KBS Clone Recipe in Zymurgy!

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Ok, so.......Life has really been a little too busy. I moved, rehabbed the house, and have not brewed in months. I feel as though there is a void in my life. I lost 45 lbs. and life is good (besides not brewing).

This stuff turned out awesome! Out of everyone who has tried it, AND Founders. I have had one person tell me they like the original better. It is the same thing, but different. It is THE best brew I have done to date. (since 2002) I bottled 90% of it after keg carbing and DAMN it ages very well.

If you want KBS this year, which looks like it will be very hard to find, and you can't find it. Brew this!

I will use real cocoa nibs next time though. The chocolate level could have been a little more noticeable. I have also thought about doing the Canadian version of this with some real maple syrup.
 
JOHN51277 said:
This stuff turned out awesome! Out of everyone who has tried it, AND Founders. I have had one person tell me they like the original better. It is the same thing, but different. It is THE best brew I have done to date. (since 2002) I bottled 90% of it after keg carbing and DAMN it ages very well.

If you want KBS this year, which looks like it will be very hard to find, and you can't find it. Brew this!
Click to expand...

This sounds awesome. I will have to put it on the "to brew" list. Thanks for updating.
A friend of mine drove 2 hours to the KBS release party last weekend and it was all gone before he got to try it. So he had to go to plan B: Nemesis and Looking Glass
 
I just put mine one tap from a brewing last September. At my last HBC meeting I brought a bottle, and during a night of commercial beer tasting (about 50 beers) it was agreed to be the 2nd best thing there. With the best being a 5 year old Samichlaus Bier...

I just bought some KBS, but have not done a side by side yet. For my own tastes, I'd keep the recipe as is except double the oak and maybe increase the bourbon by 25-50%. But that's a personal preference because I like a more pronounced bourbon barrel flavor.
 
I get no oak and little bourbon flavor as is. Chocolate and coffee dominate. Coffee in aroma and chocolate in flavor. It's delicious, but I need a bit more. Swapping some base malt for sugar worked out great. Final gravity at kegging was about 1.016. That dry for this big a beer makes it wonderfully drinkable.
 
I brought a bottle of this to a tasting at Goose Island (1st Thursday of every month). One of their assistant brewers tried it and gave me some very positive feedback. My version turned out a little heavy on the coffee, but he was impressed with it nonetheless. To quote him "I would brew this and sell it easily".

Yesterday my buddy tells me Goose Island is releasing a beer named "Big John" that is a RIS with heavy coffee/chocolate undertones. Now, I don't think for a second the taste of my beer inspired "Big John", after all, they'd probably already brewed theirs at that point and it was aging, but the announcement of this beer release certainly explains why he was interested in my beer.

This beer is amazing. I'd recommend it to anybody with a ton of patience and a bunch of empty 22oz bomber bottles laying around.
 
My update. We cracked the first bottle on New Years and have been drinking a bottle at the beginning of every month (gave a bunch away for Christmas). I have enough to drink one a month for the next year and then one every new years for the next five years. We are thinking of making this an annual brew and every New Years having a vertical tasting. We'll see if I have the self control :D

Anyhow this weekend we did a side by side tasting with KBS. Mine was blind. I misidentified both aroma and appearance, and only after 5 minutes of deliberation did I identify mine by taste. They are pretty fricking close. Definitely the closest clone I've ever brewed. Small differences, even though I finished at 1.029 we thought the KBS was a bit sweeter. Mine had a bit more bourbon in the nose but the KBS has more bourbon flavor. The KBS has a little more oak too. If I were to do anything different, I would leave it on the oak longer than the 3 months I did.

I highly recommend this recipe.
 
MI_Craig said:
How long did you guys end up leaving it in the secondary with the oak?
Click to expand...

Three months on 3oz of oak cubes. I might go longer this year to up the oakiness or use more oak. If you're not aware, read up on the difference between cubes versus chips. I guess you only want to use chips for a couple of weeks.
 
My friends and I are brewing this up this weekend. 50 gallons of it going into a bourbon barrel in a couple of weeks.
 
Does anybody know why this recipe calls for fermentation at such a low temperature? I thought the yeast that it calls for usually ferments at a normal room temp. Am I missing something?
 
Am I right in reading that you only pour 1 cup of bourbon into 5 gallons of this beer? I made a stout last year with 1 cup and it was barely noticeable IMO...
 
dannypo said:
That is about normal for most yeasts. I rarely start fermentation above 65.
Click to expand...


http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/strains_wlp001.html
WLP001 California Ale Yeast
This yeast is famous for its clean flavors, balance and ability to be used in almost any style ale. It accentuates the hop flavors and is extremely versatile.
Attenuation: 73-80%
Flocculation: Medium
Optimum Fermentation Temperature: 68-73°F
Alcohol Tolerance: High
Click to expand...

Where are you getting your information from? Is there some unwritten rule to ferment well under the recommended temperature?
 
