Getting a Job in the Beer Industry is Harder Than You Would Think!

[KingBrianI]

So I'm having a third-life crisis or something. I'll be 30 this year and have come to the realization that I don't want to spend the rest of my life doing what I do now (Analytical Chemistry). Brewing is about the only hobby I've ever had that hasn't grown stale or old. I still love to brew just as much as when I first started, and now I'm actually good at it. And even though I've never been to brew school, and even though I've never worked in a commercial brewery, I probably know more about beer and brewing than most commercial brewers (if my interactions with brewers on brewery tours and tastings is any indication). So I figured, forget about money, I'll work as a low-level guy in a brewery for $10/hr and actually enjoy my work. Eventually, I'll get the experience I need to open my own place and become really successful, but for now I just want to get a foot in the industry. So a year or two ago, I halfheartedly started trying to either volunteer or get a part time job at some local breweries. No luck. A couple of breweries seemed interested in some help early on, but then quit responding to my inquiries. So within the last month or so I've gotten really serious about it and started contacting breweries all over the country trying to find something. Still no luck. It seems the lack of commercial experience is a real sticking point. The hundreds of hours researching brewing science and theory, and the tons of actual brewing I've done don't seem to make any difference. I'm getting frustrated and down about the whole thing. I mean I'm a smart guy with a BS in Biology and a minor in chemistry from a good university, with 7 years of experience in analytical labs and more knowledge about beer and brewing than most commercial brewers, and I can't even get a job scrubbing out fermenters and scooping grain out of mash tuns. What am I doing wrong?

 

[oldmate]

I don't have any tips, but this isn't good. I want to be an analytical chemist!! Good luck with your search, maybe tailor your resume to the industry. Is there anyone you know at brew clubs or local breweries that works or has worked at a brewery that could help you write a new resume or put a good word in? .. I dunno!

 

[dale1038]

I did this same thing last year. Wound up working on the distribution side. Don't do that. Supply side is the way to go, but guys with 10 yrs distribution experience want to be on the supply side. It's all about who you know. The beer business sucks. It's super low margin and breaking even is tough. People are gun shy to try someone new that may not understand this...obviously you do... I've made quite a few of your beers and I say mad genius! Especially the caramel amber. I love that beer. Just keep plugging away is about the only advice I can give. Or let's get together and start something up!

 

[KingBrianI]

I don't have any tips, but this isn't good. I want to be an analytical chemist!!

Oh god, turn around and run! Just kidding...kinda. I work with some people who really seem to like it, and maybe that will be you, but it's sucking out my soul.

I've made quite a few of your beers and I say mad genius! Especially the caramel amber. I love that beer. Just keep plugging away is about the only advice I can give. Or let's get together and start something up!

Thanks for the support. I just wish I could create recipes and brew them commercially so more people could enjoy them. Maybe eventually...

 

[Revvy]

I'm sure it's no different than any other industry, it's all about who you know and networking. You just pretty much need to start getting to know the brewers in your area, maybe just someone in one of your local brew pubs- get to know them, bring them your beer. Don't ask about volunteering or anything initially, just make a relationship with them, and sometime down the line maybe you could ask to shadow them for a day, hang out with them while they're brewing and observe. Then maybe they'll get you to help muck out the mash tun, or dump in grain or clean up or something. Once they see you're not just talking (or have stars in your eyes like many homebrewers do that somehow it is easy and glamorous) they'll let you help them regularly.

Then you can add that to your resume as professional experience.

I'm sure every brewery/brewpub gets hounded by homebrewers looking for jobs regularly, they probably are sick of "cold callers" who have no relationship with them. SO that's why you gotta build one first.

The other option would be to plunk a ton of change down and go to siebel, they probably help place their graduates.

Also is there a regional/local brewer's association in your area? I'd start going to their meetings and join if you can, again it's all about the networking.

 

[KingBrianI]

I'm sure it's no different than any other industry, it's all about who you know and networking. You just pretty much need to start getting to know the brewers in your area, maybe just someone in one of your local brew pubs- get to know them, bring them your beer. Don't ask about volunteering or anything initially, just make a relationship with them, and sometime down the line maybe you could ask to shadow them for a day, hang out with them while they're brewing and observe. Then maybe they'll get you to help muck out the mash tun, or dump in grain or clean up or something. Once they see you're not just talking (or have stars in your eyes like many homebrewers do that somehow it is easy and glamorous) they'll let you help them regularly.

