Gypsum

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stevenenglund

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For the first time ever, I brewed a recipe that called for gypsum. I've brewed lots of partial batches and never heard of the stuff- probably because I've only done one IPA. I checked our water and we do indeed have soft water, which is funny because I live in Portland the IPA capital of the world and yet half the area's water is soft. My water in my suburb is Bull Run, where as city drinkers are on something different.

At any rate... I forget to buy and thus add the gypsum on brew day. It's been fermenting two days now. Is it pointless to add?

EDIT: Just realized I titled this thread about as lame and vague as possible. I will fix that in future thread-starts.
 
Well the sulphate in Gypsum can affect the perception of bitterness and flavor, while the calcium is a simple nutrient to the yeast. So, it may still have some effect of helping your hop flavor, though the yeast nutrient part is probably almost to late to affect anything.
Im sort of a rookie, so perhaps someone else will chime it. It certainly won't hurt anything, I say go for it.
 
Do not add it now. Enjoy the beer you get which will likely be just fine.

Try reading up on water additions/adjustments in books like "Water" by John Palmer or using online tools like those found at brewersfriend.com.

I have soft water with high PH. I can brew without adjustments as long as I know what the likely outcome will be. I adjust for some beers but not for others.
 
Now let me preface this by saying that I haven't tried this, but couldn't you just add the gypsum to the priming solution at bottling? If he's not using it to factor into mash ph then it's just for flavor, and I would think it could be added at bottling. Hell, you can even add a bit of gypsum to a beer while you're drinking it to see the effect on flavor it has. Again, I've never added it to my priming solution, but I don't see why it wouldn't work. Maybe someone who's tried that will chime in.
 
Seems like two votes for "try it" and one vote for "beer is fine without it." So I think I'll pick some up on the way home tonight either way. If I read more, I may add some in. If I don't, I'll test the theory by bottling a 12'er with gypsum and bottle a 12'er without. Then I'll taste both side by side, after which I'll sprinkle a little to the bottle without. That way there's a three way controlled test to see if adding gypsum post-wort and post-cooking phase, has any effect.

The only test after that would be to split a batch into two pots during boil, and make one with gypsum and one without, then take the one without and split it down further as I described above.

Sounds like a lot of work- I need a beer now :S
 
You can add it post fermentation. Whether you should is another question. Sounds like you may not be a huge IPA fan and people perceive the sulfate differently than others so you may mess up all your beers.

I'd probably finish it out as is and then you can add some small amounts of gypsum to the finished beer to see if you like the change. And then brew your next beer with a higher level if you like.
 
There's an episode of Basic Brewing Radio from last year that's worth checking out. If I remember correctly, they added varying amounts of gypsum to the same batch at bottling so that the gypsum would be the only variable. Doesn't look like I can link you directly to the episode, but it's called IPA Experiment Results and it's from November 7, 2013.
 
Actually I love IPA- but I've only brewed one. It came out great!

I listened to the IPA Experiments podcast from Nov 7. Here's a summation:

They set up an experiment with 5 bottled beers, each had a different level of gypsum added at bottling (no gypsum was added during boil). They had people blind taste test and rank the beers. They said when the beers were cold, it was hard to taste a difference. When the beers were warm, most tasters agreed that the beers with mid-level or high-levels of gypsum had the most hop aroma, and a couple people even suggested a better mouth-feel. Most people could tell which bottle had the most gypsum, referring to it as the most "bitter" or "harsh."


So, actual science aside and not speaking of things like pH or anything of scientific merit, I am a BIG believer in blind taste tests. Therefor I'll 3 tsp when I add dry hops at secondary. After all, I did make an IPA with 100 IBUs, so I might as well do all I can to promote it as a hoppy-as-hell-beer.
 
Actually I love IPA- but I've only brewed one. It came out great!

I listened to the IPA Experiments podcast from Nov 7. Here's a summation:

They set up an experiment with 5 bottled beers, each had a different level of gypsum added at bottling (no gypsum was added during boil). They had people blind taste test and rank the beers. They said when the beers were cold, it was hard to taste a difference. When the beers were warm, most tasters agreed that the beers with mid-level or high-levels of gypsum had the most hop aroma, and a couple people even suggested a better mouth-feel. Most people could tell which bottle had the most gypsum, referring to it as the most "bitter" or "harsh."


So, actual science aside and not speaking of things like pH or anything of scientific merit, I am a BIG believer in blind taste tests. Therefor I'll 3 tsp when I add dry hops at secondary. After all, I did make an IPA with 100 IBUs, so I might as well do all I can to promote it as a hoppy-as-hell-beer.

