Finally, First* Brew Day Tomorrow

[ultra_cas]

I'll be watching this thread, as I'm really curious how it turns out. Either way I think you'll have a memorable brew for your birthday! Hoping it turns out the way you hope.

 

[grampamark]

Paging Fred the Cat. Fred the Cat, pick up a white phone...

 

[jerbrew]

I was thinking the same thing. Maybe I can open a portal, link, to that newest thread here and we'll cause an interwebs equivalent to crossing the streams like in Ghost Busters.

 

[BarleyWhines]

Without knowing where you got lost, it's for some reason hard to answer.

Was it:
What I meant by Bigfoot it? It is open fermented and I have an appropriate vessel, space, and O2 tank. Where I'll presumably pitching the next starter fermenter

Where I went from there?
Brewing is an art of math, or more specifically science. So is cooking, and baking bread in more simple senses. So is propagating healthy yeast or any bacteria, agar plates are a great way to do so. Mini shallow/more promotion of growth ferm vessels by shape. I quickly learned not necessary with Sierra Nevada's yeast-
Albeit, from the 11/17 batch and in the fridge since the day it was delivered to my LBS.

Very aggressively bubbling away.

How I expect it to taste? Organic. after several years of frequently searching any updates on clones and disappointment disappointing results. ichly and cloying spicy, sticky lupulin. Its hissing and seepage tastelike amarillo/FF and biting into a Sticky Viscous Cocky Arrogance. Realization that I should pay more attention to impersonality, and probably have emailed them myselves long ago. That you're getting what you pay for in an $8 growler fill at the source

 

[Jtk78]

Thread title: Finally, First* Brew Day Tomorrow

First post

*A Mr. Beer experience a decade ago excluded. Finally the means to

Last post

How I expect it to taste? Organic. after several years of frequently searching any updates on clones and disappointment disappointing results. ichly and cloying spicy, sticky lupulin. Its hissing and seepage tastelike amarillo/FF and biting into a Sticky Viscous Cocky Arrogance. Realization that I should pay more attention to impersonality, and probably have emailed them myselves long ago. That you're getting what you pay for in an $8 growler fill at the source

So you've been searching for clones for years and disappointed with the results. That implies you've brewed multiple times before. Then the "What the f%#& did he just say" moment comes next. I don't know what the last half of that paragraph means.

I think the confusion comes from the fact that this is your first batch of homebrew (maybe), it's pretty clear you did pick a bunch of grain based on vague recipe guidance, your planning to mash ridiculously low, adding a homebrewers metric ton of sugar to it, and trying to rush it all at the same time.

You ask for feedback and there is most likely a century worth of combined homebrewing experience in the thread, and no matter what any of them say you shrugg thier suggestions off, give a long winded, multi-tangent, sometimes incomprehensible response to explain what you're doing and say "Anymore feedback"

Best of luck with it. Hope you have a great birthday no matter the results of this beer.

 

[AMessenger]

Did you end up mashing in the low 140s? What OG did you end up with? Did you end up with the OG you had predicted?

 

[whovous]

Without knowing where you got lost, it's for some reason hard to answer.

Was it:

[snip]

How I expect it to taste? Organic. after several years of frequently searching any updates on clones and disappointment disappointing results. ichly and cloying spicy, sticky lupulin. Its hissing and seepage tastelike amarillo/FF and biting into a Sticky Viscous Cocky Arrogance. Realization that I should pay more attention to impersonality, and probably have emailed them myselves long ago. That you're getting what you pay for in an $8 growler fill at the source

I've read this last paragraph a dozen times, and I still do not understand a single word.

 

[PADave]

Without knowing where you got lost, it's for some reason hard to answer.

Sentences with proper punctuation and spelling go a long way in making something understandable. But if you want specifics, post #5 of this thread.

 

[beerfactory]

To me that looks like an unnecessarily complex recipe and maybe difficult as a first. It also looks like a poor choice of mash temp. Read this article on "brewer's window". It shows your mash temp to be clear outside the "brewers window".

https://missionarybrewer.wordpress....ers-window-what-temperature-should-i-mash-at/

I've bottled clear beer at day 10. I do it because I choose the fermentation schedule to be not optimum but a close approximation and I could perhaps do it sooner if I cold crashed the beer to drop yeast out faster. Your beer may or may not be ready to keg at day 9, especially with your lack of experience.

great article, thanks for posting

 

[jlinz]

Head scratch, face palm.