Then you can add that to your resume as professional experience.

I'm sure every brewery/brewpub gets hounded by homebrewers looking for jobs regularly, they probably are sick of "cold callers" who have no relationship with them. SO that's why you gotta build one first.

The other option would be to plunk a ton of change down and go to siebel, they probably help place their graduates.

Also is there a regional/local brewer's association in your area? I'd start going to their meetings and join if you can, again it's all about the networking.

I hear you. And I've actually tried what you suggest. I figured that I wasn't getting responses because I was coming off too strongly by asking to volunteer or get some part time work, so I started going to a local brewpub that just opened to drink and hang out. I even chatted to the brewer for a bit one day. So I emailed him up the next day just saying that I enjoyed talking to him and would like to hang out one day while he was brewing to just see how everything went down. No response. Not even a thanks for the interest but it's our policy not to allow visitors in the brewery or whatever. So that kind of pissed me off. The biggest problem with trying to get to know people first is that I'd really like to move somewhere else. It's tough to hang out with and chat up brewers across the country.

 

[Revvy]

The biggest problem with trying to get to know people first is that I'd really like to move somewhere else. It's tough to hang out with and chat up brewers across the country.

That's why you need some "proffessional experience" first before you can move. Same with networking locally, they'll be plugged into the national scene and can help down the line.

You need to look into the brewer's guild. Here's the one for your state. Start going to their events if you haven't. Looks like they had somehting in June where you live.

North Carolina Brewers Guild

Anna Lockhart, Executive Director
324 S. Wilmington St.,
Box 260
Raleigh, NC 27601
Phone : 919-244-0558

North Carolina Brewer's Guild.

Go to their events, if they have workshops and educational events go to them. Heck even volunteering at some of their events is a way to get connecting with people. I bet Anna can use all sorts of help. Even if it's manning an info/registration table at one of their events.

Once you start to be a presence in the community, THEN you can maybe get further into the brewery, if you know what I mean.

 

[Revvy]

This would probably be a great event for you to offer to volunteer at. It's on the main page of the guild. Says they have educational programs planned. You could volunteer, AND sit in on the professional programs as well.

gh Country Beer Festival

Jun 17

Posted by Craft Beer Collective in beer culture, Boone, Events, festival | Comments off
I recently received a note regarding the High Country Beer festival September 3rd in Boone, NC. This is what ASU’s Seth Cohen had to say: We put this festival on at Appalachian State as part of our not-for-profit fundraising for a brewing and fermentation programs we are developing. The proceeds (those we do not donate to our annual charitable cause) go to buying equipment, supplies, grains, hops etc. and paying students for internships and research in the brewhouse etc. We had nearly 60 breweries up here last year including most everyone from NC! Its a small event (2500 tickets) that sells out and has been a blast. We will have 8-10 seminars this year ranging from discussions with brewers about brewing to style, transferring from home to business-brewer, the history of beer and brewing through and array of beer and food pairings. http://www.hcbeerfest.com/ © 2011 Craft Beer Collective / Away Team Media Bringing you the craft and culture of beer in North Carolina --> Raleigh, Durham, Asheville, Winston-Salem, Greensboro, Wilmington, NC and beyond Contact us at dave (at) away (dash) team (dot) com
Link to this post!

Once you start to be a face, a known entity in their pretty tight nit community, then they'll be more apt to welcome you into the brewery side of things.

 

[cadarnell]

I love the passion in your post .. i think for the most part, passion will get you were you want to go in life .... i know it might sound dorky and silly .. but just put your goal up in your house on big poster boards .. like in every room .. write out what you want, and read it 7 to 10 times a day .. even more if you can .. affirmations work .. trust me they work ... best of luck to you ..

 

[ArcaneXor]

You might be overqualified for the low-end jobs and underqualified (in their eyes) for the QA jobs. Also, the brewing industry is a pretty tight-nit one. If people don't know who you are, they are much less likely to hire you. Networking is hugely important - you have to know the right people.

