Freeze concentration

[Slowninja]

Even "moonshine" mash has a negligible amount of methanol. Its just concentrated through distillation.

Getting off topic, the methanol in your wine will never be enough to hurt you, even if you freeze seperate it

 

[JeepDiver]

Not alot though compared to grains.

Everything is going to have Methanol in it, just a negligable amount.

So that is why you use pectin enzyme with fruit and not grain? Because fruit has less pectin? Sorry but you need to do a little more reading

 

[Inner10]

Not alot though compared to grains.

Everything is going to have Methanol in it, just a negligable amount.

It's really high in citrus fruit.

But other than that you are right, throwing out the foreshot is often overkill.

 

[jetgemini]

Oh help I crushed and froze my red and green California grapes and I forgot to put them in my daughters freezer when I got to New Mexico. This was just long enough for them to thaw for fear of spoiling I began the process yesterday and now have an active must in her pantry I have to leave here for Home in South Carolina in 2 weeks. If I put it in the carboy and move it will it be okay? Will I get arrested if the police stop me?
SOS Heeeeelp!!!

 

[jeepinjeepin]

Oh help I crushed and froze my red and green California grapes and I forgot to put them in my daughters freezer when I got to New Mexico. This was just long enough for them to thaw for fear of spoiling I began the process yesterday and now have an active must in her pantry I have to leave here for Home in South Carolina in 2 weeks. If I put it in the carboy and move it will it be okay? Will I get arrested if the police stop me?
SOS Heeeeelp!!!

A little off topic, but I would worry much about it. Don't get stopped. If you do don't advertise it unless the officer asks about it.

 

[BamaProud]

Very interesting read folks.

 

[Revvy]

Did the mods just change the title?

 

[BamaProud]

Anyone Freeze concentrate EdWort Apfelwein(original recipe). What is the the final product like?

 

[jeepinjeepin]

Anyone Freeze concentrate EdWort Apfelwein(original recipe). What is the the final product like?

Yup. Like 2x Apfelwein. It's quite warm, but tasty.

 

[BamaProud]

Thanks, I actually searched all 11,000 replies to the original Apfelwein thread and found some discussion starting at post #8642.

I think I need to go ahead and start another 5 gal batch, as of now I have 5 ways I want to try my first batch. Plain, backwseetened, carbed/plain, carbed/backsweetened and now freeze concentrated.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

Thanks, I actually searched all 11,000 replies to the original Apfelwein thread and found some discussion starting at post #8642.

I think I need to go ahead and start another 5 gal batch, as of now I have 5 ways I want to try my first batch. Plain, backwseetened, carbed/plain, carbed/backsweetened and now freeze concentrated.

I've been step feeding an Apfelwein. I've not made an actual thread but mentioned it a few places. It's above 14% now. It may make it to 17%. Should I freeze it?

 

[BamaProud]

I don't know, but from what I have been reading you essentially half your volume, doubling the ABV in the Freeze concentration process. However, I don't think I would freeze until after all fermentation is done. Let the yeast make alcohol naturally as long as they will/can.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

Oh, I would definitely let it finish out.

 

[Unferth]

I've been step feeding an Apfelwein. I've not made an actual thread but mentioned it a few places. It's above 14% now. It may make it to 17%. Should I freeze it?

Hey jeepin, we always end up on these threads together, no?

If you recall, I had a 16 % ABV cyser I tried to freeze and had a heck of a time doing it. I had to borrow a friends super-deep freezer, and it took a couple days to freeze then, but it did it. And wowza,what a drink... We use it for cough syrup, but you could easily use it for pain management, haha.

I would advise putting it in as small of bottles as you can get away with to freeze it.

 

[nwchemist]

This may help. The body's mechanism to fight both ethanol and methanol is alcohol dehydrogenase, an enzyme that breaks down the alcohols. Methanol binds and is oxidized and generally forms formaldehyde, which can cause a number of adverse effects. This debate about methanol is not really an issue because ethanol is a competitive inhibitor for the reaction, so as long as it is in greater quantity the methanol will not bind to the enzyme. This is also the "cure" for methanol poisoning as well as ethylene glycol.

 

[Unferth]

This may help. The body's mechanism to fight both ethanol and methanol is alcohol dehydrogenase, an enzyme that breaks down the alcohols. Methanol binds and is oxidized and generally forms formaldehyde, which can cause a number of adverse effects. This debate about methanol is not really an issue because ethanol is a competitive inhibitor for the reaction, so as long as it is in greater quantity the methanol will not bind to the enzyme. This is also the "cure" for methanol poisoning as well as ethylene glycol.

That is a very helpful post; welcome to the forum.

 

[krackin]

Yikes! Glad I never did that, only pretended, and I'll never do it again.

 

[jeepinjeepin]

Wow! I wonder if policy has changed since the Basic Brewing guys got their response back or if it is up to interpretation within TTB?

 

[tkmorgan]

deleted quote

So, when did water become a fermented substance?

 

[Pappers_]

On the advice of legal counsel, the site's administrator allows discussion of freeze concentration but does not allow any discussion of distillation. The statements earlier in this thread that freeze concentration is legally the same as distillation are incorrect.

Please do not discuss distillation.

 

[Johnnyhitch1]

Took 6 12 oz bottles of Grape apfelwine frozen in a container over night.
2 hours in a funnel, first runnings were 16oz

Has to be around 28-30%.
Cheers to Apfel Eisen Wine!!

Anyone Freeze concentrate EdWort Apfelwein(original recipe). What is the the final product like?

Just found this...so theres a reply!

Nice and warm with a smooth crisp apple flavor. A sipper for sure and i wouldnt even have more than a couple oz of it in a sitting. This stuff WILL put you on your ass while destroying your next day.

 

[oogaboogachiefwalkingdeer]

Freeze in a two liter bottle and drain off throw away the ice. Re freeze the liquid you got the first time and drain off again throw away the ice. Do this three times and on the third time bottle what is left and throw away the slush. Now you have something. Mike

 

[wilserbrewer]

Now you have something. Mike

Or better yet, let it age for a year or so...seems to smooth out a bit....

 

[garfieldwithissuez]

Are you suggesting we leave it for a year before or after the freezing process?

 

[wilserbrewer]

Probably both would be best. The bottle I have seems to get better with age, I take a nip every 6 months or so.

 

[Kdog22]

Wait so freeze concentration for home consumption, is perfectly legal in the US?

 

[garfieldwithissuez]

That is what I'm getting from this. It also looks like it's legal to sell if you've a license to sell beer. Kinda neat.

 

[twofocused]

I need to get another cider with an ale yeast going for this.

Hangover here we come.

 

[wilserbrewer]

Hangover here we come.

Exactly the problem with freeze distillation, and why I wouldn't make this a "house" product and consume large quantities on a regular basis. With freeze concentration, you are getting the acetone, methyl, ethyl, the phenol's and fusels, as opposed to distilatiion where an effort is made to discard the poison and keep only the ethyl. Throw out the heads and tails, and keep the hearts as they say...not that I know anything about it, Just heard it from a friend who knows a guy...

 

[BamaProud]

How would the phenols increase or be created because of the freezing process?

If I freeze concentrate a gal...down to 1/2 gal, there would be the same amount of phenols in the pre and post frozen stuff, just in higher concentration. Seems to reason you would have the same side effects from drinking the gallon of pre-frozen stuff as you would with the 1/2 gal concentrated stuff.