Firestone Walker Wookey Jack Clone Attempt

[skeezerpleezer]

D'oh! I just looked at my yeast vial and it expires next week. I looked at my LHBS and all the vials were outdated (WTF!). I was going to make a starter, but now I'm thinking about just using dry yeast. I have 2 packs of Notty and 2 packs of 05.

Given the choices, I would do 05. When you brewing? May have time to save the yeast.

 

[Vigo_Carpathian]

I'm brewing in a couple days. I was going to make a 2 Liter starter but since the cells are old, it might take a while longer if I went with liquid yeast.

 

[NWMushroom]

For dry yeast options, what do you think would be preferable? S-04 or US-05?

 

[revansCAAD8]

Brew-Day for this was last night! Can't say it was our smoothest brew day but think we made beer! LOL Mash-in temp was a bit high (152 dropping to 149) and undershot our original gravity (170). We also made a big 2-step starter and pitched some pretty yeast. Boy that fermenter is going CRAZY already! Krausen pushing up through the blow-off tube already. Sure hope it doesn't blow the top off!

Only deviations from the OP's recipe: Used 1oz (yes 1oz instead of .50 because they were fairly old hops that we already had) Warrior, instead of Magnum. Used 'De-bittered Black Malt' instead of Carafa III (should actually be the same/similar). Added 8oz Rice Hulls. Oh and used FermCapS, a pinch of Gypsum and Irish Moss.

Can't wait to taste it!
Robert

 

[skeezerpleezer]

for dry yeast options, what do you think would be preferable? S-04 or us-05?

s-04

 

[eric19312]

Tasted my gravity sample of this yesterday. Awesome beer!

I also made some modifications and don't have a bottle of the original to compare to but I'm quite pleased anyway.

I used
2-row 14#
Flaked rye 8oz
Rye malt 1.5#
Blackprinz 12oz
Cane sugar 1.5#

Did the 60 min 145 + 30 min 155 mash, hit temps no problems

Bittered with warrior for 28 IBU, 90 min boil
Equal parts citra and Amarillo at 20/0/DH with 15 min whirlpool at 176
Yeast was repitched US-05

1.080 OG
1.014 FG (guessing its done, will know in a couple days)
89 IB
8.8 ABV (will be about 9.2 after bottling...)

The sugar was the major deviation but I was trying to figure out how to get to the high ABV and still come in close to 1.015 FG. Might cut sugar back to 1# and try again if I can find some more Amarillo.

My SRM is only coming out at 26.4 and not having the original to compare to I didn't want to go too high on the black malts (even debittered varieties). Thinking maybe Wookey dust is maltoferm...

 

[SavoryChef]

Brewing this tomorrow! Should I include Rice Hulls? If so, how much (1 lbs?)

Thanks,
Robert

I didn't use rice hulls and collapsed my false bottom with 3# rye I believe. I batched sparged with a pump.

 

[NWMushroom]

s-04

I figured that too. Would you recommend adjusting the mash temperature due to the higher attenuation of the S-04?

 

[Francis]

Received a 22oz wookey and a 4 pack of Dales Deviant for my bday. Man, I have to brew this soon!!!

 

[skeezerpleezer]

I figured that too. Would you recommend adjusting the mash temperature due to the higher attenuation of the S-04?

You will probably be fine without adjusting the temp, getting down to the FG can be tricky without a lot of really healthy yeast and oxygen.

I brewed this up again on 2/7 and used Conan yeast (harvested from Heady Topper). It is bubbling away. My boil off wasn't as good as normal, ended about 5-7 points shy and at 6.3g. I got a new pot, so will need to adjust for that. I am considering adding a half pound of sugar to primary (boiled to a syrup) to help with the ABV and dry it out, however from what I have read the Conan is a beast.

 

[NWMushroom]

You will probably be fine without adjusting the temp, getting down to the FG can be tricky without a lot of really healthy yeast and oxygen.