 

[KingBrianI]

Thanks for all the suggestions guys! I'll keep at it, but I don't know if I'll have the patience to engage in a multi-year campaign to get my face out there in order for someone to give me a shot. My current job is wearing me down and now that I've made up my mind that I'm not going to try to stick with it, it's even harder dealing with it every day. I'll start trying to "put myself out there" though, and hope for the best.

 

[Homercidal]

Next time leave off the free beer requirement in your job application.

 

[ArcaneXor]

Doing a Siebel course would also be a good idea. I hear that they are very good at finding jobs for their "graduates".

 

[KingBrianI]

Doing a Siebel course would also be a good idea. I hear that they are very good at finding jobs for their "graduates".

I'd actually love to do the 20-week Siebel Master Brewer program. Unfortunately, it's booked up until 2013 and it's really expensive. If I could get a job making decent money after graduation to pay back the loan I would have to take out it would be ok, but I'll be making peanuts and paying back the loan would be tough. I've also been looking into the UC Davis program, which isn't as expensive, but would still be hard to manage.

 

[hoppymonkey]

There are several brewing groups on LinkedIn. They post jobs on there constantly.

 

[lamarguy]

I know the marketing rep at Saint Arnold's brewery and he's said they've hired several brewers who were avid homebrewers that had no professional experience. They came by during the week, chatted with Brock (owner), and brought some of their homebrew as a discussion topic. When a position opened up (they've expanded a lot in the past 4 years), he gave them a call.

I'm sure every place is different, but one thing is universal - brewers love to try new beer.

 

[KingBrianI]

There are several brewing groups on LinkedIn. They post jobs on there constantly.

Thanks for the tip. I just joined several.

 

[bierhaus15]

I'm in a similar position. Decided not to go to law school to pursue brewing, but due to the lack of positions in breweries and the brewing schools filled up, I'm not making much progress getting a foot in the door. Also, making $15 an hour for the rest of my life as a grunt in a brewery isn't much motivation to keep trying.

Unless you have plans on starting your own brewpub/brewery, I think the best thing to do is go back to school for a degree in buisness or marketing. A bunch of breweries told me they could hire me tomorrow if I had an MBA; wouldn't be brewing beer, but I would still be in the beer buisness and it would pay ALOT more than they guys working the bottling line.

 

[KingBrianI]

Unless you have plans on starting your own brewpub/brewery, I think the best thing to do is go back to school for a degree in buisness or marketing. A bunch of breweries told me they could hire me tomorrow if I had an MBA; wouldn't be brewing beer, but I would still be in the beer buisness and it would pay ALOT more than they guys working the bottling line.

I definitely do want to eventually open my own brewery, but I've still got a lot to learn before attempting that. The business side doesn't appeal to me at all, though. I don't want to just be in the industry, I want to make beer. You know, try new recipes, tweak old recipes, invent new styles and share all of it with my enthusiastic customers.

 

[Mrott]

There's always "Plan B"... You're in NC, Durham area isn't terribly expensive compared to many other areas. Why not just find some open land (or use your own if you have enough) and build a big shed/barn type and start getting larger equipment. Use your job now to fund the construction of a nice small 2-3 bbl system and just go for it.

If Sam Calagione can start a brewpub on just a 10 gallon system then why can't you?

 

[Bobby_M]

If you want to get a foot in the door by taking a "cleaning technician" job at a brewery, your resume may actually be hurting you. They'll conclude that you're over qualified and will probably quit if you don't progress into a better position quickly. Perhaps a better way to go would be to ask for an apprenticeship part time.

 

[beersteiner2345]

There's always "Plan B"... You're in NC, Durham area isn't terribly expensive compared to many other areas. Why not just find some open land (or use your own if you have enough) and build a big shed/barn type and start getting larger equipment. Use your job now to fund the construction of a nice small 2-3 bbl system and just go for it.

If Sam Calagione can start a brewpub on just a 10 gallon system then why can't you?

x2

I know exactly where you are coming from. As somewhat of an entrepreneurial person, this is the only way I would go.

