Going Wild

[signpost]

I love reading about this stuff. I've brewed a good number of sours, but still haven't gotten around to trying to wrangle local yeast. Maybe this summer or fall. Every time I think about trying it, I get busy and forget about it.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

@signpost how do you brew sours? Brew just like normal, then toss in a souring bug like what I've probably got in these jars, and let it sit for a couple years?

 

[FatDragon]

My little batch with the hydrometer-sample yeast looked totally inactive for the first few days, but has since developed a small krausen after stepping up (gradually) from 16.5C to 18.5C. It had what looked like a thin lacto pellicle going in, but I don't see any of that yet. Not sure if I'm hoping for lacto to take off so I get a local sour or if I'd rather it not take off and just get a sample of local yeast.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

My little batch with the hydrometer-sample yeast looked totally inactive for the first few days, but has since developed a small krausen after stepping up (gradually) from 16.5C to 18.5C. It had what looked like a thin lacto pellicle going in, but I don't see any of that yet. Not sure if I'm hoping for lacto to take off so I get a local sour or if I'd rather it not take off and just get a sample of local yeast.

I'm hoping for just a local saccs so I don't have to learn how to deal with sours just yet lol.

Really just hoping for a good heavy hitting strain.

 

[Barley_Bob]

I'm hoping for just a local saccs so I don't have to learn how to deal with sours just get lol.

Really just hoping for a good heavy hitting strain.

Looking at Mutedog's blog, it seems like he gets great results with whatever mix of yeast and bacteria he ends up with. With that in mind, I'm trying not to frame my expectations until I actually have a culture that's produced a test batch. That's not to say I wouldn't throw out something nasty, but I do want to be open minded about the process and judge success by actual, final results. You just never know.

Oh, I should say that I'm trying this too. It's infectious!

 

[signpost]

@signpost how do you brew sours? Brew just like normal, then toss in a souring bug like what I've probably got in these jars, and let it sit for a couple years?

Yeah, that's the main way. Just brew up something with low IBUs and pitch a commercial souring blend (Roeselare, ECY Bug County or BugFarm). I've also pitched dregs from commercial sour/wild ales (Jolly Pumpkin and others) And I've done one sour mash where I pitched a 1/2 lb. of 2-row into a mash at around 115°F and held it around that temp for a couple days.

The sour mash beer was ready to drink pretty quick, because I did a quick boil after the mash was done that killed off the lacto and then did a regular sacch fermentation. The others though, they've taken anywhere up to 18 months to just get ready for bottling, then another few months or so after that before they really were starting to peak with great flavors.

I can't wait to find a chance to harvest some local microbes to really have some fun, though.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

I guess I better actually try a sour beer before I even get the hankering to make one lol

 

[FatDragon]

I guess I better actually try a sour beer before I even get the hankering to make one lol

Right? I've only got a couple sours available to me in China so I've to very little experience drinking sours. People talk them up all the time here and I've definitely got interest in brewing one, but the reality is that I don't even know what different kinds of sours (or brett-fermented beers for that matter) are supposed to taste like...

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

Right? I've only got a couple sours available to me in China so I've to very little experience drinking sours. People talk them up all the time here and I've definitely got interest in brewing one, but the reality is that I don't even know what different kinds of sours (or brett-fermented beers for that matter) are supposed to taste like...

Exactly! I'm still learning about all the other types of beers and what they're supposed to taste like let alone sours lol

 

[mesooohoppy]

I like the almanac sours, not sure you can get them out that far east though.

I brewed a parti gyle sour this weekend so that took a little longer than I was planning; otherwise I would have made a starter and tried this. Maybe this weekend.

With that said, I have a winery accross the street from my house. I've contemplated going over there and asking for a single grape. Lol

 

[Jwin]

OP, I'm willing to bet, with my limited knowledge, that each of your samples have a slurry of different microbes in each.
Do you have access to a microscope so you could plate a sample and isolate a yeast strain separate from the other bacteria?
I assume that is the proper way to get a local yeast without a full microbiome of organisms

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

OP, I'm willing to bet, with my limited knowledge, that each of your samples have a slurry of different microbes in each.
Do you have access to a microscope so you could plate a sample and isolate a yeast strain separate from the other bacteria?
I assume that is the proper way to get a local yeast without a full microbiome of organisms

I plan to build them out and them make multiple agar plates and isolate different colonies off the agar plates. Unfortunately I don't really have access to a microscope but will build up a multitude of samples and then isolate them based on taste, attenuation, and flocculation. That's my goal anyways.

