Honey to Fermenter

[dodsonish]

Hello all,
First post here. Would like to thank all for contributions over the years. I've read through a lot of threads to help get started with my small all grain set up.

I'm on my third brew and have a honey ale that the recipe called for adding the honey after initial fermentation when getting approx 1 bubble per minute. I did this on day 3 in the fermenter. Everything I've read on adding honey says the fermentation should take off again, but I've not seen this happen yet and it has been about 36 hours since adding the honey.

Should I be concerned? And is there anything I should do to help the fermentation start rolling again? Its sitting at 70-71 degrees.

 

[Legume]

Unpasturized honey tends to ferment very slowly, I would not worry too much...just plan for a long secondarry to let if finish. You may not see a dramatic uptic in fermentation like you would if you had added a comperable amount of some other sugar.

I dont know why but honey added to the boil seems much more readily frementable.

I prefer the flavor of uncooked honey in beer, it just takes longer to ferment.

 

[dodsonish]

Thanks for the rply. The recipe doesn't call for a secondary fermentation. Actually suggests to bottle at 10 days. The recipe did call for mixing the honey with water, and I believe the honey used was pasteurized, which mine is not. Maybe I should transfer to secondary in a couple days and give it another week or so since I didn't water down the honey. Here's the instructions, and link to the recipe.

http://tastybrew.mobify.me/newrcp/detail/946

Fermentation
Procedure heat mash water at 164 degrees F, your mash strike temp should be around 152-155 degrees F. mash at strike temp for 65-90 mins. sparge at 172 degrees and collect sugar water wort. Boil add water if needed to complete wort at 5.00 gallons. use an oz of brewers gold leaf hops when wort reaches boil, boil for 65 mins. let cool to 75-80 degrees F. After wort is cooled ferment in carboy or bucket. add yeast. when bubbling in rubber stopper has reached 1 bubble per minute add pure honey mixed in water, I use busy bee clover pure honey. use about a cup with water and mix well. Add let ferment more for about 2-3 days after bubbling in fermentation container stops. Use half a cup of corn sugar (dextrose) then bottle. let sit 2-3 days cool and get drunk.... just kidding enjoy greatly with this honey taste of delightful home brew taste.

 

[cjgenever]

DON'T TRANSFER! Secondaries are a lie. It will only slow the ferment. Honey should be mixed with hot water and dispensed into the fermenter towards the end of fermentation before the yeast fall out of suspension. Give the fermenter a swirl before adding it to get the beer moving and another after. Nothing vigorous... You want to mix things, not add o2.

At this point I'd add yeast energizer and give it a swirl. Up the ferment temp a little. keeping it in proper ferment range, of course.

 

[cjgenever]

I'm not clear... did you, or did you not, mix the honey with water? If you didn't then that's the problem. It's so viscous it simply sinks to the bottom and sits there. Diluting with water allows it to mix more evenly with the beer allowing more yeast/sugar contact within a given time. This is why it seems to ferment better when added to the boil.

 

[dodsonish]

Did not add water. Should I give it a swirl since its been in a couple days? Add energizer then swirl?

 

[Kahless]

Unless something else is wrong energizer shouldn't be needed. A gentle stir/swirl for a minute to get the honey mixed into everything should do it. That will get the yeast going about their business too. For this, I sometimes just stand above the fermenter and lift it in one hand inbetween my legs via the handle, and rotate it gently back and forth, making sure to slow at the ends of each rotation to stop it splashing. Doing this for a minute or two should help. If the airlock is a bubbler or three piece and not a blow off tube, be very careful about suck-back if you lift or shake the fermenter!
Keep the temp up at 70 if you can.

 

[Gameface]

Sorry that I'm not really adding advice but the instructions have you using the airlock as a "ferment-o-meter"?!?! Airlocks are not calibrated measurement devices and shouldn't be used to gauge fermentation.

That said, in time the yeast will eat that honey. They want it and they will have it.

 

[dodsonish]

Decided to move to the secondary before adding any energizer or pitching more yeast. 10 days in the primary and the gravity was at 1.008, so I think it's done. OG was light at 1.039 because of a bad conversion ratio, so it's sitting at 4.1% and little under where I would like the honey flavor and aroma to be. I'm ok with the 4.1%, it's nice to have a light beer in the fridge, and the body is ok, but would priming with honey boost the aroma and flavor a little? Or should I add more to the secondary and pitch more yeast?

 

[cjgenever]

More info on this subject...

The honey not mixed with water creates too high an osmotic pressure. The yeast are unable to ferment it. The only honey that can be fermented is the surface material as it slowly mixes into solution.

 

[Fathand]

I think there are some very common misconceptions in this thread about the use of honey.

The honey not mixed with water creates too high an osmotic pressure. The yeast are unable to ferment it. The only honey that can be fermented is the surface material as it slowly mixes into solution.

