Cider yeast musings

[Bokito]

This year's pear and apple harvest is extremely bountiful in Switzerland, and I have been pressing like a madman.
I normally brew beer but can't stop myself from picking apples and pears from 'abandoned' cider pears and apples that nobody seems to use. I press them, and ferment them unpasteurized. Since I'm a bit of a wuss and don't want to completely trust wild yeasts and other bugs I pitch dry yeasts. I hope that then later on wild bugs give some additional character.
What I find difficult to decide, though, is what are good cider yeasts. The particular things I'd like to have would be

• A yeast that can ferment malic acid to get rid of some tartness (main reason for me to pitch and not wait for wild yeasts)
• A yeast that leaves something for the wild bugs to give some funky tastes

I have access to Mangrove Jack's M02, Safcider AB-1, AC-4, AS-2 and TF-6. Until now I used Mangrove Jack's M02, and Safciders TF-6. Both work well, but I would like to hear your opinions on good cider yeasts - and whether you have experience with yeast effects or whether it doesn't really matter in the end.

TIA,
Benno

 

[fluketamer]

I ferment store bought juice. From my experience doing this I have notice that wine and cider yeasts tend to strip more flavor than ale yeasts IMO

 

[Chalkyt]

Welcome to the fun.

Everyone will have their favorite yeast. The list that you have should all be quite good. However, to answer your question from my experience...

S04 is my go-to yeast. It is a well-behaved ale yeast which ferments quite quickly (i.e. two to four weeks at around 15C). It is rated at highly nutrient dependent like many ale yeasts so it can stall above SG1.000 if being used with apples from old, late season, unfertilised trees which produce apples that are low in nutrient. Having said that, stalling means that you might have a naturally sweet cider. Adding extra nutrient like DAP will kick it into action again.

The various Safciders (AS2 and TF6) that I have used have been quite good, although looking at the TF6 data I rather suspect that its supposed sweetness comes from behaving like S04 or a similar ale yeast. i.e. it will stop and leave sweetness because it runs out of nutrients.

71B has a reputation for reducing tartness by metabolising malic acid. I did a comparison of 71B and S04 last year, using the same apple blend. In the end I found that the 71B cider was a little "thin" and had no bite. I ended up adding back some malic acid. But, that is just my taste.

I have also used M02 and was quite happy with it but couldn't see a reason to change from S04.

I have also read good reviews for D47 and as apple crops look to be abundant here in Oz this year, I will do a comparison with S04.

I tend to "clean up" my pressed juice by adding 50ppm of sulphite (campden tablet or potassium metabisulphite solution) before fermentation to reduce the chances of adverse effects from "nasties or bugs". But, this is a personal preference... some people use it and some don't.

Good luck!

 

[IAmPistolPete]

This year I used AC-4, AS-2, and S-04 all using the same apple blend. AS-2 had a helluva bad H2S issue [did not think to add DAP til after I almost passed out]. AC-4 is thin but apple-y. S-04 is the most balanced of the three. Last year S-04 won out against D47 & 71B. I left it on the [fine] lees for 6 months to develop a bready-creamy texture. Tasted like apple and pie crust

 

[jnesselrode]

This year I used AC-4, AS-2, and S-04 all using the same apple blend. AS-2 had a helluva bad H2S issue [did not think to add DAP til after I almost passed out]. AC-4 is thin but apple-y. S-04 is the most balanced of the three. Last year S-04 won out against D47 & 71B. I left it on the [fine] lees for 6 months to develop a bready-creamy texture. Tasted like apple and pie crust

I did a three-yeast experiment last year with S04, Nottingham and Cotes des Blanc last year. S04 was the winner beating CdB by a hair. I had one of the last CdBs the other day and it was very nice and beat the S04 after a year of aging.

 

[Northern_Brewer]

What I find difficult to decide, though, is what are good cider yeasts.

Well this thread is a classic - generally in favour of beer yeasts :
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/results-from-juice-yeast-and-sugar-experiments.83060/

 

[Fixerman]

This year I used SafCider AS-2 in one 5-gal carboy, TF-6 in another and left two others to ferment naturally. I like a semi-dry to semi-sweet cider (Downeast is my favorite) and will eventually stabilize and back sweeten all but the natural batches. Both the AS-2 and TF-6 have a FG of 1.000. Out of all of them, I like the TF-6 the best. Even before back-sweetening, it has a more appley, fruity taste than the others. What was interesting was that the TF-6 took two or three days longer to get going than the AS-2. All batches were from the same press which was a mix of the following apples: Honeycrisp, McIntosh, Cortland, Pixie Crunch, Snowsweet, Macoun, and Liberty.

 

[Bokito]

Well this thread is a classic - generally in favour of beer yeasts :
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/results-from-juice-yeast-and-sugar-experiments.83060/

Yeah I have worked my way through half of that thread by now - should've done that before asking to specify the question. It's interesting to see the difference in opinions coming from different places though. Read a book on cider from a British perspective (Andrew Lea's 'Craft Cider Making') and there is a categorical 'no' for using beer yeasts.
I ran out of cider yeasts so I will also have Nottingham and some wild yeasts to test for this year. Also aged a perry on sloes, and they (as all plums) might also add some funky stuff.
I have had some stuck fermentations but they are going strong again - should have added nutrients but that's a whole other story. Still am surprised how slow TF-6 can be, but that is probably a story of nutrient deficiency.