 

[BarleyWhines]

I know, right? People think that starches ONLY become sugars within a 60min window at certain temps regardless of time;/ And never have to post mobile to boot.


I overshot my efficiency after topping off. I assume a sweet SNBC hop bullet on my birthday, and a DoublaBastard/Deviil Dancer if it lasts a week. Added priming dark Belgian sugar with another SNBC propagate +/ Same yeast to kept good color. Hissing away again since. Judging by settled wort a little too light of a purple. Little Dirty's gravity right as expected. I'll probably throw columbus in the the former's. Maybe magnum or similar. In the latter or both.

Did I say I'd tried those clones? I thought I'd said that I was disappointed with the lack of experimentation with red's lengthy malt bill; ive gotta stock the fridge with the fine Schlafly's cheap export IPA, more HBullet, hopefully the other new SNBC year-round anyways. Head over the river and distill gin. Hopefully dont accidentally add msg! and cheaper /more enjoyable wine. Whisky, has anyone filled up mini 5L barrels with bottled whisky shortly for quick BBA Barrel flavor? I'd guess not, given I posted this in the beginner's forum.


Whomever this applies to, you can figure out the metaphors. I will be clear about one- Given the percentage of replies, and the inability to say "sorry, cannot help you, I have never brewed anything like this whatsoever", I should have emailed Founders about Reds myself years ago,which was always, when I found out about Red's cost, was when I'd get back into ibreeing and not just helping, Buying bulk of those grains and using them /and adjusting recipes to recreate my other favorites. Surely it wouldve been more helpful than the time wasted on this posy. Thank God the brother in law will by home and able to pick up the perfected recipe soon! As well as Hopslam's first /freshest kegging.

 

[PADave]

Cool, sounds like you got everything figured out, at least in your mind. Glad it's going well.

 

[SEndorf]

Well.... If nothing else, at least this is wildly entertaining....

 

[BarleyWhines]

That was the purpose of this brew day, but I had no idea it would be so systematically hilarious seeing replies. Though my deliberately stating I was going to brew this/way I'd hope suggested so to everyone, it doesn't have seemed to. So, I feel the need to say that the majority of replies would have mildly offended me, had I cared. Based on my forum, that is a good way to drive away new members, posting as such in the beginner's (!) forum. Yooper replied perfectly, at least, and confirmed what I suspected was the most possible outcome.

Thanks for the well-wishes PADave. Gonna start a much simpler dry HHRed, ie the simple clones of Red's online, lest Founders reply with a little more detail (which will be shared if granted permission) and probably Bigfoot and Arrogant Bastard next week. Obviously updating this thread when racked into the keg. I don't expect to have reason to otherwise.

 

[BarleyWhines]

At near 6 days, very dry on par with the Surly Wet I'm drinking now with similar flavor, granted I was drinking a Doom prior. I should probably have taken a hydrometer reading.. Sticky in a resiny way. Will tomorrow, after one last open crashing into another bucket to get a big final krausen and oxygenation before kegging Sunday. Very happy with the aggression of SN's yeast and its dominance in aroma and flavor complimenting the FFlight aroma/flavor. DME was apparently unnecessary, as I've tested a few Celebration and Harvest dregs since: sanitized opening and careful decanting will turn however much you leave in the bottle into a cloudy clone in the fridge within 24hrs. Should finish at ~13% by estimation, if it lasts long enough to finish up by keg conditioning. Little Dirty finished primary and tastes just as I hoped. Will be crashing that one before kegging if necessary.

 

[SEndorf]

Hopefully not to offend you, but I'm slowly grasping your code.
The Eagle has Landed...... The Fat man walks alone.......

 

[PADave]

You got to give us some numbers. What was your actual OG? Oxygenation before kegging, that's a new one.

 

[whovous]

You got to give us some numbers. What was your actual OG? Oxygenation before kegging, that's a new one.

