Losing too much beer in the fermenter!

[Javaslinger]

So my last batch I had 4.5 gal in the fermenter and would up losing nearly a gallon to the yeast cake/sediment/trub... Is this normal? Seems like a lot.

I'm not transferring to a secondary which I suppose would help with this, but everything says this is unnecessary. My last batch was double dry hopped (in nylon bags) and I used a yeast starter. Not sure if I have more yeast cake than typical or what...

Between the trub loss when transferring to the fermenter and the transfer to the bottling bucket, it seems like i lose almost 1.5 gallons. Seems pretty high.

What can I do to reduce this loss? Do I need to have 6.5gal post boil to wind up with 5 gallons in the bottling bucket?

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

First off you can suck up every drop of trub from the brew kettle when racking to the fermenter. It does no harm whatsoever so that will gain you some beer. Leave nothing in the BK

I usually have around an inch of yeast cake/trub after racking. I would say around a gallon so that sounds about right. I ALWAYS brew enough so my fermenter has around 6 to 6.5 gallons so I get a full 5 gallons into the keg.

Brewing more than 5 gallons is the key to getting 5 gallons finished product

 

[3gbrew]

A number of things contribute to systems loss. I usually lose at least 1to 1 1/2 qts to trub and another qt to samples. Dry hops soak up some more. So a gallon isn't too far off. My last batch started out a 6 1/2 gallons and I ended up with 56 bottles. What are you using for a fermentor?

 

[Javaslinger]

A number of things contribute to systems loss. I usually lose at least 1to 1 1/2 qts to trub and another qt to samples. Dry hops soak up some more. So a gallon isn't too far off. My last batch started out a 6 1/2 gallons and I ended up with 56 bottles. What are you using for a fermentor?

Thanks for the response. I'm using a 6.5 gal bucket for the fermenter. I dream of a day with a conical fermenter. I imagine that really helps with this..

I didn't consider Dry hopping soaking up but that makes perfect sense. Maybe I'm not so far off, but it sure seems like it!

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

You could always get one of these. Cheap enough. I have a 6.5 Ale Pail. I'm somewhat convinced to the rim they're bigger than 6.5 gallons. I usually Fill the bucket to around 2 inches below the rim and always end up with 5 gallons finished product. Never had a blowoff issue either.

https://www.googleadservices.com/pa...ahUKEwim9pWn_K7VAhVE54MKHafmBRwQvhcIQg&adurl=

 

[chickypad]

Transferring to secondary isn't going to help you, if anything I think more transfers increase the total losses. Similarly a conical isn't going to suddenly give you less trub. I'm with Jonny - dump everything in from the brew kettle, then let it compact down nicely after primary and do a single transfer. And yes you do have to plan for a little extra in the fermenter to get 5 gals finished. I find it averages about .75 gal loss per 5 gal batch, sometimes more sometimes less depending on the hop bill.

 

[flars]

You can get a better volume yield from fermentation bucket to bottling bucket by tilting the fermentation bucket a few days before bottling.

A not so precise example. One gallon of beer in the fermentor sitting flat will have a depth of one inch. Tilted one gallon of beer will have a depth of four inches. Easier to get the siphon done to the trub layer when you have more depth to extract more volume.

The trub/yeast layer will be more compact the longer your beer is in the primary.

 

[Brownalemikie]

Listen to Flars....he knows of what he speaks. He has helped me on numerous occasions.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

You can get a better volume yield from fermentation bucket to bottling bucket by tilting the fermentation bucket a few days before bottling.

A not so precise example. One gallon of beer in the fermentor sitting flat will have a depth of one inch. Tilted one gallon of beer will have a depth of four inches. Easier to get the siphon done to the trub layer when you have more depth to extract more volume.

The trub/yeast layer will be more compact the longer your beer is in the primary.

I always tilt the bucket as it gets lower to get as much out as possible. Realistically I don't think I'm getting much more beer but I do it just to get everything possible out. That being said that last tilted bit is always stirred up a bit with trub/yeast. I keg so I don't care but the OP sounds like he's bottling. He would have to tilt a few days in advance and not even tap the bucket to get any kind difference and even then it's minimal.....the key is just start with more strike water and don't worry about shorting yourself with the final product

EDIT: this is in the beginner forum so I'm thinking it might be kits where adjusting the recipe for more volume isn't possible....in that case it will take a few brews to find out the boil off rate and grain absorption to figure out a strike water level to equal desired finished product

 

[eric19312]

Cold crashing also tends to help compact the trub cake. Time helps too. Like others have said design your recipe to allow for loss so you get volume you need into your final package. I aim for 2 full kegs and design my recipe to deliver a bit more than that. I'll frequently get a dozen bottles filled after my kegs are full depending on how well the trub cake packed.

 

[applescrap]

First off you can suck up every drop of trub from the brew kettle when racking to the fermenter. It does no harm whatsoever so that will gain you some beer. Leave nothing in the BK

I usually have around an inch of yeast cake/trub after racking. I would say around a gallon so that sounds about right. I ALWAYS brew enough so my fermenter has around 6 to 6.5 gallons so I get a full 5 gallons into the keg.

