Help pick beers to brew for black and tan

[gregkeller]

Ok, so i'm pretty new to this whole thing, done some extract brews, skeeter pee, apfelwein, but now I'm going to get into all grain. I've got so many options that i'm not sure what way to go. So I've got a 3 tap keezer that is just about finished, and was thinking i'll have a keg of apfelwein to go into it along with two other beers. I'm thinking of doing two beers that would let me get also have the option of a killer black and tan. Anyone have ideas on two brews that would work well alone, as well as together? I won't be able to pour the stout/porter with nitrogen, so I don't know if that would have an effect or not. I think i'd like to do something other than a standard Bass clone, and Guiness clone, mainly because i'm not a huge fan of guiness and find it kind of watered down for what I expect from a stout. So maybe something a little more robust? I really love oatmeal stouts like Samuel smith, but never had a black and tan with one of them, so not sure how good that would be. Any ideas would be great. Thanks

 

[Dynachrome]

Someone correct me if you disagree.

I think it helps to have a wide gap in specific gravity between the two beers you are Black N Tanning

Here is one that is very popular and fairly easy for the light:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/first-all-gain-attempt-ed-worts-haus-pale-ale-164288/

...the link to the original thread is in the second post. There are like 500 pages of replies there.

Here is another one that I tried and liked. You should look around for others according to your tastes:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/edmund-fitzgerald-porter-clone-byo-205229/

Post a picture when you get them done.

 

[Guess42]

The problem is a black and tan separates due to the fg difference. So the stout has to be thin to float, hence why guinness works. Any dry stout recipe will work with any pale recipe.

 

[rednekhippiemotrcyclfreak]

I think Guess42 is right about the dry stout (black) part of this. As far as the tan part goes, I prefer something considerably hoppier than Bass as well. APA's and IPA's make really good tan in the black and...

Only slightly off topic... since you'll have a stout to play with, have you ever had a Car Bomb?

 

[gregkeller]

I guess i could just pick beers that end up at different enough gravities so they don't readily mix as long as they are poured carefully. I wonder how different the final gravities would have to be so they don't easily mix. I had some sam smith oatmeal stout and sierra nevada pale ale the other day, and it was pretty tasty, but they mixed way to easily, even being super careful they mixed immediately.

 

[Coldies]

Get a cider going too and you can have black and tans along with snake bites. I cant wait for my cider to clear for this very reason.

 

[kyleobie]

I'd go with different yeasts, too. For your stout use an American Ale or perhaps an attenuating one like Wyeast London Ale. And then for the pale, I'd definitely go with an ESB yeast or Safale-04.

 

[Dynachrome]

Is there a traditional order for black and tan?

Light on the bottom, dark on the top?

I did a recipe with a lot of carapils in it. The final product is fairly heavy. I've had my porters finish with a lower final gravity. It's very full bodied.

That would make it easier to pour light gravity over heavier gravity beer.

 

[Face Eater]

I always seen it with light in bottom dark on top. In my keezer I have a vanilla oatmeal stout and a wit that I decided to see I the black and blue pour would work and it did. Tastes really don't go together but it poured nicely.

 

[Dynachrome]

Nice!

...brunch!

;-)

 

[kyleobie]

I also have seen it light on bottom and dark on top. Remember, ESB/English pales tend to have a bit more body. By contrast dry stouts (like Guinness) are just that - dry with a low FG. So I would design both recipes accordingly.

 

[noonanchad]

I can't wait to start kegging. I wan't to do a black and blue. A nice stout and blueberry wheat. Before home brewing I would use guiness and Seadog Blueberry wheat. I can't wait to brew my own and try it out.

 

[kyleobie]

Ha, I haven't heard of a black and blue before. Great idea.

 

[Face Eater]

Yea the black and blue that you get at the bar are Guinness and blue moon or shock top. There pretty good being different. Not to fond of those beers by themselves but together it's not bad.

 

[iijakii]

The problem is a black and tan separates due to the fg difference. So the stout has to be thin to float, hence why guinness works. Any dry stout recipe will work with any pale recipe.

Is this true? I've always believed it was due to Guiness being on a Nitrogen tap. If this is true inc my RIS and a Pliny clone in the near future. Awwww yeah

 

[Face Eater]

Is this true? I've always believed it was due to Guiness being on a Nitrogen tap. If this is true inc my RIS and a Pliny clone in the near future. Awwww yeah

Doesn't have to due with the nitro tap because I did the black and blue on co2 with the same serving pressure. That sounds interesting with different styles. Definitely want to hear the results.

 

[Guess42]

Yeah, it's not due to nitrogen. It's due to differing densities. Fg is a measure of the density of the liquid.

 

[BrotherFreeman]

My LHBS/brewery does an excellent B&T using a Black IPA and a Rye PA. Very tasty stuff.

 

[gregkeller]

So i've got a sam smith oatmeal stout that is gonna finish at around 1.012 and then i'm going to make the cream of three crops which is supposed to finish around 1.005. that should be enough of a difference right? It's gonna be the opposite of a traditional black and tan because it'll have the stout on the bottom and the light on top, but maybe it'll be good, and if not, i'll still have two good beers and apfelwien on tap.