I try to chill down to 65-70. I keep my fridge at 65. The beer should produce some of it's own heat, which would likely raise the temp a few degrees to hit the 68 White Labs states.

Plus, it's not that the beer will not ferment, or that it won't be as good a couple of degree lower, but might be harder to start, or take longer to finish.

As with most everything else in brewing, there is wiggle room in this. I doubt that setting your temp controller for 68 instead of 65 is going to make a noticeable difference in the final product.
 
SonicUrineBoy said:
http://www.whitelabs.com/beer/strains_wlp001.html


Where are you getting your information from? Is there some unwritten rule to ferment well under the recommended temperature?
Click to expand...

I am guessing the information came from the brewer.

001/1056 has a fairly wide range of fermentation temps. Lower temps result in a cleaner beer with less esters. Higher-temps result in more "fruity" flavors and the potential for some "off-flavors", though this strain is relatively forgiving in this respect.

Commercial brewers sometimes ferment at higher temperatures as the nature of tall, cylindroconical fermenters inhibits ester formation. Thus, homebrewers often ferment at relatively lower temps to end up with a similar flavor profile.

Fermentation temps used by a specific brewer are usually the result of experimentation, experience, type of fermenter, etc.

Banish the notion of "room temperature" fermentation if you're interested in making the best beer. Fermentation temperature control is absolutely critical to beer quality.

Michael
 
datamike said:
I am guessing the information came from the brewer.

001/1056 has a fairly wide range of fermentation temps. Lower temps result in a cleaner beer with less esters. Higher-temps result in more "fruity" flavors and the potential for some "off-flavors", though this strain is relatively forgiving in this respect.

Commercial brewers sometimes ferment at higher temperatures as the nature of tall, cylindroconical fermenters inhibits ester formation. Thus, homebrewers often ferment at relatively lower temps to end up with a similar flavor profile.

Fermentation temps used by a specific brewer are usually the result of experimentation, experience, type of fermenter, etc.

Banish the notion of "room temperature" fermentation if you're interested in making the best beer. Fermentation temperature control is absolutely critical to beer quality.

Michael
Click to expand...

Thanks. This is all valuable information to me. I'm relatively new to homebrewing (About to start my 4th brew) so this is all helpful. The reason I asked my initial question is because I have yet to acquire a fridge for fermentation, and wanted to know if it is needed or worth buying one for this brew. I don't have much room for a full size fridge, but would like something smaller. I'm hoping to find a minifridge that is big enough for my carboy.
 
I plugged this recipe into Beersmith (first time using this software) and I am coming up with IBU of 24.4. The founders KBS comes in at 70 IBU's am i missing the baot somewhere?

Joe
 
I just brewed this one last weekend- I'm planning on adding bacon vodka and priming with maple syrup - the wort smelled great, can't wait to try it.
 
Sneak any? Between friends & family who were equally horrified and curious, the batch is almost gone!

When I tested this, I tried a 2 experiments:
1. I put 1 Tbsp of homemade bacon vodka into 1/2 bottle of Sam Smith's Oatmeal Stout, and it was delicious.

2. I made a batch of bacon bourbon, and I added 1 tbsp of that to the other 1/2 bottle of Sam Smith's, and I didn't care for that as much.

So, I planned on one ounce of the same homemade bacon vodka per bottle of this stout. I improvised a bit and used Starbuck's Anniversary coffee brewed extra strong at the end of the boil. After a lot of reading, I decided to skip the maple syrup, and primed with brown sugar instead, which I dissolved in more Starbuck's instead of water.

To summarize, the beer is great, although in my opinion, the bacon vodka isn't as present as I had hoped. The coffee is prominent, and the dark chocolate is noticible. The smokiness from the vodka nicely rounds out the stout, and I would definitely make this again, although I would try for a more intense bacon flavor than I currently have.
 
Curious on the batch size here to those that have brewed it.
The recipe at the beginning of this thread is for 5 gallons. I would assume that with the amount of yeast, trub, cocoa,etc...that there's a lot of loss going into secondary. So do I scale this up to say 6 gallons to account for that?
 
mthhurley said:
Curious on the batch size here to those that have brewed it.
The recipe at the beginning of this thread is for 5 gallons. I would assume that with the amount of yeast, trub, cocoa,etc...that there's a lot of loss going into secondary. So do I scale this up to say 6 gallons to account for that?
Click to expand...

I had the same thought, but i was a little more conservative - I went with 5 1/2 gallons, and left it in the primary for 2 weeks to get a nice, compact trub- I ended up with 52 12 oz bottles
 
Sorry-
For my batch I didn't us the grounds - I used strong brewed coffee at the end of the boil, and I also primed with strong coffee (instead of water) and brown sugar.
The coffee flavor works with the chocolate- and are the biggest flavors in the beer.
 
Well this is in primary, brewed it yesterday and went pretty smooth until the very end. I will note the following to those that don't know.

