Flavor improvement needed: Small batch recipe review

[DeanRIowa]

I have done a couple of 5 gallon cider batches using juice, sugar and Lalvin EC-1118 Champagne Yeast, but with mixed results. What I got was quite dry and low apple flavor. I would like to get more apple flavor and a little sweeter, not really looking for high alcohol content.

I picked up a used Mr Beer* kit and I was thinking of using the below recipe:

Recipe:

• 2 gallons Walmart apple juice
• 12 oz frozen apple juice concentrate
• 1 tsp Yeast Nutrient
• 3 oz - lactose - Back Sweeten
• Nottingham ale yeast

• 2 oz Brown Sugar- Bottling priming sugar

Is the above recipe going to get more apple flavor and some sweetness(not over powering sweetness)?

Any changes or recommendations in recipe or process would be appreciated.


Thank you,

Dean


* Mr Beer kit was missing lid, but I found one container lid in the house that fits tightly and I only need to add a grommet and airlock.

 

[CKuhns]

I have not used Nottingham Ale Yeast but have used other Ale yeasts. With apple juice and FAJC it is best to ferment near ar below the recommended temp range. Fast and warm will strip the apple flavors. Im not at all surprised the 1118 went dry.

Kick the gravity up to about 1.060 using more FAJC. See if you can get the yeast to stop near 1.005. Consider adding some tannens (Oak or tea and a little acid to secondary.) I have not tried lactose as a sweetener. A trick i use if it does go bone dry is to add some whole fruit to secondary. Slightly less than a pound per gallon. The fruit kind of tricks you into thinking its sweeter than it is and brings some nice flavor back with it.

 

[Lefou]

Using certain ale yeasts at the appropriate fermenting temperature may yield phenols and esters you don't want that overpower the apple flavor. Even "clean" ale yeasts like WLP001 or US-05 at cooler temps may not leave much flavor behind if the ABV is fairly low, so I agree with bumping up the gravity - and possibly doing so with bochet (caramelized honey), Belgian candy sugar, or your own concoction of apple-flavored invert syrup.
Adding fruit is a good idea but doing so while the yeast is still active can prolong your fermentation. If you want more apple flavor, consider finishing your original fermentation at your desired gravity and de-activating the yeast with refrigeration and potassium sorbate, THEN add your desired fruit additions. As the brew cures and ages at lowered temperatures the natural fruit essence can transfer to your drink, then you can decant off the fruit and enjoy.
This is a multi-step process so I don't think you can do this with one Mr. Beer container - you might need a couple gallon wine jugs and another excuse to up your brewing hardware collection.

 

[DeanRIowa]

Add one more FAJC?, Any brown sugar?
How about some key lemon juice for acid?
What kind of tea and how much?

Thanks,
Dean

 

[CKuhns]

Add one more FAJC?, Any brown sugar?
How about some key lemon juice for acid?
What kind of tea and how much?

Thanks,
Dean

Enough FAJC to hit your target gravity of 1.060. IDK 3 or 4 cans? Could probably do the math if you knew the sugar content of the FAJC. Many folks do use brown sugar. But again you want the apple flavor brown sugar IMO only bumps up the gravity doesn't really bring much flavor with it. Lemon or key lime juice works great for the acid, so does LD Carlsons acid blend. Tea is really a personal preference. I like it as part of primary addition, but as of late have been shying away from it ss i have been adding fruit to secondary. Steep 10 or 12 black tea bags in 1/2 gallon apple juice for no more than 10 or 15 minutes. (Again some folks really dont care for tea in cider.) You could add a vanilla bean split in secondary for a week or so or a half ounce of med toast oak chips for similar results.

 

[Justwingnit]

I love 4 gallon Indiana Summer Cider, yeast nutrients 4 lb light brown sugar, wlp 775 yeast or cosco cider, this is my basic recipe, I do more too sometimes in primary, sometimes in secondary, or at bottling, but I have found wlp 775 leaves alot of apple flavor and you can stop it and keep it sweet or let it go and will dry it out too. I've made 5%ABV and I've made 14%ABV also the low ABV I have not needed to back flavor but the high ABV have needed help with flavor.

