Kefir Culture

[Owly055]

Interestingly, I had just set a gallon of milk out to kefir just to experiment with cheese, about an hour before I read the post about "which culture to use".
How's that for serendipity?

As I know nothing of the "normal" procedure, I can see two options. One is to let the kefir go until it forms curds and whey, which it will do on it's own, the other is to let it go for perhaps 12 hours, then warm and add rennet, and proceed with "normal cheese making methodology"............if there is such a thing ;-) I ordered David Ascher's book. Thanks BernardSmith.

The plan with the kefir is not to take the kefir to separation, but to use rennet. I also plan to purchase a small wedge of Brie, and harvest the microbes from the rind in an attempt to do a sort of Camembert. I'll use tall cottage cheese containers for molds. I'm up in the air about weather to innoculate the cheese internally with the Brie mold, or spray the exterior lightly. I know that both have been done successfully.

For some reason, I like the idea of avoiding commercial cultures.

H.W.

 

[bernardsmith]

I've tried to make cheese from kefir itself (and there are websites that discuss this )but while I was able to make curds and press the whey out of the curds and form a firm cheese I don't know that the cheese it made was so wonderful (don't have my notes with me but I do recall that it was very crumbly - I think because of the acidity). The thing is I normally make about 1 cup of kefir a day (there is a relationship between the amount of grains you have and the volume of milk those grains can transform into kefir). and so to make a gallon it probably took me about two weeks and in those two weeks the kefir would continue to become more and more acidic (sour) - and it may be too acidic for the rennet although if you have enough grains to turn 1 gallon of milk within 24 -48 hours then that may not be an issue for you.
When I use a half cup or so to culture the gallon of milk in an hour at about 90F the souring is far less pronounced.. and I am left with some sugars in the curds - something which I think in some cheeses is quite desirable...

 

[Owly055]

I've tried to make cheese from kefir itself (and there are websites that discuss this )but while I was able to make curds and press the whey out of the curds and form a firm cheese I don't know that the cheese it made was so wonderful (don't have my notes with me but I do recall that it was very crumbly - I think because of the acidity). The thing is I normally make about 1 cup of kefir a day (there is a relationship between the amount of grains you have and the volume of milk those grains can transform into kefir). and so to make a gallon it probably took me about two weeks and in those two weeks the kefir would continue to become more and more acidic (sour) - and it may be too acidic for the rennet although if you have enough grains to turn 1 gallon of milk within 24 -48 hours then that may not be an issue for you.
When I use a half cup or so to culture the gallon of milk in an hour at about 90F the souring is far less pronounced.. and I am left with some sugars in the curds - something which I think in some cheeses is quite desirable...

Thanks.......... That is a useful observation.............. Perhaps the milk should simply be innoculated with kefir (or kefir grains) in the same manner as with an ordinary cheese culture, and left for an hour or so.

H.W.

 

[bernardsmith]

Precisely - yes. All you are doing is inoculating the milk with kefir culture (the scoby of yeast and bacteria) and not in fact making cheese from kefir (though that is certainly an interesting experiment). Thirty minutes to an hour inoculation of the kefir culture is perfect for making squeaky curd cheese, for farmhouse cheddar, for "feta" and for Caerphilly.

 

[Owly055]

I ran across this web site this morning: http://users.sa.chariot.net.au/~dna/kefir_cheese.html#Kefir-cottage-cheese
This guy seems to have done some serious experimenting using kefir without using rennet, using two basic procedures. The first and obvious one is to let the curds separate, as they do in time, and strain and ultimately press them. The other method is to heat the milk to 140, and stirring gently, simply pour a quantity of kefir into the milk slowly, then straining the curds out after the whey runs clear. The results are different in character (flavor & texture). My inclination at this point is to use rennet, and simply use kefir as an innoculant.

H.W.

 

[bernardsmith]

That was one site I was looking for to cite above but I find "Dom's" style of writing to be close to impenetrable. Also, it is hard for me to understand why the temperatures suggested are so high (140F?)... Still, the point is important: you can make cheese from kefir (not just milk inoculated with kefir) AND the pH will be so low that rennet may be unnecessary to coagulate the milk (and in fact may not work in that kind of environment). Perhaps I will try again to make a farmhouse cheddar made from kefir..

 

[Owly055]

That was one site I was looking for to cite above but I find "Dom's" style of writing to be close to impenetrable. Also, it is hard for me to understand why the temperatures suggested are so high (140F?)... Still, the point is important: you can make cheese from kefir (not just milk inoculated with kefir) AND the pH will be so low that rennet may be unnecessary to coagulate the milk (and in fact may not work in that kind of environment). Perhaps I will try again to make a farmhouse cheddar made from kefir..

It's Saturday Morning......... My copy of The Art of Natural Cheese Making should be here in the mail in about an hour minutes. I have two gallons of whole milk, plenty of kefir..... I always have home made kefir, as well as lipase, 4 packets of direct set C 101, a bottle each of liquid rennet, and calcium chloride, and some cheese muslin. I also have a 4.4 ounce round of Rosenbourg Brie. I bought a couple of 2L plastic pitchers at Ace Hardware (cheap), that are about 4.5" diameter, and cut each one in half, so now I have 4 4" tall cheese molds, each with a bit over 1L capacity, though I still need to drill holes in them. I also have half a dozen sushi mats, and a plastic cutting board that I made saw cuts just over half way through about half an inch apart in opposite directions from each side so it is perforated to drain well. This will lay in the small tote that will hold the rounds during aging.
This afternoon, I plan to do a cheese project using kefir as an innoculant, as well as lipase, calcium chloride, and scrapings from the surface of the brie... which hasn't been opened yet..... I'll simply scrape the white dust off the surface of the brie, right into the milk.
Of the product of this experiment, I hope to get two rounds of brie, and the remainder will be hung in cheese muslin for 24 hours, and brined as feta. I'll save the whey and add some half and half to it, and some vinegar, and make whey ricotta.
I don't think the mold culture will have any real effect on the feta as it will be stored in brine.