I fear the troll is strong in this one.

 

[jerbrew]

Shhhhh... they get mad when you call them that.

I fear the troll is strong in this one.

 

[yourlastchance89]

Subd

 

[BarleyWhines]

I accidentally posted the OG in a previous reply, 1.113. Still thick constant krausening so no airlock besides heavy agitation and to taste the tangy krausen, compared to friends' strongs. Very much like a ryewine, FFlight kind of Arrogant (my personal favorite commercial first wort hopped beer), more aggressive Devil Dancer.

My gut says near estimated final gravity, but it could be the high acidity (a la Devil Dancer) from the hops. I'll take a hydrometer reading tonight, I hope. If I have the time.

Two posts I forgot to address-
I shrugged off a century's worth of advice I didn't ask for.. I was asking if anyone had experimented with similar bills or mash temps/duration.


Oxygenating before kegging is new? What gas do you purge the air in your fermenter with, and were you feeding your yeast to get them to ferment? I have to ask how you have engineered such yeasts, Congrats!
How long is Bigfoot in primary? With a follow up final question, how can such a young barleywine carry so much oxidation/aged strong flavors?

I thought there would be more DFH ('s philosophy) advocates.

 

[whovous]

OK, I'll bite.
1 No, I never experimented with similar mash bills or durations. Neither do I intend to start now.
2 Yes, oxygenating before kegging is new to me. I seek to purge oxygen from my keg.

I sincerely doubt you can or will even try to offer any independently verifiable sources to support your ideas. I begin to doubt you are brewing anything at all.

 

[BarleyWhines]

The oxygenation would be pouring it and (most of) its yeast (to see ifnot spent) into the keg for a big final rousing ... I'm not worried about the Amarillo/FFlight aroma fading. More so the acridity of ryewines oxidizing into more spice. It is going to last a couple weeks if near target FG, I can't drink punishment all day.


Shaking your carboy is to oxygenate it. More is less stress on the yeast, a much quicker fermentation with higher amounts with less stress on its cells. Bigfoot is openly fermented for 6 days in primary. Yeast learn and adjust to environment. Hence, why some brewers that do like a "proprietary" yeast flavor, stop using the harvested yeast after X number of cycles. Thereafter adding minimal harvested younger yeast to the parent strain. Learn a lot more by plain researching "open fermentation". How safe it is in almost all primary ferm (people doing " secondary" /finishing in the same vessel might not want to be open for a month). Of course,barring sanitation. the obvious, extreme care when working with strong yeasts like Brett. You probably w

IMG_20180106_005530

• BarleyWhines
• Jan 6, 2018

Doubt

ant them to ferment in separate rooms.

Like " wild" yeasts, open fermentation is going to, as said: Be stronger, adapt to their environment, and "neutral," regarding aroma , will have a lot stronger yeast than the same beer brewed (mostly) closed; carboys and buckets are never purged of O2. Full cask/keg naturally conditioned , yes, benefit still- to keep the same beer- purged of O2, via a CO2 tank and regulator.

"Doubt you're brewing anything"
Honestly: seriously?

IMG_20180106_005530

• BarleyWhines
• Jan 6, 2018

Doubt

 

[AMessenger]

 

[jerbrew]

To answer your question:

Oxygen is important in solution at the beginning of fermentation to facilitate yeast reproduction. It is essential for the production of cell walls for new cells. After the growth/lag phase of fermentation it is most often avoided at all costs, to avoid premature aging of beer, assuming you had a healthy fermentation that finished as expected. I think this is where most brewers minds travel, no need to make it sound like the contrary should be painfully obvious. Granted, I respect the idea of trying to felicitate aged flavors quickly, if that is your intention. Although, you made it sound obvious to purge air form a keg with O2, that is most definitely a new one for me and many others I'm sure. I did read that great article, in I think BYO or Craft beer and brewing, with that Italian brewer who used techniques from sherry production to pre-oxidize his "barley wine". I thought it was pretty clever because he put a lot of thought and trials into perfecting what he wanted to make. However, it is hard to follow what you are even trying to tell us. Now, you're probably going to get a little bent out of shape and say something about me not being creative or locked in my ways, but that's not true. You're talking about open fermentation and then post a picture of a bucket with an airlock on it. Are you using an open fermenter or not? I love the idea of open fermentation in the right context. Where have you been told that Big Foot is open fermented for 6 days? I have been to Sierra Nevada many times and toured their facilitate at least a half dozen times when I lived there. Never saw or heard mention of open fermentation and they are very forthright and eager to share their techniques and brewing styles.