I am not trying to sound like a jerk but where did you get this information from? I make mead and normally do not completely mix the honey with water prior. In batches where I've used 12+ lbs of honey with a 4 inch layer of honey sitting at the bottom of the fermentor the yeast had no issue eating all of it. Yeast are hungry little buggers.

Also honey is basically 100% fermentable so it imparts hardly any flavor or aroma unless it makes up a major portion of the fermentables. The original poster does not say how much honey they've added but I surmise that it being a Honey Ale it can't be more than a pound or two. If you want honey flavor in a beer you really need to add honey malt.

 

[dodsonish]

So now that it in secondary, is adding honey mixed with water OK? And if so should I pitch more yeast?

 

[Fathand]

More yeast is not necessary because as you stated the gravity is at 1.008.
It more than likely is done fermenting and the yeast is still heatthy.

As for adding honey it will not add honey flavor but just boost the ABV and dry the ale out more. If that is what you are looking for then just add it.

If you add honey plus water you are just diluting the final product with a slight increase in ABV.

If it were me I would just leave it as is and package it up.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[dodsonish]

Also honey is basically 100% fermentable so it imparts hardly any flavor or aroma unless it makes up a major portion of the fermentables. The original poster does not say how much honey they've added but I surmise that it being a Honey Ale it can't be more than a pound or two. If you want honey flavor in a beer you really need to add honey malt.

Honey malt in the grain bill. Brewed a 3 gallon batch, and added 1/2 cup of honey.

 

[dodsonish]

More yeast is not necessary because as you stated the gravity is at 1.008.
It more than likely is done fermenting and the yeast is still heatthy.

As for adding honey it will not add honey flavor but just boost the ABV and dry the ale out more. If that is what you are looking for then just add it.

If you add honey plus water you are just diluting the final product with a slight increase in ABV.

If it were me I would just leave it as is and package it up.


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

I didnt see your response before posting about adding more honey. Great info. Just what I was looking for. It shall go to the bottle. I'll prime with honey, just because it feels right.

 

[cjgenever]

I think there are some very common misconceptions in this thread about the use of honey.



I am not trying to sound like a jerk but where did you get this information from? I make mead and normally do not completely mix the honey with water prior. In batches where I've used 12+ lbs of honey with a 4 inch layer of honey sitting at the bottom of the fermentor the yeast had no issue eating all of it. Yeast are hungry little buggers.

Also honey is basically 100% fermentable so it imparts hardly any flavor or aroma unless it makes up a major portion of the fermentables. The original poster does not say how much honey they've added but I surmise that it being a Honey Ale it can't be more than a pound or two. If you want honey flavor in a beer you really need to add honey malt.

My information is from John Palmer and Zainasheff agreed with him on the osmotic pressure of concentrated sugars.

Do you ferment you're mead in a week without swirling the **** out of it?
I didn't say it won't ferment. I said the only thing fermenting is the surface layer of the honey and that takes longer.

 

[1van]

I have a tripel that I added honey to in primary (Secondaries are a MYTH!) added the honey right after high krausen and let it sit for a month. You can see the layer of honey sitting at the bottom of the fermenter. Only lasted about 7 days.. ready to bottle and condition. But I also added honey to a cream ale I did just to boost abv a bit and dry the beer out. added that @15 minutes of boil. Honey is a great tool to manipulate the mouthfeel and/or abv if you know what you are looking for, but I really dont think it does much in the way of flavor. honey malt is the answer there

 

[dodsonish]

Why do you say secondaries are a myth?

 

[Gameface]

Why do you say secondaries are a myth?

Secondaries aren't a myth, but I think a lot of the attitudes against them has to do with the fact that many people were sold secondaries and instructions said to use them, but in the end the instructions and the secondaries just caused more trouble than they were worth so people are resentful.

 

[cjgenever]

The only time there is a secondary ferment is with fruit or bugs. The definition newbies have of a secondary is completely false and a serious problem in Homebrewing.

Giving a newb a secondary is a great way for lhbs to make a few extra bucks is all. It ensures that the uneducated brewer will make poor quality beer. How is it that with all the good info at the forefront of Homebrewing there are still lhbs sending newbs home with kit and kilos telling them to transfer as soon as the bubbler slows.

Secondaries are not a myth, but they should be viewed that way because only the advanced homebrewer needs them.

 

[1van]

^^+1

I use the term myth because, outside of fruit or spiced ale that I make, it has actually no true advantage (I dont do sours so cant speak to that). Just leaving the beer in primary longer saves a step that could lead to infection and truly has left me with cleaner beer

 

[dodsonish]

This beer turned out good. I think the fast track to drinking it in the recipe keeps it short of becoming a really good beer. I think it will do really well over the next few weeks in the bottle.

 

[1van]

glad it is ok. this forum has a wealth of experience on it and it is alway better to research before brewing, thus saving yourself from post titles like "emergency help needed asap" and the like. it almost always comes down to the cliche' of rdwhahb...... but truer words have seldom been spoken. the beer almost wants to make itself and you just have to go thru the motions to help it along