Good luck and have fun

 

[Maylar]

Brown sugar is OK as a sweetener (in stabilized finished cider), but many people think it sucks when fermented. What remains when the sugar is gone is bitter and nasty tasting.


JMO, and YMMV as they say.

 

[Justwingnit]

Brown sugar is OK as a sweetener (in stabilized finished cider), but many people think it sucks when fermented. What remains when the sugar is gone is bitter and nasty tasting.


JMO, and YMMV as they say.

WoW I have been using basic brown sugar, light brown, or dark brown and I gues me and all my supporters must have bitter and nasty taste buds because I'm on batch 14 in 14 months, I can't keep it around and I rarely back flavor. Hmmm I may have to try basic old fashion sugar and see what the heck your talking about.

 

[Maylar]

It's a personal thing I'm sure. I love brown sugar in cookies and molasses in pumpkin pie, but when fermented I find it icky. I know I'm not alone on that.

But do what works for you.

 

[Justwingnit]

It's a personal thing I'm sure. I love brown sugar in cookies and molasses in pumpkin pie, but when fermented I find it icky. I know I'm not alone on that.

But do what works for you.

I hear ya, all I'm saying is i never tryed not using brown sugar so i think I'll try and see...
It's all good, have fun and be safe

 

[Blacksmith1]

I'm drinking one that was about half and half. After reading this I'm wondering if the odd taste I can't identify is the brown sugar. I know brown has added molasses. Turbanado is unprocessed does it act the same way?

 

[Cantina De Jefe]

Prime with apple juice concentrate. If you find a way to halt the yeast you could back sweeten it that way and force carb...

 

[DeanRIowa]

Prime with apple juice concentrate. If you find a way to halt the yeast you could back sweeten it that way and force carb...

Good idea, but currently I can only bottle, I do hope in the future to be able to keg.

thank you,
Dean

 

[Maylar]

I'm drinking one that was about half and half. After reading this I'm wondering if the odd taste I can't identify is the brown sugar. I know brown has added molasses. Turbanado is unprocessed does it act the same way?

Too bad technology hasn't brought us the ability to e-taste something (yet). But what I'm talking about is molasses. I get a bitterness from it that I just don't like. My first experience with that was following the caramel apple recipe here. Yuk. Ended up dumping the gallon batch.

 

[Blacksmith1]

Yes the one i was drinking had brown sugar in the ferment and an odd flavor that reminds me of molassas. So i'm thinking that's what it was. Just wondering if the turbanado does the same or similar.

 

[Maylar]

Turbanado does have some molasses in it, so I dunno. I never use any sugar in my ciders, they start at 1.050 and give me 6.5% ABV. Works for me.

 

[MarkKF]

Brown sugar is OK as a sweetener (in stabilized finished cider), but many people think it sucks when fermented. What remains when the sugar is gone is bitter and nasty tasting.


JMO, and YMMV as they say.

I used to use it as priming sugar in a dry cider.

 

[Blacksmith1]

Turbanado does have some molasses in it, so I dunno. I never use any sugar in my ciders, they start at 1.050 and give me 6.5% ABV. Works for me.

i was actually trying for a dry apple wine. Since I like apples and brown sugar I thought this would make for a great flavor combo. If I do it again I'll ferment white, and backsweeten with brown.

 

[GeneDaniels1963]

Back to the OP's question about getting more apple flavor. I use 1 or 2 cans of FAJC per gal of juice. Sure it kicks up the ABV, but it also gives really nice apple flavor.

I also use Notthingham most of the time, fermenting in the 60s. I even did a couple batches outside recently. It was back and forth between low 50s and 20s. While the ferment took a long time (3 months), it was really nice and smooth. I plan to do several gal that way next fall.