From brew day to yeast pitch, how long can i wait before pitching?

[BugAC]

This seems like a newb question, but i've never run into this before. I ordered some grains from Austin Homebrew Supply and shockingly (sarcasm) it did not get shipped out until an entire week after my order, which screwed up my brew day plans. I do have some grains at home, but my yeast was in the order for the beer. How long could i wait from the beer being brewed before i have to pitch? I was thinking of brewing saturday, aerate and pitch a day after my order came in, on Wednesday. It' s a mixed fermentation beer, if that matters, but base style is saison.

 

[hotbeer]

It's all a question of how sanitary everything is and whether the bad stuff starts multiplying before the good stuff. And chance plays a part in whether you'll get away with it or not. That's why many of us like to cool our wort and pitch yeast ASAP.

There are a good amount of people that don't chill and wait till the next day to pitch after the wort has cooled on it's own. They generally do things a little different. What that is, I'm not qualified to say. But if you aren't going to pitch right away you should search for and read up on "no chill" beer brewing.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I could be wrong here, as i am not familiar with the no chill process and timeframe, but I would probably atleast re-boil the wort when you get the yeast, chill it, then pitch. That way you kill any nasties that may have started enjoying your hard earned wort.

 

[wdavis2003]

Depends on how you are storing the beer for those 4 days. I'd be comfortable racking to my Fermzilla and purging with CO2 and leaving it there for a few days in an O2 free environment but I don't think I'd be as comfortable racking to a bucket fermenter and leaving it for 3 or 4 days.

That being said, I've pitched dead yeast into a bucket fermenter and after waiting 72 hours with no activity I pitched viable yeast and the beer turned out fine. That obviously wasn't planned that way though.

 

[BongoYodeler]

It could work, but waiting 4 days to pitch the yeast? I would never take that chance. Why not just reschedule the brew day to a time where you can brew and pitch the yeast the same day, or at most a day later?

 

[Ninoid]

I brew with No Chill and I never wait more than 24 hours, and I try to shorten it as much as possible if the ambient temperature is higher. I don't think it's good for more than 24 hours unless you store the wort in the fridge.

 

[whoaru99]

I may try the no chill method.

In some regards it seems like it might be even less risky to a point than messing around with chilling.

At flameout do the whirlpool, sanitize the BK lid, put lid back on BK while still piping hot. Seems like that would be a pretty sanitary environment.

I did read about concerns for continued hop action and oxidation leaving in the BK, but seems the actual effect likely depends on the beer style.

 

[BongoYodeler]

I may try the no chill method.

In some regards it seems like it might be even less risky to a point than messing around with chilling.

At flameout do the whirlpool, sanitize the BK lid, put lid back on BK while still piping hot. Seems like that would be a pretty sanitary environment.

Pretty sure wild yeast and other airborne organisms are small enough that they would still see that as a wide open door.

I brewed yesterday, but running my warm groundwater through my IC I can only drop my wort to around 80°f. So when I hit 80°I transferred the wort to my Speidel fermenter which I can seal air-tight. I was then able to chill it down to the mid sixties and was then pitch the yeast several hours later.
The stock picture below shows only the bottom orange cap installed, but a second one, when installed on the top, gives me the confidence to hold off pitching yeast until the next day if I have to.

 

[whoaru99]

Pretty sure wild yeast and other airborne organisms are small enough that they would still see that as a wide open door.

I guess that's sorta the point of my thought/question.

Is that door open any more or less than it is whilst my boil kettle is pretty much wide open when the immersion chiller is dunked and I'm stirring to help keep warm wort moving around the cool coils.

Seems like it might be less open but, yeah, certainly not sealed.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

Yes, but if you pitch right away the yeast become dominant, not allowing the nasties to enjoy your wort. If you let it sit, the nasties have time to grow before the yeast is pitched and once that happens your batch is ruined.

 

[whoaru99]

Yes, but if you pitch right away the yeast become dominant, not allowing the nasties to enjoy your wort. If you let it sit, the nasties have time to grow before the yeast is pitched and once that happens your batch is ruined.

Well, i wouldn't argue with the theory but whether it ends up that way is something else.

The hard part is it would take multiple iterations to conclude somewhat affirmatively either way.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

Well, i wouldn't argue with the theory but whether it ends up that way is something else.

The hard part is it would take multiple iterations to conclude somewhat affirmatively either way.

It's not a theory... it's literally why we chill and pitch as quickly as possible, amongst other reasons, but avoiding contamination is #1 sure there are ways around it but if you leave your kettle sit with just a lid on for 4 days before pitching yeast I don't think you'll like the end result.

 

[Bramling Cross]

Well, i wouldn't argue with the theory but whether it ends up that way is something else.