Only improvement I could suggest is to find a rich SWMBO to support brewing rather than a job.

My Dad always said never marry for money. Just hang around a bunch of rich chicks until you fall in love.

 

[lastsecondapex]

I'd guess you have probably contacted them, but Scott (sales mgr) and Jamie (head brewer) of Foothills in Winston-Salem are very approachable... Try to get in front of them sometime- this Friday is the Barrel-aged Sexual Chocolate release party (the release is Saturday) I'm sure they'll be there and be talkative.

 

[GodsStepBrother]

Start off at bad breweries.

I hate how that sounds, but I went to some awesome breweries and got shot down every time. I just wanted to see what brewing a big batch was like; I never said I want to work there. I went to a horrible brewery (I will not disclose it b/c the brewers there are stand up guys the owner just doesn’t care about the beer and won’t supply them with the essentials). I took some of my beer and they loved it, and asked to go to my house and see me brew, when they showed up they helped me with everything. After the brew they cleaned all my equipment along with me. Before you knew it I was dumping whole sacks of barely into the mash, I told them I was b!tch work Bert for the day. We are now friends and from the get go it was just me showing them I wasn’t just another arrogant home brewer who thought he was god because he could make good beer.

I think you are right in asking for the worst job they have to do, but you also have to be charismatic and show them you’re not just cocky. One thing a lot of pro brewers I have meet always say is that a lot of home brewers approach them well but after a short conversation they start to try and stump the pro’s with detailed questions, and it all goes downhill from there.

Anyways I say start off at really small or bad breweries, because those people are not as used to home brewers coming up to them and asking to work there. Since then I go and brew all the time and have gotten pretty well adjusted to brewing 10 barrel batches. I have also met a lot of pro brewers because of them. I at least have my foot in the door, and have been offered to go to go to other breweries and start brewing.

Just hang in there and like Revvy said, go hang out have some beer and make friends. It is not what you know it is who you know. Your background in chemistry and biology will come to play but only after you are in the door.

 

[SpanishCastleAle]

Apparently, they do actually exist. I've been snow skiing up there and I'd LOVE to live anywhere in that area.

 

[ReverseApacheMaster]

If somebody came to me for a job with a degree and highly technical experience and wanted to do ****ty manual labor, I would be suspicious of that person's motive and motivation. It's too likely for an employer to look at that and think you either don't have commitment to any profession/job -- so you will be flighty and leave -- or you're overqualified -- so you'll get bored and leave. That's something you may want to think about in your approach to people.

Also, I found your comment that you have, "more knowledge about beer and brewing than most commercial brewers" to be a big problem. It says to me that you think commercial brewing is like homebrewing but bigger. I'm sure that really turns them off. Although some of the science and process is the same, it's not so similar that being a well-read homebrewer makes up for formal training or experience.

Going to breweries and saying, "I'll do anything and I'm a homebrewer so I know a lot" doesn't really tell them anything helpful why they need you anymore than anybody else. You need to decide specifically what you want to do at a brewery and pursue the necessary steps to get to that role. Talk to breweries about how to break into that position with focus, rather than a shotgun approach of begging to do anything.

 

[KingBrianI]

If somebody came to me for a job with a degree and highly technical experience and wanted to do ****ty manual labor, I would be suspicious of that person's motive and motivation. It's too likely for an employer to look at that and think you either don't have commitment to any profession/job -- so you will be flighty and leave -- or you're overqualified -- so you'll get bored and leave. That's something you may want to think about in your approach to people.

Hell, I'd much rather skip the cleaning and scrubbing and go straight to wort production, but without any commercial brewing experience, I think that's highly unlikely. So my strategy is to just get into a brewery, where hopefully my knowledge, skills and enthusiasm allow me to advance to the more desireable positions.

Also, I found your comment that you have, "more knowledge about beer and brewing than most commercial brewers" to be a big problem. It says to me that you think commercial brewing is like homebrewing but bigger. I'm sure that really turns them off. Although some of the science and process is the same, it's not so similar that being a well-read homebrewer makes up for formal training or experience.

