Flameout Hops

[pedrovic]

Hi, I hope you are well.
What are the best hops to add bitterness to flameout? I plan to use only this addition in my next brewing. Can anyone help me?

Thank you

 

[day_trippr]

Relying on flameout (and even more so whirlpool) additions for bittering incurs some peril with respect to character "baggage" that would be boiled out of hops used as early additions - many high alpha hops that could get the job done might provide character that doesn't fit the style you intend to brew. If you have some idea on what character you desire (or at least can tolerate) that might help narrow down the options.

Here are the current IBU leaders in the commercial hop repertoire. If you visit the linked site you can drill down into each hop to a comparison tool which can be handy.

Cheers!

 

[sibelman]

I must be missing something. Traditionally, late hops are thought to add aroma and flavors besides bitterness, which is more from earlier hops. So, @pedrovic , I'm curious: why the special interest in deriving bitterness at flameout?

 

[pedrovic]

@sibelman My intention is to balance bitterness, flavor and aroma in a single late addition. I plan to leave the wort resting naturally up to 85C and use the chiller after that.

 

[pedrovic]

Relying on flameout (and even more so whirlpool) additions for bittering incurs some peril with respect to character "baggage" that would be boiled out of hops used as early additions - many high alpha hops that could get the job done might provide character that doesn't fit the style you intend to brew. If you have some idea on what character you desire (or at least can tolerate) that might help narrow down the options.

Here are the current IBU leaders in the commercial hop repertoire. If you visit the linked site you can drill down into each hop to a comparison tool which can be handy.

View attachment 822453
Cheers!

Thank you @day_trippr for this information. Cheers!

 

[pvtpublic]

You'll need to leave it in whirlpool for a while before cooling in order to get some isomerization. If the alpha acids don't isomerize, they won't be soluble and will either drop out of solution or stay inside the hop material.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

My intention is to balance bitterness, flavor and aroma in a single late addition. I plan to leave the wort resting naturally up to 85C [185F] and use the chiller after that.

The conflicting conditions that need to be balanced are
1) time above about 180F-ish to create bitterness
2) time below about 175F-ish to create/retain aromas/flavors

Are you familiar with BBR's "Hop Sampler" process? They make a 6-pack (perfect for sampling) using 1 lb DME, 0.75 gal water, and a hop. Bring the water to a boil, add the DME & hops, let it chill naturally for 20 minutes, then chill to pitching temperature. They have a number of episodes where they compare a number of different hops. In one of the episodes, they report on lab measured IBUs. Brulosophy also has an article with lab measured IBUs.

The "no boil (pasteurized)" topics here at HomeBrewTalk take a slightly different approach. It's roughly: heat water to "hop steep" temperature (say 175F), add DME and hops, hold at 175F for 20 or 30 minutes.

I've used both processes with the same ingredients. The result is two noticably different beers.

 

[ncbrewer]

I must be missing something. Traditionally, late hops are thought to add aroma and flavors besides bitterness, which is more from earlier hops. So, @pedrovic , I'm curious: why the special interest in deriving bitterness at flameout?

Sometimes I do something close to that. I plan on a 20 - 30 minute hop stand. Temperature of about 180 seems good, but I'm doing some experimenting with the hop stand temperature - no results yet. 2 oz of hops in the hop stand (in a 5 gallon batch) seems to work well, depending on the hop variety. Generally, some hops are needed at the beginning of the boil to get to the target IBU. I figure this based on calculations of hop utilization in sub-boiling temperatures. I'm doing some work on my computer at the moment and can't access the article, but if you're interested I'll get it after my computer is fully functioning.

 

[sibelman]

if you're interested

Thanks for the offer, @ncbrewer. I follow a simpler path, adding bittering hops during boil, and whirlpool/chilling to below 170°F before adding aroma hops.

Frankly, I seem to be finding that dry hops at the end of fermentation and/or in the serving keg make much more difference than earlier hops in achieving the floral aromas I want in my IPAs and DIPAs. But I understand and respect that folks are trying all sorts of methods of getting the flavors and aromas they seek.

Cheers!

 

[day_trippr]

dry hops at the end of fermentation and/or in the serving keg make much more difference than earlier hops in achieving the floral aromas I want in my IPAs and DIPAs

I agree. But I think everyone would...

Cheers!

 

[sibelman]

I think everyone would

Sorry to belabor the obvious.

 

[day_trippr]

lol! Just trying to reassure you that you're not perched on a ledge

Cheers!

 

[sibelman]

perched on a ledge

No worries. For feeling precarious, see this thread in the debate form.