Instead of just adding 3 teaspoons (15 grams), which may be a LOT (over 400 ppm) in a 5 gallon batch, why not take out a sample and see for yourself if that is the right amount? Start with 1/2 that, anyway, and see how it is. If you add 3 teaspoons to a 5 gallon batch, you may be way beyond those nice enhancements of bitterness and far into the "harsh", which isn't desirable.
 
3 tsp is a lot for 5 gallons. My hoppy beers generally get about 1.5 tsp for 6 gallons. I know someone who has a vial of gypsum-laced water to add a drop or two into a pint. It makes a huge difference in an IPA. I do add brewing salts at kegging from time to time.
 
I think your gypsum addition needs to be balanced with your water profile. I have very soft water with very low sulphate levels. I sometimes use up to 3 grams in a 1 gallon brew. With brewersfriend calculations, I sometimes don't even get into the 300ppm total
 
I've found two documents that may be of help, although we may need a water chemist to explain what all this means :drunk:

One of the documents states that Bull Run Water (some of Portland, OR and it's suburbs) is as follows:

Everything is mg/L (parts per million)
-----------------------------------
Sulfate <0.5
Sodium 3.8
pH 8.0
Magnesium 0.7
Alkalinity as CaCO3 is 9.0
Hardness as CaCO3

I tried the EZ Water Calc. I put in 2 lbs of Munich, but the rest was extract in my recipe, so I wasn't sure how to add it. I didn't add it to the Calc and checked the results: It suggested that I need more Calcium, Magnesium, and Sulfate. So I added 7.5 g of gypsum, which is roughly the HBT peer-suggested amount of 1.5 tsp... the Calc said I was good on Calcium and Sulfate now, but still needed Magnesium. Adding 2 grams of Epsom Salt made that go away, and it seemed my water was in the recommended profile range!

Does all this sound legit and correct?
 
I've found two documents that may be of help, although we may need a water chemist to explain what all this means :drunk:

One of the documents states that Bull Run Water (some of Portland, OR and it's suburbs) is as follows:

Everything is mg/L (parts per million)
-----------------------------------
Sulfate <0.5
Sodium 3.8
pH 8.0
Magnesium 0.7
Alkalinity as CaCO3 is 9.0
Hardness as CaCO3

I tried the EZ Water Calc. I put in 2 lbs of Munich, but the rest was extract in my recipe, so I wasn't sure how to add it. I didn't add it to the Calc and checked the results: It suggested that I need more Calcium, Magnesium, and Sulfate. So I added 7.5 g of gypsum, which is roughly the HBT peer-suggested amount of 1.5 tsp... the Calc said I was good on Calcium and Sulfate now, but still needed Magnesium. Adding 2 grams of Epsom Salt made that go away, and it seemed my water was in the recommended profile range!

Does all this sound legit and correct?

Well, it does "match" EZ water in the sense that it gives you a blanket statement of unharmful amounts. But you never need to add magnesium to a batch, as 0 in magnesium is just fine. Same with calcium- most people like 40 ppm or so as a minimum as it helps with yeast flocculation, but it's not required. You can easily keep the Ca at 40-50 ppm which you would get to just with the gypsum additions.

Some people like more sulfate than I do. More than about 150 ppm for me tastes a bit minerally and not as pleasing, except in one beer that I make where I will use sulfate up to about 275 ppm. In most other recipes, I use far less. Tomorrow's IPA will have 125 ppm of sulfate for that brewday, but I'm not adding epsom salts or anything like that- just the gypsum.
 
Thanks Yooper- I didn't know those were max numbers on the EZ Calc. I'll probably only add the 1.5 tsp of gypsum then.

Hope your IPA brew day went well!
 
You only should be adding gypsum to a full grain mash to add temporary hardness and to help drop the pH to 5.3 or so. You shouldn't add it at any other point besides the mash. You can still make nice beer with soft water. I do and I live in SE Alaska with plenty of rainwater around. I use 1 tsp per five gallon batch. Add to the strike water and stir to dissolve.
 
You only should be adding gypsum to a full grain mash to add temporary hardness and to help drop the pH to 5.3 or so. You shouldn't add it at any other point besides the mash. You can still make nice beer with soft water. I do and I live in SE Alaska with plenty of rainwater around. I use 1 tsp per five gallon batch. Add to the strike water and stir to dissolve.

While it's true that one of the uses of Gypsum is to control mash ph, this isn't the only reason you would want to use it. Water hardness affects your perception of flavors in beer and is a tool that you can use to manipulate the finished beer to your preference. For flavor purposes, it doesn't seem matter when you add it.
 
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