Hello from the Bavarian alpine foothills

[flipster]

Hi there,

here's a short story about me:
After a long break from my job at the time and the desire for a change, I considered an apprenticeship as a brewer and maltster and even registered for the degree programme in Weihenstephan. However, I received then a new job offer from my industry that I couldn't refuse, so I put the idea on ice again. By chance, we then had a book production in the house that advertised an "how to home brewing"-book. Without further ado, I bought this and started to put together my brewing system.
The hobby offers me now a great balance to my office job: simply spending a day doing manual work. That is why the system doesn't have a very high degree of automation and is only optimised for convenience.

About my system:
The system now runs on a regular base and gives me good results.
With boiling pots, a cool box as a runner vat, a fermentation barrel and a few metres of soldered copper pipes (I'm particularly proud of the bottle washing insert for the dishwasher), the system is already complete, and of course I gather (old) fridges now...
As my kettle is the bottleneck for the volume, the high gravity method is regularly used to gain 25% more volume without much additional effort (I tried two kettles, but that was somehow totally annoying).
Usually I use now 6kg malts, which results in 30-33l beer.

About the beers:
Visiting a foreign country I always try to get a taste of local beers, visit a brewery and gather new ideas. I consider myself lucky, living in a spot with a lot of good beers and famous breweries around, but there's so much more outside the little German Beer box (Bavarians can be so narrow-minded about their beer, horrible).
Mainly I brew classic bavarian wheat, pale ales and lager, in different colours and using hops from all around the world (especially down under). But also califormia common, american wheat and stouts already got out of my system.

My main goal is to recreate the Summer Ale from New Zealand's famous West Coast located brewery - and that's how I found this forum.

Cheers
flipster

 

[user 246304]

Very nice to meet you, Flipster. My wife's aunt, though Estonian, was born in Freising, I am very connected to the German baking community and count hundreds of friends from your extraordinary country. My own lineage, which we trace to the early 1500's, comes from Baden-Württemberg and the Schwarzwald. Hearty welcome!

 

[flipster]

Thanks for the warm welcome, Gadjobrinus!
If you have a good connection to German bread, you might try your own "Knärzje" (a Hesse word for the heel of a bread) - it's also on my loooong brew bucket list. It's from a brewery in Mainz, they use up to 25% dried bread crumbs in their beer, giving it a malty taste (they came up with this to support a zero food waste project).

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Hi there,

here's a short story about me:
After a long break from my job at the time and the desire for a change, I considered an apprenticeship as a brewer and maltster and even registered for the degree programme in Weihenstephan. However, I received then a new job offer from my industry that I couldn't refuse, so I put the idea on ice again. By chance, we then had a book production in the house that advertised an "how to home brewing"-book. Without further ado, I bought this and started to put together my brewing system.
The hobby offers me now a great balance to my office job: simply spending a day doing manual work. That is why the system doesn't have a very high degree of automation and is only optimised for convenience.

About my system:
The system now runs on a regular base and gives me good results.
With boiling pots, a cool box as a runner vat, a fermentation barrel and a few metres of soldered copper pipes (I'm particularly proud of the bottle washing insert for the dishwasher), the system is already complete, and of course I gather (old) fridges now...
As my kettle is the bottleneck for the volume, the high gravity method is regularly used to gain 25% more volume without much additional effort (I tried two kettles, but that was somehow totally annoying).
Usually I use now 6kg malts, which results in 30-33l beer.

About the beers:
Visiting a foreign country I always try to get a taste of local beers, visit a brewery and gather new ideas. I consider myself lucky, living in a spot with a lot of good beers and famous breweries around, but there's so much more outside the little German Beer box (Bavarians can be so narrow-minded about their beer, horrible).
Mainly I brew classic bavarian wheat, pale ales and lager, in different colours and using hops from all around the world (especially down under). But also califormia common, american wheat and stouts already got out of my system.

My main goal is to recreate the Summer Ale from New Zealand's famous West Coast located brewery - and that's how I found this forum.

Cheers
flipster

Welcome! How close can you get your homebrew to a Munich Helles from one the “the big guys”? Do you employ any LODO techniques?

 

[Clint Yeastwood]

Welcome. Man, I wish I could visit the alps right now. Too hard for my wife to get a visa.

 

[Rish]

Welcome aboard @flipster from the U. S. deep South. Hope you have much success making that NZ ale (not that I can be any help ).