I absolutely agree that there is tons of stuff I don't know about brewing commercially. It's mostly large scale and automation process-type stuff though. As far as brewing theory goes, I think I've got a pretty solid base. But you're right, I shouldn't say I'm more knowledgable than most commercial brewers. I've talked about brewing with a lot of brewers though and my knowledge is definitely on par (excepting commercial-specific stuff).

Going to breweries and saying, "I'll do anything and I'm a homebrewer so I know a lot" doesn't really tell them anything helpful why they need you anymore than anybody else. You need to decide specifically what you want to do at a brewery and pursue the necessary steps to get to that role. Talk to breweries about how to break into that position with focus, rather than a shotgun approach of begging to do anything.

As I've mentioned a few times, my biggest desire is to be involved in recipe development, recipe testing, experimental batches, seasonal batches, etc. I've got to get in the door and get some experience and showcase my abilities before that's possible though.

 

[emjay]

As I've mentioned a few times, my biggest desire is to be involved in recipe development, recipe testing, experimental batches, seasonal batches, etc. I've got to get in the door and get some experience and showcase my abilities before that's possible though.

That is an extremely lofty goal, although I'm sure it's every homebrewer's wet dream. Even if you somehow get your foot in the door, the chances of moving up to such a creative position are remarkably slim. It'd be far easier just to start your own brewery.

In fact, it's unlikely enough that I'd even go as far as discouraging you from pursuing this unless you KNOW you'd still be happy in a less creative role, such as brewing well-established recipes. Entering any field where you'd only be happy in such a "top job" is a recipe for being miserable.

 

[KingBrianI]

Dude, I would be happier cleaning the toilets at a brewery than doing what I do now. So any position in a brewery would be awesome, but getting to design and test recipes would be the ultimate goal.

 

[emjay]

Dude, I would be happier cleaning the toilets at a brewery than doing what I do now. So any position in a brewery would be awesome, but getting to design and test recipes would be the ultimate goal.

Okay, that's a much healthier aspiration then.

 

[TheMan]

I pretty much agree with emjay...If you can hold out long enough and save up a large enough chunk of change and then open your own brewery that seems to be the most direct, but not necessarily the quickest.

 

[ReverseApacheMaster]

Dude, I would be happier cleaning the toilets at a brewery than doing what I do now. So any position in a brewery would be awesome, but getting to design and test recipes would be the ultimate goal.

All that tells me is that you have romanticized the idea of working in a brewery. If you would really be happy cleaning toilets, you could clean toilets anywhere because the guy cleaning toilets and mopping floors is not making beer and is not hanging out with the brewers.

There's a difference between taking anything to get in the door because you think cleaning toilets is a career path to brewing and taking it because it's the only door in the brewery.

As I've mentioned a few times, my biggest desire is to be involved in recipe development, recipe testing, experimental batches, seasonal batches, etc. I've got to get in the door and get some experience and showcase my abilities before that's possible though.

That means you either want to be THE brewer/owner -- in which case you should keep working at your job that pays more than a janitor to save up to open your own brewery -- or you have romanticized the idea of what happens at a brewery into being a homebrewer on a big scale -- in which case you should stay homebrewing. Large scale, commercial brewing isn't about tooling around with a recipe and having fun. It's hard work and repetition and worrying that you're going to flush thousands of dollars on a bad batch, etc. It's making the same handful of beers over and over and over and over. The seasonals and experimental batches are a tiny, tiny part of the job.

 

[KingBrianI]

RAM, thanks for all the insight. The toilet thing was obviously me using hyperbole in an attempt at humor. Sorry if you didn't get it. I fully understand what brewing entails and have not romanticized anything. I realize it is not all fun and games and a lot of hard work. But at the end of the day you end up with a product you can be proud of and share that with others who appreciate the time and effort you put into it. That's why I want to brew.

 

[Vance71975]

RAM, thanks for all the insight. The toilet thing was obviously me using hyperbole in an attempt at humor. Sorry if you didn't get it. I fully understand what brewing entails and have not romanticized anything. I realize it is not all fun and games and a lot of hard work. But at the end of the day you end up with a product you can be proud of and share that with others who appreciate the time and effort you put into it. That's why I want to brew.

