Imperial Stout advice

[brewmeister13]

I'm gearing up to go for my second Imperial Stout and was looking for some feed back from the community. I've decided to back off of my first recipe and shoot for an RIS around only 11.5-12% this time.

I'm looking for a good roast character, both in the nose and taste, with some underlying dark fruits (raisins and others), supported by a strong malty backbone. Here is what I have so far:

17 Lbs Rahr 2-row (it's of the Canadian variety)
4 Lbs Avangard Munich Malt
1.5 Lbs Bairds Roasted Barley
1.25 Lbs Special B
1 Lb Victory
.75 Lb Midngiht Wheat
.5 lb Bairds Black Patent

1.25 Lbs Turbinado

My OG should be around 1.100 and I'm shooting to finish rather dry for an RIS at around 1.020 (probably a bit higher, but I found if I shoot for 1.020 I'll at least get under 1.030). To achieve this I'm looking to mash at 151-152 for 90 minutes.

Anything pop out as way off or suggestions?

 

[brewmeister13]

Sweet, it must be the perfect recipe! (what a shameless bump)

 

[fantomlord]

I'd consider dropping the midnight wheat--with all that roast and the black patent, it'll be nice and dark already. You could add in some flaked barley for head retention, or some chocolate malt for a little more complexity. I might back off just a bit on the special B as well--1lb should be good there.

And if you'll be short of 11.5% if you go from 100 to 20.

 

[Seven]

I agree with fantomlord's suggestion on the flaked barley and chocolate malt... what hops and yeast are you thinking of using?

 

[brewmeister13]

I might back off just a bit on the special B as well--1lb should be good there.

And if you'll be short of 11.5% if you go from 100 to 20.

I've been debating going down to 1lb of special B and doing .25 of caramunich, but am on the fence. I'll definitely give it some more thought though.

As far as going from 1.100-1.020 and being 11.5%, it all depends on the equation being used. http://www.brewersfriend.com/abv-calculator/ I tend to prefer the alternate equation for higher alcohol beers, safer to over shoot than under in my opinion. Down toward the bottom there is a link to the explanation of the equations if you are interested.

I agree with fantomlord's suggestion on the flaked barley and chocolate malt... what hops and yeast are you thinking of using?

I'll look into the flaked barley, but my last batch didn't have a head retention problem and it was very similar to this one.

I'll be using WLP007 on this one and am fairly confident on being able to get it to attenuate fully, last batch went from 1.135-1.038 before crapping out (which is why I'm dropping to OG on this one). I'll be bittering with Magnum and using Sterling at 20 minutes.

 

[gometz]

I would swap out the Victory or reduce it. With such a large beer you have a lot of body already built in, no need to push it.

I also agree with the comment on the Midnight wheat, I'd use a little chocolate instead.

 

[MaxStout]

Keep some DME handy in case you don't hit your OG. The efficiency of those big beers can suffer some. With my RIS I hit only about 65% with a fine crush and BIAB, when I usually get close to 80% for lower gravity beers.

 

[Calder]

Batch size? You have to have crappy efficiency to get 1.100 in 5 gallons.

Why high gravity beers? You say your last one was 1.135. They are your beers, I like to drink a few myself.

I'd cut the mid-wheat and the black, and replace with choc.

If you want any hope of making 80% attenuation, mash lower; about 148.

 

[gometz]

Since MaxStout brought up efficiency, if you are worried just add about 1 lb of rice hulls. I can't believe how much they help out. I have gotten over 80% on a 1.080 beer before.

 

[brewmeister13]

I'm aiming for a 6 gallon batch, my efficiency was pretty low last time and at a 6 gallon batch I had enough to fill a 5 gallon carboy up to the neck to secondary. I plan to bulk age for 9 months or so.

I'm not too worried about efficiency, I have DME in case of emergency, but will work on the fly to adjust as needed to hit post boil gravity.

I'm curious why everyone is suggesting ditching the midnight wheat? I'm not really looking to use chocolate malt as I don't want a chocolatey stout, but figured the MW could help add some depth to the roast character. Plus the couple of times I've worked with it I really liked it.

 

[jperry]

I'd personally ditch the Black Patent Malt, and keep the Midnight Wheat Malt.

I've noticed a lot of brewers, are splitting up the roasted malts additions, between two or more varieties to get a smoother roast character.

For example, I read that Firestone Walker's "Wookey Jack", uses a blend of 50% Carafa III, and 50% Midnight Wheat, to create the roasty flavors. The brewer mentioned it tasting better blended, rather than using a single Roasted Malt.

 

[brewmeister13]

Well, thanks guys. I made some minor tweaks; lowered the Special B to 1 lb, added in 6 oz of caramunich, and dropped the pale malt to 16.5# to compensate. I'm debating on adding some oats in leu of flaked barley (this really awesome side by side helped me decide on oats https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/stout-experiment-rolled-oats-vs-flaked-barley-vs-flaked-rye-vs-flaked-wheat-201483/)) since it's what I have on hand. I think I'm going to roll with the dark grains as is. I was a little worried that 2.75#'s may be a bit much, but no one really mentioned the amount, just the types. I'm also going to be adding all roasted grain and crystal after the mash, during vorlauf. So I think that will help keep astringency to a minimum. Hopefully I'll get to this in a couple of weeks.