Ultimately, regardless of building them up and isolating them, from my understanding, The yeast would basically isolate themselves by whichever is more dominate would eventually be the only one growing and after each batch the stronger yeast for lack of better words would isolate itself out.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

Day 8 update!

So, I decided to take the Roses/Daisies jar and attempt to build it up. I swirled it up to get the stuff floating on top broken up and in suspension. It all eventually settled to the bottom and you could see a nice layer of "presumably" yeast on top of some sediment (which is weird to me that dme produces any sort of sediment).

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I made up a regular 2 cups water/half cup dme starter with some yeast nutrient and energizer. I decanted about half the jar trying not to disturb the layer on the bottom but it wasn't very compacted yet so I just poured in the last half of the jar into the starter.

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I have no idea how this will work, if I did it too soon, or right on schedule. The initial wort was hopped so hopefully it kept the bacteria at bay. I will see how this one builds up and decide if I want to do the others now or continue to wait, but if I caught saccs I want them to have the foothold as opposed to lacto or Brett since I don't feel like tackling sours at this point in my brewing career lol.

As far as the others, the honey suckle has a slight "bread" note to its aroma, not funky, nor floral at this point. Just kind of yeasty(?) would be about my best descriptor. Now the hedge on the other hand, boy it smells sweet and floral, almost like a honey suckle bush when you walk past (isn't that funny how that works). It's definitely not over the top, but the aroma is there. They both are looking good and hoping this roses/daisies starter takes off and builds up some confidence for the other two.

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Wish me luck! [emoji106]🏻

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

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We've got some Krausen Folks!!!

I know it's hard to tell from the pics and they look like regular bubbles, but the middle is krausen for sure!

Can't wait to see how this rocks out over the next day on the stir plate!

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

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Getting a little more Krausen going on after close to ten hours. Can definitely see a bunch of goodies in the starter.

I think it smells like a "lighter beer" fermenting. Nothing too crazy on the nose. My GF said it smells like cider but who knows lol. Looking forward to smelling it in the morning.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

Day 9 Update!

The roses/daisies jar is growing like an animal on the starter and appears to be growing well. Only problem is that it doesn't smell too enticing lol. It doesn't smell the greatest at this point so I have no idea.

The other two, they will smell very floral and sweet and my initial thought that popped into my head when I smelled them was candy green apple. I could be way off, but that was just the first thought that popped into my head when they hit my nose.

I'll keep everyone posted and hopefully as this one grows, it'll loose whatever the funk smell is and go back to the floral sweet smell it originally was.

 

[martijacpbs]

Yep, although my knowledge is rather limited and I'm still very much learning about brewing in general, I'm going wild. Or well, attempting to anyways.

The idea of using a wild, local yeast in a beer is absolutely fascinating to me. As yeast in general are fascinating to me.

After doing a ton of reading, I'm trying my hand at collecting some wild yeast and just going to see what happens. If I get any, and as they grow, I will isolate colonies using agar plates and try to purify them the best I can without a microscope or a microbiology degree lol.

Eventually decided to go on mute dog's method because it seemed pretty easy. Create some lower gravity, low hopped wort, put your flowers, tree bark, fruit in it for 6-12 hours, pull that out and let it set for a while and see if you get anything.

While over at my childhood property this evening for dinner, I got some flowers, put them in my cooled wort I made earlier and am staring at them like a small child stares at a snow globe. I'll keep you all posted or whoever cares about it. Should be fun.

Oh, for the flowers, I did one mason jar with daisies and roses, one with honey suckle, and one with little flowers off some hedge bush my mom said the bees love.

Wish me luck.

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Wow! this is such a great idea!! Honey looks more tempting with flowers inside. I think not all kinds of flowers can be there right?

 

[TimmyWit]

I guess I better actually try a sour beer before I even get the hankering to make one lol

I see you're across the river from me so you're fortunate enough to be near Side Project Cellar. You usually have to drink the beers on site because the production is limited. They actually have some bottles to go at the moment. You just have to check on their site. Fuzzy Blend #2 is really good and it's currently available to drink on-site. That one uses wild Missouri yeast and Mo White Peaches.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

I see you're across the river from me so you're fortunate enough to be near Side Project Cellar. You usually have to drink the beers on site because the production is limited. They actually have some bottles to go at the moment. You just have to check on their site. Fuzzy Blend #2 is really good and it's currently available to drink on-site. That one uses wild Missouri yeast and Mo White Peaches.