Brewing more than 5 gallons is the key to getting 5 gallons finished product

This is solid advice, Imo.

 

[kh54s10]

Why are you people getting so much trub? The OP says hops were bagged. I bag my hops in both the boil and if I dry hop. I pull the hops early enough that I can squeeze out the beer. The largest layer of trub I have ever had was about 1/2 inch deep. After tilting and siphoning, if I dump the trub and leftover beer into mason jars I never get more than 2 quarts. I start the ferment with approximately 5.25 gallons and almost always get 5 gallons out.

 

[Transamguy77]

I'm with kh54s10, I make 11 gallon batches and 5.5 into each fermenter and I always have some left after filling the keg. I bag all my hops and if dry hopping I do it in the keg.

If your not cold crashing then maybe keep your beer in primary another week to help let everything drop out.

 

[applescrap]

Why are you people getting so much trub? The OP says hops were bagged. I bag my hops in both the boil and if I dry hop. I pull the hops early enough that I can squeeze out the beer. The largest layer of trub I have ever had was about 1/2 inch deep. After tilting and siphoning, if I dump the trub and leftover beer into mason jars I never get more than 2 quarts. I start the ferment with approximately 5.25 gallons and almost always get 5 gallons out.

Biab, hard squeeze, lots of hops, everything from bk dumped into fermenter, and all that leaves pretty close to a gallon of trub. Little less on low og. I need to stop waiting and get 8 gallon fermenter so i put six in easily and get 5-5.5 out.

 

[65C]

I don't use a bag but I squeeze the hops hard if the carboy is short

I'm putting an extra couple of litres in the brew kettle now so I almost always get enough

The risk is going too high on the carboy and having a blow off (I always use tubes) - I'm still working this out but there seems to be a very fine line between perfect and overfilled on carboys

Last week I thought I'd got it perfect but next day (I was reusing an existing trub) the brew fridge looked like the "I shot Marvin in the face" scene from Pulp Fiction - I was kicking myself as it must have just happened and I'd already been up 3h and not checked the fridge

 

[applescrap]

The risk is going too high on the carboy and having a blow off (I always use tubes) - I'm still working this out but there seems to be a very fine line between perfect and overfilled on carboys

Pretty much same with pail, thats why 8g bucket.

 

[seatazzz]

You also need to work a bit on your strike/sparge volumes. There are good calculators out there that take the trub/hop loss into account when calculating the water you will need. Trust me, it takes practice. Take into account your boiloff as well. There's no shame in ramping down the boil to a nice roll rather than a tempestuous inferno, that will cut down on your boiloff. +1 to what others said about dumping the entire contents of the BK into the fermenter as well. I wind up with about 3/4 gallon dead space in my keggle, I've learned to just heft the thing up and dump what's left into the fermenter to make sure my volume is good. Cold crashing also compacts the trub/hob/gunk down to a more manageable level as well.

 

[65C]

There are good calculators out there that take the trub/hop loss into account when calculating the water you will need. Trust me, it takes practice. Take into account your boiloff as well.

For me the calculators only go so far - I write everything down when I'm brewing and make a list of what I'll change next brew. Interestingly I've found a huge diff in the strike temp I need between doing 5.5KG and 4KG batches to get to mash temp - but it's taken 5+ brews to work out that diff.

 

[seatazzz]

For me the calculators only go so far - I write everything down when I'm brewing and make a list of what I'll change next brew. Interestingly I've found a huge diff in the strike temp I need between doing 5.5KG and 4KG batches to get to mash temp - but it's taken 5+ brews to work out that diff.

Yep, that's where the 'practice' comes in. I did a 16lb grain bill today and flubbed my strike temp. It all worked out in the end, but my OG was off by 6+ points and I wound up with more wort at the end of the boil than expected...NTTAWWT. Still gonna make beer.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

Yep, that's where the 'practice' comes in. I did a 16lb grain bill today and flubbed my strike temp. It all worked out in the end, but my OG was off by 6+ points and I wound up with more wort at the end of the boil than expected...NTTAWWT. Still gonna make beer.

You should mark your pot or take note of the volume after you pull the grain bag or transfer. Either add water or boil longer (pre hops) to hit the correct level. Regardless of your grain bill youll always hit your desired finished product.

 

[seatazzz]

My old 12 gallon kettle is marked, but not my keggle (at least not accurately). I keep meaning to do it, but other things get in the way...

 

[ba-brewer]

I use whirfloc and aim for 6 gals post boil, if I only need a coupe ounces of hop I throw directly in the kettle, more than that into a bag. I transfer the finished wort to a bucket post boil and allow to sit an hour or so for the crap to compact, and siphon off the clear wort for fermenting. I get a little over 5 gal into a 6.5gal bucket and a full keg in the end by slightly tilting the bucket while siphoning without cold crashing. I have maybe a quart of clean yeast and a little beer in the bottom I harvest for repitching. Dry hop in the keg or primary in a bag.

 

[TGFV]

Something I don't see being asked is how long are you letting the fermenter rest before transfering to the bottling bucket?

If you are moving the fermenter (especially over relatively long distances) you're going to be rousing and disturbing the yeast cake/trub at the bottom and causing it to be less compact and it will possibly need a few days to settle down again.