 

[Zanatrik]

Thanks for the warm welcome, Gadjobrinus!
If you have a good connection to German bread, you might try your own "Knärzje" (a Hesse word for the heel of a bread) - it's also on my loooong brew bucket list. It's from a brewery in Mainz, they use up to 25% dried bread crumbs in their beer, giving it a malty taste (they came up with this to support a zero food waste project).

That’s really cool, never hear of that!

Welcome!

 

[ClaudiusB]

Hi there,

here's a short story about me:
After a long break from my job at the time and the desire for a change, I considered an apprenticeship as a brewer and maltster and even registered for the degree programme in Weihenstephan. However, I received then a new job offer from my industry that I couldn't refuse, so I put the idea on ice again. By chance, we then had a book production in the house that advertised an "how to home brewing"-book. Without further ado, I bought this and started to put together my brewing system.
The hobby offers me now a great balance to my office job: simply spending a day doing manual work. That is why the system doesn't have a very high degree of automation and is only optimised for convenience.

About my system:
The system now runs on a regular base and gives me good results.
With boiling pots, a cool box as a runner vat, a fermentation barrel and a few metres of soldered copper pipes (I'm particularly proud of the bottle washing insert for the dishwasher), the system is already complete, and of course I gather (old) fridges now...
As my kettle is the bottleneck for the volume, the high gravity method is regularly used to gain 25% more volume without much additional effort (I tried two kettles, but that was somehow totally annoying).
Usually I use now 6kg malts, which results in 30-33l beer.

About the beers:
Visiting a foreign country I always try to get a taste of local beers, visit a brewery and gather new ideas. I consider myself lucky, living in a spot with a lot of good beers and famous breweries around, but there's so much more outside the little German Beer box (Bavarians can be so narrow-minded about their beer, horrible).
Mainly I brew classic bavarian wheat, pale ales and lager, in different colours and using hops from all around the world (especially down under). But also califormia common, american wheat and stouts already got out of my system.

My main goal is to recreate the Summer Ale from New Zealand's famous West Coast located brewery - and that's how I found this forum.

Cheers
flipster

Welcome from a brewer from Baden-Württenberg.

 

[MaxStout]

Welcome, from Minnesota!

I have good friends in southern Germany. One in Stuttgart, and another just east of there, near Schwäbisch Gmünd, Baden-Württemberg.

Been several years since I had been there, need to get back one of these days.

 

[flipster]

Welcome! How close can you get your homebrew to a Munich Helles from one the “the big guys”? Do you employ any LODO techniques?

To be honest, I had to look that up first... so: no, I do not apply any technnique in particular. But yes, as 'don't stir your mash like a monkey on sugar' is something you get told in every seminar, book, etc., I try to keep the oxygen input as low as possible with things like 'more siphoning, less pouring'.

I've also never tried to recreate a 'traditional' Munich Helles, as I can get a good one everywhere around here. It's the most common beer type in my region, so every brewery offers their own version - and they do not differ that much in my opinion. I mean they do taste differently, but the breweries try to reach a wide, not very open-minded audience, when comes to beer taste.
But I can see the appeal to that, now you're mentioning the challenge.

Actually I have a Munich Dünkel in my fridge conditioning. It's probably the most traditional recipe I've ever brewed in my 5yrs. I'll keep you updated about this, if you're interested.

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

To be honest, I had to look that up first... so: no, I do not apply any technnique in particular. But yes, as 'don't stir your mash like a monkey on sugar' is something you get told in every seminar, book, etc., I try to keep the oxygen input as low as possible with things like 'more siphoning, less pouring'.

I've also never tried to recreate a 'traditional' Munich Helles, as I can get a good one everywhere around here. It's the most common beer type in my region, so every brewery offers their own version - and they do not differ that much in my opinion. I mean they do taste differently, but the breweries try to reach a wide, not very open-minded audience, when comes to beer taste.
But I can see the appeal to that, now you're mentioning the challenge.

Actually I have a Munich Dünkel in my fridge conditioning. It's probably the most traditional recipe I've ever brewed in my 5yrs. I'll keep you updated about this, if you're interested.

Definitely please do!
I have found the Munich Helles beers such as Augustiner-Brau Edelstoff to be of a wonderful fresh malty aroma that is just not evident in even commercial versions brewed locally here (Australia), or my own. They are great beers but see to lack this vibrant malt aroma, I have wondered if it’s just the freshness of the malt and the German malt being superior, or the process (ie. LODO etc).