Do NOT try and use a March Pump to recirc the kettle. Mine plugged instantly with cocoa nibs (and that took an hour to disassemble and clean). I for some reason thought those would melt into nothing...They do not. I put the straight coffee grounds into the kettle at flameout and when I drained, I put it through a filter sock. This was another very long and messy process. While it caught 95% of the grounds, it took a very long time to drain.

All in all, this smells and tastes awesome. I came in at 73% efficiency and got exactly 6 gallons into my fermentor at 1.089, a touch light, but it'll do. I coulda boiled down a bit more and hit the mark but was so worried about trub loss, I decided not too.
 
Well, its time to brew this again. I am using the same recipe, but I am changing up the chocolate, and bourbon, I am adding more this time around. Of both. And just a tad less coffee. I am doing one oz at flame out. I am doing 1.5 oz cold press. Should be good. I ended up at 158 for infusion mash. Little higher than I wanted. I still have about a 12er of this left from the original brew date.
 
Not very good on the efficiency. I ended at 1.081. Got it cooled down to about 68, pitched the yeast and set it right next to the 2row/Citra SMaSH brew I did yesterday. Hard to believe its been about 8 months since Ive brewed. Glad I got it going again! Now I need to clean some kegs and lines.
 
The OG of this is about 20 points lower than real KBS. Has anyone tried brewing this with a grain bill of 1.110 to match the 11.2% ABV?
 
stevehollx said:
The OG of this is about 20 points lower than real KBS. Has anyone tried brewing this with a grain bill of 1.110 to match the 11.2% ABV?
Click to expand...

Yep, first time I brewed this here was my grist. OG 1.11. FG 1.029. 81% efficiency. I figured the bourbon closed the gap on the ABV. Blind taste test was almost indistinguishable except Founder's had a little more chocolate flavor and a little more carbonation. But both were very minor.

Style: Imperial Stout
Batch: 5.00 galAll Grain

Characteristics
---------------
Recipe Gravity: 1.111 OG
Recipe Bitterness: 67 IBU
Recipe Color: 53° SRM
Estimated FG: 1.029
Alcohol by Volume: 10.7%
Alcohol by Weight: 8.4%

Ingredients
-----------
American black patent 0.62 lb, Grain, Mashed
American chocolate malt 0.88 lb, Grain, Mashed
American two-row 15.00 lb, Grain, Mashed
Crystal 120L 0.62 lb, Grain, Mashed
Flaked oats 1.50 lb, Adjunct, Mashed
Roasted barley 0.88 lb, Grain, Mashed

Nugget 1.25 oz, Pellet, 60 minutes
Willamette 1.25 oz, Pellet, 25 minutes
Willamette 1.75 oz, Pellet, 10 minutes
 
Brewed this last night. Did it BIAB style so I only brewed 3 gallons. And yes, the consensus is correct: NIBS SUCK. I too thought they were just chocolate and would just dissolve. Not the case.

This was sludge. Can't decide how/when to do the bourbon and oak though. Hard to know who to believe in this crazy HBT place...

Brew day pics for posterity:

- Boil Additions (most additions I've ever...added)
- BrewPal tells me it was 74% efficiency...hopefully I can get my OG down to 1.022. We shall see.
- OG (1.093!) - Biggest beer I've ever

SWMBO helped out and LOVED the smell of it post-boil. Can't wait to see how this turns out.

I'll update as soon as I take my FG in a few weeks.
 
peregrinebio said:
Yep, first time I brewed this here was my grist. OG 1.11. FG 1.029. 81% efficiency. I figured the bourbon closed the gap on the ABV. Blind taste test was almost indistinguishable except Founder's had a little more chocolate flavor and a little more carbonation. But both were very minor.

Style: Imperial Stout
Batch: 5.00 galAll Grain

Characteristics
---------------
Recipe Gravity: 1.111 OG
Recipe Bitterness: 67 IBU
Recipe Color: 53° SRM
Estimated FG: 1.029
Alcohol by Volume: 10.7%
Alcohol by Weight: 8.4%

Ingredients
-----------
American black patent 0.62 lb, Grain, Mashed
American chocolate malt 0.88 lb, Grain, Mashed
American two-row 15.00 lb, Grain, Mashed
Crystal 120L 0.62 lb, Grain, Mashed
Flaked oats 1.50 lb, Adjunct, Mashed
Roasted barley 0.88 lb, Grain, Mashed

Nugget 1.25 oz, Pellet, 60 minutes
Willamette 1.25 oz, Pellet, 25 minutes
Willamette 1.75 oz, Pellet, 10 minutes
Click to expand...


Mash temp? Fermentation temp? time in primary/secondary/bottles?
 
What my brother went with when he brewed it late last year and it turned out amazingly close to KBS...

Mash temp: 152-154F
Fermentation temp: 68 (approx...RDWHAHB)
Time in primary: 1 month
Secondary: 2 months
Bottles: After 3 weeks it tasted amazing.
 

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