentation. Oxygenate your wort as well as you can at pitching--I've found my pure O2 system to be worth its weight in gold, but shaking or using a drill-mounted stirrer can work well too.

The key is enough yeast. For dry yeast I really like W-34/70 and it handles low temperatures well. For liquid I would recommend a stepped starter on a stir plate, chilled and decanted. Honestly for new lager brewers dry yeast (rehydrate as per manufacturer's product sheet (not package) instructions) is hard to beat. It's nice to KNOW you pitched enough yeast.

 

[ghpeel]

The key is enough yeast. For dry yeast I really like W-34/70 and it handles low temperatures well. .... Honestly for new lager brewers dry yeast (rehydrate as per manufacturer's product sheet (not package) instructions) is hard to beat. It's nice to KNOW you pitched enough yeast.

osagedr speaks the truth.