That's Awesome TimmyWit! I'll have to look them up!

 

[Barley_Bob]

Man, another nearby brewer! We're holding down this corner of the world. Western IL often feels like a sea of BMC.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

So the honey suckle smells putrid now, like spoiled, sour feet. The hedge smells like a sour candy apple would be about my best descriptor.

The roses/daisies is back on the stir plate in a hopped starter. It was smelling kind of bad, but I wasn't sure if it was the yeast or possibly something bad like a bug in there from being in an unhopped starter last time.

It's an experiment to say the least and I'll be continuing to do it. My goal is to find a good brown ale strain and a good summer saison or wit beer strain. Not going for sours at this point. I guess trying to find a good saccs

 

[cannman]

So the honey suckle smells putrid now, like spoiled, sour feet.

I have an ex that meets this descriptor... And that's the primary reason why we're exes.

But beer I would give a second chance!

All ex joking aside, by the end of the year I'll have my yeast lab set up and I'll be able to pull the yeast out of all that crap. Keep trying and don't give up!!! You can be my test run.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

I have an ex that meets this descriptor... And that's the primary reason why we're exes.

But beer I would give a second chance!

All ex joking aside, by the end of the year I'll have my yeast lab set up and I'll be able to pull the yeast out of all that crap. Keep trying and don't give up!!! You can be my test run.

Hahaha! I've got two, the first is definitely rotten for sure, the second I just didn't care for lol

Nope, not giving up at all. Especially with how easy it is. Just going to keep plugging away at it

 

[Aristotelian]

After finding a worm in my Reed clover starter, I continued to ferment the white clover. It formed a pellicle but didn't smell like beer. More like boiled vegetable. White clover is a dumper too. Sorry guys, I am out for now. I think I will try using dome fruit to catch some yeast for my next attempt.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

After finding a worm in my Reed clover starter, I continued to ferment the white clover. It formed a pellicle but didn't smell like beer. More like boiled vegetable. White clover is a dumper too. Sorry guys, I am out for now. I think I will try using dome fruit to catch some yeast for my next attempt.

I dumped the roses/daisies because it smelled like boiled, spoiled vegetables. Going to be dumping the honey suckle because it is absolutely putrid smelling, which leaves me with the hedge sample. It dill smells somewhat sourly fruitful. Hopefully it ends up decent but we'll see.

Going to be doing more samples here as the year goes on. I'm going to get me a good local saccs strain one of these days lol

 

[kh54s10]

I put a pint jar on my window sill after reading that in 1 week you get ? bacteria?, at 2 weeks servomyces and longer you get something else. I will see what happens in about 2 weeks. I will then try a 1 gallon trial brew SMaSH. It it is good I will make a starter and build up a supply. It not I will try something else.

 

[FatDragon]

My wild hydrometer sample yeast has been working away happily at ~25C. Took a couple days to get moving but it's built up from some tiny bubbles to almost an inch of krausen in the last 4-5 days. I smelled it yesterday and compared it to the same wort pitched with US-05; the US-05 had a very familiar sweet, hoppy smell while the hydrometer yeast was sweet and a bit hoppy but also smelled very fruity and just a little bit sour. Considering the sample I pitched I suspect that the krausen is sticking around so well because there's lacto in there that's basically shoring it up with a pellicle, but time will tell.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

I'm probably going to build up the liberty ale sample I have. Then build up the hedge sample that still smells sweet/sour green apple and try that. If it smells the same way that it does I'll do it in a wit or saison.

 

[Tactical-Brewer]

Ok, so I'm building up the liberty ale dregs while my other wild yeast finish out in their original jars.

The honey suckle will more than likely get pitched because of smells putrid, but honestly and it's kind of weird because it really doesn't smell as bad as it did a couple days ago.

The hedge still smells pretty good and can't wait to start building it up and brew me a batch with it. So far the smells seem like it'll make a great lighter color beer. Be it a wit, hefe, pale ale esque type beer.

Can't wait to get this further along

 

[signpost]

So, in following this thread, I can't believe I didn't think of sharing this link before now. Maybe it's old news, but here's the link:

http://bootlegbiology.com/backyard-yeast-wrangling-tool-kit/

They have instructions and materials to help people wrangle local yeasts. They also collect and bank yeast from all over the place. Basically, you can collect and isolate some yeast, then send it to them and it'll be documented and banked.

I haven't done it yet, but when I get around to trying, I'll probably use their stuff to do it.