 

[flipster]

Definitely please do!
I have found the Munich Helles beers such as Augustiner-Brau Edelstoff to be of a wonderful fresh malty aroma that is just not evident in even commercial versions brewed locally here (Australia), or my own. They are great beers but see to lack this vibrant malt aroma, I have wondered if it’s just the freshness of the malt and the German malt being superior, or the process (ie. LODO etc).

Your enthusiasm made me curious, so I had a first look into that and searched for recipes and similar questions. Not sure, what you already found out about that, so forgive me, if this is just repeating, what you already know.

It seems, like the thread I found in a German forum describes a mixture of both, what you already guessed: they use highly on the one product optimezed processes as well as ingredients, like in-house roasted malts and yeast, which makes it almost impossible.
I found also a good article about Munich Helles - I think I might try one of these at some point, just to do a 'classic' one (and I will tell you). Unfortunately it's German only available: https://braumagazin.de/article/muenchner-hell-rezepte-und-brautipps/

 

[DJ_L3ThAL]

Your enthusiasm made me curious, so I had a first look into that and searched for recipes and similar questions. Not sure, what you already found out about that, so forgive me, if this is just repeating, what you already know.

It seems, like the thread I found in a German forum describes a mixture of both, what you already guessed: they use highly on the one product optimezed processes as well as ingredients, like in-house roasted malts and yeast, which makes it almost impossible.
I found also a good article about Munich Helles - I think I might try one of these at some point, just to do a 'classic' one (and I will tell you). Unfortunately it's German only available: https://braumagazin.de/article/muenchner-hell-rezepte-und-brautipps/

This site has some good information too https://edelstoffquest.wordpress.com/

 

[user 246304]

Thanks for the warm welcome, Gadjobrinus!
If you have a good connection to German bread, you might try your own "Knärzje" (a Hesse word for the heel of a bread) - it's also on my loooong brew bucket list. It's from a brewery in Mainz, they use up to 25% dried bread crumbs in their beer, giving it a malty taste (they came up with this to support a zero food waste project).

My friend, the guy who in essence leads the group, comes from Münsterland, so not too far away. I'll have to ask him about that!

 

[flipster]

Definitely please do!

Here's the promised update on my Munich Dunkel, that I made six weeks ago, bottled four weeks ago.

I tased the first bottle yesterevening and I'm very happy with the result. It really is a very traditional style dark lager, compared to what I know from the breweries around. There's a hint of sweet maltiness at first, a full body and a very slighly taste of hops at the end. Typical Select spicy-herbal notes and fuity-flowery addition from a pinch of Bramling Cross.
I was following this recipe: Münchener Dunkel.
The Bramling Cross was used in combination with the Select, as I assumed a higher alpha value when ordering the Select and would otherwise not have got the IBU.

 

[flipster]

Here's and update about my "Müchener Helles"-reasearch:

I've tasted now my two types of traditional style Helles, I brewed a few weeks ago in comparison with a Helles from a nearby local brewery.
I made one version with simple infusion mash steps and one with decoction, and especially the decoction version got quite close to the 'professional' one IMO.

Here's the recipe, batch size 5l at 12°P original wort and 20 IBU:
900g Pilsener
70g CaraPils
30g acid malt

3,5l strike water

infusion steps:
rest 10min 57°C
rest 45min 63°C
rest 45min 72°C
mash of 76°C

decoction steps
rest 10min 57°C
rest 30min 63°C
pull thick mash, rest 10min at 72°C, boiling for 10min and infusing into main mash, results in 72°C rest for 30min
pull thin mash, boiling for 10min, infusing into main mash, results in 76°C, then mash out

3,6l sparging water

4,5g Tettnanger (12 IBU)
2,4g Hallertauer Mittelfrüh (8 IBU)
Add all the hops to the wort brew and boil for 70 minutes.

SafLager S-23

I didn't treat the water, as we have (luckily) a very high quality tap water, just VERY hard.

Now, that I have revived my 5 litre system and tweaked around it a bit, it's fun to do more smaller batches and try different variations of the same recipe. This way I get a continuous supply of Bavarian Helles (could be worse )
Next steps after the one the repeatability I brewed yesterday I already have some variations in mind e.g. without the CaraPils (to get a dryer beer) and with other traditional hops (Hallertauer Perle)