I agree with those that have said save up and open your own, Dogfish Head man, started as a 10gallon batch brew pub and look at it now! Long shot yes, Also i would suggest you enter every brewing competition you can find, More golds= better brewing resume! Don't give up on the dream man!

 

[bb239605]

I just graduated with a chemical engineering degree and have been going about trying to get my foot in the door as well, and have some good success with four different job opportunities.

What I did while in school was take the brewing exams offered by the institute of brewing and distilling based out of endinburgh Scotland. This is a much cheaper alternative an going to a brewing academy and in my opinion just as worthwhile on the resume and a he'll of a lot cheaper. I also got certified as a beer judge wit the BJCP, which is an excellent program. The final step I did was get involved in home brewing clubs. I started my own at my college and joined. A local oene in the community. All of this is excellent resume fodder.

At this point, fresh out of college, I applied everywhere to any position related to productions at any brewery and even some wineries. I even applied to jobs I was over and under qualified for. What this has resulted in is four job offers for me, one from a local winery as a laborer and assistant vintner, one at a local brewpub as a brewer assistant, and two offers from miller opts and anhueser busch for brewery production management positions. All are great options and I am leaning towards the job from millercoors or AB, as the pay is way better as is the ability for upward progression.

Basically the moral of this longwinded story is, take the IBD tests, they will even out your resume from a professional brewer standpoint. Also, apply everywhere, and I mean every brewery possible. I applied for well over fifty jobs just at millercoors and anhueser busch alone before they called me back, and I had to contact the president of the local brepub before I even got an interview with the head brewer.

Good luck, keep us updated.

 

[bb239605]

Please try to ignore the litany of spelling and grammar errors in the above post, I am using my girlfriends iPad...

 

[SPLASTiK]

I'm sure every place is different, but one thing is universal - brewers love to try new beer.

I've heard the opposite from some brewers actually... especially from the ones that don't have backgrounds in homebrewing.

 

[brewingmeister]

I think there's one variable we're missing here... Do you have a beard?

-cheers

 

[lamarguy]

I've heard the opposite from some brewers actually... especially from the ones that don't have backgrounds in homebrewing.

Yes, it really depends on their view of homebrewing - some professional brewers think all homebrew is awful, infected swill.

Personally, I wouldn't want to work for a brewer that narrow minded anyway.

 

[bergman1118]

Man.. the OP's story is some coincidence.. I feel I'm in a VERY similar situation. Soul-sucking job. Passion for homebrewing. Certified chemist (though working as a Quality Manager for a dry food plant..). Desire to get into the brewing industry, despite the long hours, hard work, minimal pay. Hell, I live in NC too even!

I'd rather be doing something that I enjoy, even making less money, than working at a job that sucks the life out of me every time I drive into the parking lot.

Since I've made the decision to try to go pro, I've been attending more brewery events in my area (luckily there is a HIGH number of breweries per capita in my area), joined my local homebrew club, talked with some local brewers, entered competitions.. I'm trying to do anything and everything to get my foot in the door. So far, I haven't made any significant progress, but I am gaining insight and networking to a small degree. At the very LEAST, I'm having fun with the extra effort I've put in to reach my goal. That, in and of itself, has at least replenished some of the energy/soul lost wasting away at this job..

Anyway, I concur with Revvy and highly suggest that you go to the High Country Brew Fest. I actually volunteered at the event for 2 years and I am a graduate of Appalachian State, where I did 3 years of research on flavor/aroma volatiles of homebrewed beers, meads, and moonshine (I kid you not!). My research advisor, Dr. Taubman, is an AWESOME, down to earth guy (and an amazing homebrewer) who is attempting to start a fermentation science program at ASU. He has already established several brewing courses that cover the gamut from brewing science, to business, even to starting your own brewery. He's also established their pilot, educational brewery, Ivory Tower, which is gaining steam. I am planning on attending and want to catch up with Dr. Taubman. He is a great source of connections as he has been instrumental in setting the beer fest up. Of course, you have all of the breweries there and the great beer on tap as well. If you can make it, I would definitely recommend attending.

I find it so cool that we are really on the same page with this thing, in a lot of different ways. Good luck to you on your journey, and please post if you have any success (no matter how small)!