In the first post you said all feedback welcome yet you have repeatedly discounted and bashed on advice/feedback saying its not what you want. What do you want? An atta-boy? A participation trophy? So, here's some more advice you don't want but will help us all help you and maybe we can get something from your posts as well.

Be a little less combative and state your methods and reason for them clearly in the beginning, not as a response to another users post that makes sense. It's hard to understand why you are doing anything you're doing when you ramble about drinking Celebration or Bigfoot or using those useless headline news like words "spicy" and "resinous" about a hydro sample from a fermenting beer. You're not going to convince anyone but yourself that you taste those flavors. What you perceive doesn't matter to anyone if we can't follow your method. Its about learning for everyone not boasting about how great you think you are. So please, walk us through what your techniques are and what your end state is. Is it a barley wine like Big Foot that's ready to drink in less then 2 weeks? Is it a big double IPA like Hopslam? Is it a Piney winter time IPA like Celebration? Again, it has been really difficult to figure out what you are even trying to accomplish.

 

[BarleyWhines]

I very much appreciate the thought put into your post. Yes I should've clarified in my OP that I welcomed all feedback, but would be brewing as such.

The spiciness wasn't picked out by me, actually- but the best friend who has never tried a rye wine, or ~30% rye ale or roggenbier . Nor drinks as much rye whisky as I do. That, a rich bodied ryewine , was what I was shooting for. rich dry accenuation of rye via caramalts, hence the long, but low mash temps. Not a jacked up hop head red. As well as hoping for an Arrogant aggression of Amarillo/FFlight while it finishes in the keg. , to accentuate those hops while still tasting like a young, unoxidized ryewine. To be able to bottle devil dancer-ish clones in a few more weeks if needed.

There is a few year old video of Bigfoots short, open fermentation. From a microbiologists view, while the yeast will as said produce more esters, it is safe with a layer of Krausen. Fodders just speed things up, in general, but cylindrical vessels agitated are nearly the fastest. So, a bucket with airlock removed is a lot safer than an open , agitated bucket. Sadly it seems very few have experimented with open carboys.

 

[user 125772]

I need to try a recipe with 3 pounds of carapils and see what it's like too.

 

[SEndorf]

I’m afraid you would end up with an arrogant aggression of head retention......

 

[ancientmariner52]

Is this?....Is this those Korean spammers again? Just in sorta English instead of Squiggle?

 

[jerbrew]

Alright, I spoke too soon. It was pretty easy to find evidence of their open fermentation of Bigfoot, granted I found the same things from 2014 but have no reason to think they changed anything. I appreciate your response and clarifying your intent. From what I have read and understand, the benefit of an open fermentation is to relieve pressure on the fermenter, allowing the yeast to work faster and produce esters as a byproduct - this is a pretty big departure when you think about most large scale brewing being done with a spunding valve for ease and speed of packaging.

So, speaking from the mind of an engineer, anyone who has ever used a blow off tube is effectively open fermenting during active feremntation or, any way of maintaining a zero/near zero pressure differential - sometimes a simple airlock is adequate sometimes not. And, anyone who uses glass carboys better use a blow off tube during active fermentation of a high gravity beer or when fermenting with voracious yeast (hefeweizen, saison, chico, san diego super all come to mind from experience), or boom you got a bomb (also experience). I guess what I am saying is that without having to state any intent many if not all brewers have by nature open fermented their beers. In fact, because of the relatively small scale on which we brew, pressurized fermentation is the non-standard way of doing things. It look likes the not so sad thing is that many of us have utilized open fermentation without the label and pulling the airlock off is something most would have done so their bucket didn't blow up during active fermentation of such a high gravity beer.