The hard part is it would take multiple iterations to conclude somewhat affirmatively either way.

No, you just need a microscope. Believe me, it's horrifying what you find lurking on a microscope slide. All of our beers are contaminated to one degree or another. The trick is creating conditions within which that trace contamination doesn't matter. If you wait four days, you're allowing the nasties a big head start--and that's not a theory, that's reality.

 

[whoaru99]

If you wait four days, you're allowing the nasties a big head start--and that's not a theory, that's reality.

Did I say anything about waiting four days?

 

[whoaru99]

if you leave your kettle sit with just a lid on for 4 days before pitching yeast I don't think you'll like the end result.

Again, did I say anything about four days?

Maybe the OP alluded to that but I most certainly did not.

Everything is a fail with a ripe cherry pluck.

 

[IslandLizard]

Please, as others have already said, don't brew until you have the yeast to pitch on hand. It's not uncommon for shipments to be delayed or even being short.
Wort sitting for 4 days, even at 50-60F, waiting for a healthy yeast pitch will allow any microorganisms to start blooming, potentially causing off flavors, or even spoilage.

Which yeast did you order?
Dry yeast can be pitched as is after you chilled the wort, but liquid (wet) yeast most likely needs to be build up with a starter a few days ahead of brewing.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

Again, did I say anything about four days?

Maybe the OP alluded to that but I most certainly did not.

Everything is a fail with a ripe cherry pluck.

The op did say exactly that and I am suggesting not to. If you wanna do a no chill and follow that process that's fine, but the op is talking about 4 days here, so I was mainly responding to his question and not wanting to mislead him.

 

[whoaru99]

The op did say exactly that and I am suggesting not to. If you wanna do a no chill and follow that process that's fine, but the op is talking about 4 days here, so I was mainly responding to his question and not wanting to mislead him.

Fair enough, but then I suggest not quoting me for a comment/rebuttal intended for the OP.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

I was simply making a point. The op said 4 days and your post came across like that was ok. I wanted to clarify to the op that no chill for 4 days is a bad idea. Not quoting as to not offend.

 

[Bramling Cross]

Fair enough, but then I suggest not quoting me for a comment/rebuttal intended for the OP.

Breathe.

 

[whoaru99]

Breathe.

Yawn.

 

[odie]

I could be wrong here, as i am not familiar with the no chill process and timeframe, but I would probably atleast re-boil the wort when you get the yeast, chill it, then pitch. That way you kill any nasties that may have started enjoying your hard earned wort.

re boil is gonna ruin any aroma hops additions. Hops are on a schedule for a reason.

 

[bailey mountain brewer]

re boil is gonna ruin any aroma hops additions. Hops are on a schedule for a reason.

I agree, but infection will ruin it more.

 

[ninkwood]

Depends on how you are storing the beer for those 4 days. I'd be comfortable racking to my Fermzilla and purging with CO2 and leaving it there for a few days in an O2 free environment but I don't think I'd be as comfortable racking to a bucket fermenter and leaving it for 3 or 4 days.

That being said, I've pitched dead yeast into a bucket fermenter and after waiting 72 hours with no activity I pitched viable yeast and the beer turned out fine. That obviously wasn't planned that way though.

This thread has been inactive for a while, but I wanted to add that the risk/issue with the idea of storing wort in an oxygen free environment is botulism. Wort ph before fermentation is not sufficiently low enough to ward off the bacteria that create botulism, and boiling temperatures aren't high enough to kill these particular bacteria. So don't store unfermented wort in an oxygen-free environment for an extended period of time.

 

[mac_1103]

I wanted to add that the risk/issue with the idea of storing wort in an oxygen free environment is botulism

No-chill brewing is quite popular in Australia and apparently people will wait up to 8 weeks to pitch the yeast. No reports of botulism from Southern Hemisphere homebrew that I'm aware of. So maybe the wort isn't really an oxygen-free environment even though it's sealed in a container with minimal headspace?

 

[ninkwood]

No-chill brewing is quite popular in Australia and apparently people will wait up to 8 weeks to pitch the yeast. No reports of botulism from Southern Hemisphere homebrew that I'm aware of. So maybe the wort isn't really an oxygen-free environment even though it's sealed in a container with minimal headspace?

Yeah, I mean I wouldn't do this for many different reasons, but if you're just putting a lid on something you're not creating an oxygen free environment so you should be fine as far as botulism is concerned.

The post I was replying to mentioned purging the head space of a pressure fermenter with CO2, and I think that's where it starts getting sketchy for me.

Botulism is pretty rare these days, but the rule from canning is that you either need to use a pressure cooker that is capable of boiling at 115°C+ or you need a ph below 4.6.