I brewed this up again on 2/7 and used Conan yeast (harvested from Heady Topper). It is bubbling away. My boil off wasn't as good as normal, ended about 5-7 points shy and at 6.3g. I got a new pot, so will need to adjust for that. I am considering adding a half pound of sugar to primary (boiled to a syrup) to help with the ABV and dry it out, however from what I have read the Conan is a beast.

I was thinking of using 1 fresh packet of S-04 and 1 older (expires 4/13) packet, rehydrated, with some yeast fuel in the boil and 60 seconds of pure oxygen when pitching.

I have a batch ready for bottling in a couple of days in which I used a 2L starter of WLP002 - unfortunately I fear the starter got infected, hence my eagerness to get another batch going.

I think there's something going amiss with my liquid starter process so I'm moving to dry until I can pinpoint it.

 

[NWMushroom]

What level of CO2 volume are people going for on this?

 

[eric19312]

I realized nobody had addressed this last night when I had the beer in my bottling bucket...went with 2.4 volumes based on googling reviews of the finished beer which tended to say moderate carbonation but a few noted importance of carbonation bite in the profile.

 

[theveganbrewer]

I like this carbonated medium-medium high, it makes it really pop.

 

[eric19312]

I like this carbonated medium-medium high, it makes it really pop.

Thanks,

Any chance you can put a number on medium-high? Too late for me, but would be nice to have that as part of the recipe for future bottle conditioners...

 

[Tava]

I do 2.5 on my carbonation. It does make this beer pop

 

[ilikeguns]

i am still in awe at how a hack like me can make a beer this good...

 

[eric19312]

I do 2.5 on my carbonation. It does make this beer pop

Thanks again. So my 2.4 guess should be ok!

 

[MeanDeuce]

I used 2.4 and it came out fantastic.

 

[ipsiad]

i am still in awe at how a hack like me can make a beer this good...

Ha! I felt the exact same way when I brewed it. It's astonishingly good.

 

[samandbekah]

Has anyone attempted to harvest the yeast straight from the bottle?

My fiance got me a half a dozen 22 ounce bottles for v-day and I'm going to attempt to harvest and brew this this weekend...

 

[theveganbrewer]

Has anyone attempted to harvest the yeast straight from the bottle?

My fiance got me a half a dozen 22 ounce bottles for v-day and I'm going to attempt to harvest and brew this this weekend...

I think their house strain is WLP002, not sure it's worth all the work to harvest it.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

I think their house strain is WLP002, not sure it's worth all the work to harvest it.

That's why I was gonna say. Is Wookey even bottle conditioned? I can't remember.

 

[samandbekah]

Grab a bottle when you guys get the chance. It's good stuff...

It's unfiltered and have read a few threads how people have had success with harvest yeast from unfiltered beers.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

Grab a bottle when you guys get the chance. It's good stuff...

It's unfiltered and have read a few threads how people have had success with harvest yeast from unfiltered beers.

I realize it is good (this is my recipe...) Harvesting yeast is not something I do on readily availble yeast. It's not hard, but not really worth the time for something like WLP002 given the time, potential for infection, etc required to build up some already stressed (Wookey is over 8%) WLP002.

If I am harvesting, it is usually for sour bacteria and brett.

 

[Vigo_Carpathian]

White Labs website says 002 has only 63%-70% attenuation. Fermentation is complete and my S.G. is 1.025, still very high (65%attenuation). This is in range of what the capabilities of the yeast are listed as, but it is still very sweet. Has anyone else had problems with finishing too high with this beer/yeast? All I have on hand is a pack of Nottingham, and I think I might throw it in and see what happens. Not sure what else would help.

 

[ilikeguns]

my first batch finished at 18, my second at 20. I think I underpitched the second batch and mashed the first one too high. I also don't think I aerated enough if that helps.

Can you give some more details on your mash temps, starter etc?

 

[skeezerpleezer]

The key here is mash temp, yeast cell count and O2. I liked back and did hit 1.016 the first time without O2 or a huge starter (have bought a stir plate and oxygen since).