H.W.

 

[bernardsmith]

Sounds as if you are ready to go. Good luck!

 

[Owly055]

I haven't been able to put the book down!!........ Exciting stuff! I make tons of kefir, and basically everything I need can be supplied by the kefir, except rennet and calcium carbonate........

Sounds as if you are ready to go. Good luck!

I got so wrapped up in reading The Art of Natural Cheesemaking, that I changed my plan and am currently starting my cheese. First off, I wanted freshly cultured kefir for starter, and that means about 24 hours. Second, I realized from reading the book that kefir should already contain geotrichium candidum, but probably not penicillium candidum, so I decided to open my Brie and innoculate the kefir I was making with rind. Third, I've been "over sharing", and my supply of feta is getting depleted rapidly, so I wanted to start with 3 gallons of milk, 1/3 of which will be Brie or Camembert, and the remainder will be feta, an I didn't have enough milk, and the nearest town is 20 miles away..... I usually go to Big Timber, Mt (nearest town) Saturday evening to see my favorite bartender, a lady who has been serving me since 1984, and is a dear friend. That was an opportunity to bring her some feta......which she had asked me for, and shared around the bar / restaurant (a high end eatery called The Grand Hotel..... the social center of Big Timber). Everybody loved it..... or pretended to ;-), and to get another gallon of milk. I also picked up a rubbermaid container......... rectangualar 2L, which I drilled, and plan to use for a feta mold.... (about 4x9).

I'm currently heating my milk on the induction hotplate (Costco special), and using my Annova to circulate the milk..........without heat.

H.W.

 

[Owly055]

My cheese making is done including cleanup for about 24 hours except flipping cheeses. 2 mini Brie... really Camembert, and one nice substantial hunk of Feta. I'm not really happy with the Ricotta..... but it was a learning experience. It's going to be interesting to see how much the Brie wheels shrink. Currently they are about 4.5" diameter and 3" tall., and they've been sitting awhile. Hopefully they will shrink down to about 1.5" tall.

H.W.

 

[bernardsmith]

My guess is that you are right and the brie will likely shrink to about half the thickness..

 

[Owly055]

I've tried to make cheese from kefir itself (and there are websites that discuss this )but while I was able to make curds and press the whey out of the curds and form a firm cheese I don't know that the cheese it made was so wonderful (don't have my notes with me but I do recall that it was very crumbly - I think because of the acidity). The thing is I normally make about 1 cup of kefir a day (there is a relationship between the amount of grains you have and the volume of milk those grains can transform into kefir). and so to make a gallon it probably took me about two weeks and in those two weeks the kefir would continue to become more and more acidic (sour) - and it may be too acidic for the rennet although if you have enough grains to turn 1 gallon of milk within 24 -48 hours then that may not be an issue for you.
When I use a half cup or so to culture the gallon of milk in an hour at about 90F the souring is far less pronounced.. and I am left with some sugars in the curds - something which I think in some cheeses is quite desirable...

I chose to add kefir in the quantity Ascher suggests. 1/4 cup per gallon, with a one hour incubation period before adding the rennet. I allowed this batch to dry and ripen in the open air at my room temp for 48 hours. My room temp this time of year is in the high 50's to low 60's....... I like a cool house. The result seemed to be good. I had to cut my rectangular hunk of feta in two to fit in my brine container, so I was able to sample it, and it had excellent flavor development. I salted the cheeses when I removed them from the molds. My feta brine is 1/4 C salt and 1/4 cup vinegar in 1/2 gallon of whey.

H.W.

 

[HausBrauerei_Harvey]

let me know how your brie/camembert goes. I was also thinking of cutting the rind off some fresh camembert I have in the fridge and dumping it in a batch to get the pennicillen needed to get a nice white skin for my first camembert.

 

[HausBrauerei_Harvey]

also are you just using standard supermarket milk? I get my milk from a local dairy delivered, it's great milk for the kids. but it's pricey and my wife has questioned the economics of my cheese making endeavor, currently in it's initial stages. If I could just use supermarket milk with similar results the cost would be cut in half.

 

[bernardsmith]

also are you just using standard supermarket milk? I get my milk from a local dairy delivered, it's great milk for the kids. but it's pricey and my wife has questioned the economics of my cheese making endeavor, currently in it's initial stages. If I could just use supermarket milk with similar results the cost would be cut in half.

Try it. If the supermarket's milk is not pasteurized at too high a temperature then it will make a pretty good cheese (it may not have all the complexity of cheese made from raw milk). The one thing that you may need to add is about 1/4 t of Calcium Chloride per gallon to repair the damage to the milk that pasteurization at even lower temperatures causes. UHT pasteurized milk cannot be repaired and so "organic" milk which is often pasteurized at very high temperatures will not work. For the record, I use supermarket milk and have not had any problems when I add the Ca Cl.