First Lager Brew Questions

[scurry64]

I am brewing my first lager this weekend. I have a few questions and could use some guidance. Here is my recipe and my yeast calculation.

(1) Is there any concern that I am over pitching the yeast? I hope not because my starter is already made. If it is a real concern, is there anything I can do at this point to remedy the error? (The reason I did the step-up is that the original starter would have sat in my refrigerator for 7 days before my brew date.)

(2) Has anyone tried bottle conditioning before lagering? It seems to me that this is the way to go in order to avoid pitching more yeast after lagering and before bottling. Any suggestions?

(3) Is it always necessary to rack a lager to a secondary fermenter?

(4) I was considering doing the primary fermentation of this 2.5 gallon batch in a 3 gallon carboy with a blow off tube. Would that be a mistake in terms of not having enough head space?

Thanks for your help and Go Kings Go!

 

[badbrew]

I don't think it's always necessary, but I think it is wise to rack because a couple months is a long time to try to avoid kicking stuff around.

I am curious about the conditioning as well whether it's before or after lagering.

 

[TyTanium]

I did a fair amount of reading on lagering pre/post bottling. Consensus seems to be that bulk lagering is better. As is lagering without pressure.

Some have lagered in bottles and report good results, though I've never seen a side-by-side. FWIW, I decided against it.

Re: your other questions:
Your fermenter space should be fine. Lager krausens aren't as crazy with the lower temps.
I wouldn't worry about overpitching. Good job having enough yeast. Pitch cold.

Here's some more reading for you: http://braukaiser.com/wiki/index.php?title=Fermenting_Lagers

 

[scurry64]

Does lagering obviate the need to add gelatin?

 

[StoneHands]

You shouldn't need gelatin after lagering, that being said though, sometimes you get a batch that won't clear not matter what.
1. Don't worry about the overpitch. Pitch cold (at or slightly below fermentation temps) and it'll be great.

2. I haven't done this, only bottle conditioned after lagering. I have bottle conditioned a bock I lagered for 4 months, and didn't pitch new yeast. Granted, it took a long time to carb, but it did come up.

3. If you're going to bulk lager, transfer it to secondary.

4. Fermenter size sounds fine, small krausens with lagers as was stated already.

 

[badbrew]

Does lagering obviate the need to add gelatin?

My lager is very hazy. Cest la vie.

 

[scurry64]

How sweet should my mash be? It tastes like warm simple syrup.

 

[oakbarn]

You need to read the SG, not taste it. We ferment lagers in a corney keg with good results as it is easy to use a freezer with temp control as a fermentaion camber. We do nothing special to the keg except to attach a open blowoff to the gas side that is placed in a water jug with start san. We ferment normally at 45 to 52 degrees depending on the yeast profile with a diacytel rest after 7 days. We raise them 5 degrees a day until 70 degrees, leave for 2 days, the 5 degees a day back to ferment. We de trub by pushing it out the beer tube when back to temp. We leave an additional 30 days at ferment temp. We then de trub again, wait a day, de trub again and then move to our serving keg and leave for 4 months. The lager is crystal clear when we transfer to the serving keg. If we were bottiling, I would do it at the same time we transfer to our serving keg. We do not bottle but force carbonate so I am of little help there, but leaving in primary, it will clear if you leave it and do not disturb.

 

[scurry64]

5 hours after pitching the yeast, this what it looks like. Seems pretty fast, but I don't have a reference point because I've never used a glass carboy before today. Relaxing, nor worrying.

 

[scurry64]

Today is day No. 6. I checked the SG and it was 1011.5 after adjusting for temperature. The expected FG was 1012. I should probably check it again tomorrow, but since it exceeded the expectation, I would think it's done. Should I rack to the secondary today, or am I being impatient?

I couldn't resist tasting it. To my surprise it felt carbonated. Is this normal for a lager?

 

[oakbarn]

What kind of yeast did you use? That seems a little fast but not too fast. You should also do a diacytel rest at this time otherwise you may have some "buttery popcorn" taste in the lager. We normally transferred to a secondary after the rest. Since you are in a carboy, I would also.

 

[scurry64]

I used WLP840. I pitched a lot of yeast. See my first post.
Thanks for reminding me about the diacetyl rest. I almost forgot.

 

[scurry64]

I'll call this a success. It tastes great. The head retention was average. I would love to figure what causes chill haze and eliminate it, but it's better than drinking Bud.

 

[jwalker1140]

I'm planning my first lager and I found this thread helpful.

One comment regarding your yeastcalc screen shot. I wrote the creator recently and asked his advice on how to step a starter, specifically, what I should focus on when deciding how big each step should be. He said it's best to adjust the Starter Volume so that the Inoculation Rate is between 50 and 100 millions/ml at each step. Keeps the yeast growing at an optimal rate and from getting too stressed. Just thought I'd pass this along.

 

[chemman14]

I'll call this a success. It tastes great. The head retention was average. I would love to figure what causes chill haze and eliminate it, but it's better than drinking Bud.


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Chill haze is a by product of wort production. The only way to eliminate it would be to get your beer cold and then filter it. But then you definitely wouldn't be able to bottle condition it