 

[Brutus Brewer]

I brought home a few bombers of Firestone Walker Wookey Jack from California recently, and man is it good. Unfortunately, FW isn't available in the Atlanta area, so I guess it is time to start working on a clone. What I do know:

From Firestone Walker's website:
Style: Unfiltered Black Rye IPA
ABV: 8.5%
Malts: Pale Malt, Malted Rye, Dash of Cara-Rye, Midnight Wheat from Briess, De-Bittered Black Malt (Weyermann - Germany/Patagonia malting - Chile), Dash of Wookey dust
Hops: German Magnum (bittering), Citra & Amarillo (flavor/aroma and double dry-hopped)

From craftbeer.com, the color is 45 SRM.

I read somewhere that someone degassed a bottle and the FG was 1.015. That would put the OG at 1.080 to get the 8.5%.

Some of the other FW clones, including the CYBI ones, use a 90 minute boil.

Firestone uses English yeast in a lot of their other beers, so I have chosen WLP002.

I may also try to send FW an email...does anyone know if they usually respond? Here is what I am thinking for right now, but it is just something I threw together quickly. Feedback would be appreciated. I probably won't be brewing this for at least a couple weeks, so have some time to make some modifications. :rockin:

**edit: I got some feedback from Matt from Firestone Walker and changed the recipe. He is a helluva guy, and they make great beer...go buy some

Brew Type: All Grain
Batch Size: 5.50 gal
Boil Volume: 7.46 gal
Boil Time: 90 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0 %

Batch Size: 5.50 gal
Boil Volume: 7.46 gal
Boil Time: 90 min
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75.0 %

Ingredients Amount Item Type % or IBU
13.50 lb Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM) Grain 81.1 %
1.66 lb Rye Malt (4.7 SRM) Grain 9.9 %
0.50 lb Cara-Rye (70.0 SRM) Grain 3.0 %
0.50 lb Carafa III (525.0 SRM) Grain 3.0 %
0.50 lb Wheat (Midnight) (550.0 SRM) Grain 3.0 %
0.50 oz Magnum [13.00%] (90 min) Hops 20.0 IBU
1.00 oz Citra [12.40%] (25 min) Hops 24.8 IBU
1.00 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50%] (25 min) Hops 17.0 IBU
1.75 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50%] (0 min) Hops -
1.75 oz Citra [12.40%] (0 min) Hops -
1.00 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50%] (Dry Hop#1 3 days) Hops -remove then add dryhop #2
1.00 oz Citra [12.40%] (Dry Hop#1 3 days) Hops -remove then add dryhop #2
1.00 oz Amarillo Gold [8.50%] (Dry Hop #2 4 days) Hops -
1.00 oz Citra [12.40%] (Dry Hop #2 4 days) Hops -

1 Pkgs English Ale (White Labs #WLP002) [Starter 2500 ml]

Mash @ 145-148 for 60 min
Increase to 155 for 10 min, then sparge

Estimated Original Gravity: 1.080 SG
Estimated Final Gravity: 1.015 SG
Estimated Color: 39.6 SRM
Bitterness: 61.8 IBU
Estimated Alcohol by Volume: 8.6 %


Ferment at ~62 for 10 days.

Couldn't you use either midnight wheat or carafa 3 instead of both?

 

[Vigo_Carpathian]

my first batch finished at 18, my second at 20. I think I underpitched the second batch and mashed the first one too high. I also don't think I aerated enough if that helps.

Can you give some more details on your mash temps, starter etc?

The key here is mash temp, yeast cell count and O2. I liked back and did hit 1.016 the first time without O2 or a huge starter (have bought a stir plate and oxygen since).

I mashed at 148 for 60 mins and brought it to 155F for 10mins. I made a 2.5L starter and hit the wort with pure O2 for 60 seconds and then pitched at 62F. My OG was 1.076. After fermentation started, I added 5g of Fermaid K nutrient. I feel like I did everything right but still low attenuation. S.G. 1.025