Fermentation Time

[stone1ipa]

Fellow Brewers,

Most of the recipes I see for Ale's have fermentation time between 21-30 days. My OG was 1.054 but in 8 days it had already reached my target finish of 1.010. Does anyone have thoughts on the benefits of leaving it in the fermenter for additional time or would you recommend racking it whenever you hit your final gravity?

 

[Andrew Hodgson]

Once the hydro reading in unchanged for 3-5 days (people seem to differ on how long they are comfortable with the same reading before it is "done") fermentation has ended. Many people do leave the beer in the fermenter for longer to let the yeast cleanup but IMO 21-30 days is just a ballpark range, and one that is much longer than I think most primary for. I haven't had a beer that needed longer than 14 days yet and a couple were likely done well before that mark.

 

[homebrewer_99]

Once it hits the anticipated FG let it sit for 3 more days so the yeast can clean up after itself. Just make sure you take another reading. This is called the "Diacetyl Rest" stage.

Sometimes it only takes 4 - 10 days, but you don't want to rush a natural process (fermentation).

The longer range of days depends on the type of brew it is.

 

[jack13]

Fellow Brewers,

Most of the recipes I see for Ale's have fermentation time between 21-30 days. My OG was 1.054 but in 8 days it had already reached my target finish of 1.010. Does anyone have thoughts on the benefits of leaving it in the fermenter for additional time or would you recommend racking it whenever you hit your final gravity?

There is no definitive answer to this. But when making this decision, here are a few things I take into account:

- Does the beer taste good/"right" when I sample it right after it hits FG? If so, rack, if not, wait.
- Is this a beer that is generally thought to benefit from a bit more time in the fermenter (stout, high ABV, etc.)? (but ignore if your experience contradicts conventional wisdom)
- Is oxygenation an issue? For example, was there a bit more head space than I wanted? If so, that could make me a bit anxious to get into the keg/bottle. Or maybe if I took a number of readings, each time letting some O2 in there, and want to get it into a keg w/CO2.
- Is it hoppy? Most people think (me included) that hop flavor and aroma dissipate with time.

I'm sure there are other factors I'm not thinking of off the top of my head. And the first is probably the most important: How's it taste and smell?

Also a note about recipes. People include in the recipe details of what THEY do (in your case, leave in fermenter 21 to 30 days). It could very well be that you do something different which will work just as well or better. I think of those kind of details as descriptive of what the person did, not prescriptive of what I should do.

 

[stone1ipa]

There is no definitive answer to this. But when making this decision, here are a few things I take into account:

- Does the beer taste good/"right" when I sample it right after it hits FG? If so, rack, if not, wait.
- Is this a beer that is generally thought to benefit from a bit more time in the fermenter (stout, high ABV, etc.)? (but ignore if your experience contradicts conventional wisdom)
- Is oxygenation an issue? For example, was there a bit more head space than I wanted? If so, that could make me a bit anxious to get into the keg/bottle. Or maybe if I took a number of readings, each time letting some O2 in there, and want to get it into a keg w/CO2.
- Is it hoppy? Most people think (me included) that hop flavor and aroma dissipate with time.

I'm sure there are other factors I'm not thinking of off the top of my head. And the first is probably the most important: How's it taste and smell?

Also a note about recipes. People include in the recipe details of what THEY do (in your case, leave in fermenter 21 to 30 days). It could very well be that you do something different which will work just as well or better. I think of those kind of details as descriptive of what the person did, not prescriptive of what I should do.

Thanks for the thoughtful replies Jack and 99. I should have added a few more details to ponder. First..This is a Blonde Ale. Second...I was away for a few days on vacation so I can't say how many days it had been resting after hitting final gravity. However, I did taste it and the flavor profile seemed to be dead on. I ended up racking it so I guess my next question is will the flavor profile change if the dyacetl rest period wasn't long enough?

 

[jack13]

Thanks for the thoughtful replies Jack and 99. I should have added a few more details to ponder. First..This is a Blonde Ale. Second...I was away for a few days on vacation so I can't say how many days it had been resting after hitting final gravity. However, I did taste it and the flavor profile seemed to be dead on. I ended up racking it so I guess my next question is will the flavor profile change if the dyacetl rest period wasn't long enough?

If it's an ale (assuming you used an ale yeast at ale fermentation temps), you don't need a d-rest.

 

[stone1ipa]

Once the hydro reading in unchanged for 3-5 days (people seem to differ on how long they are comfortable with the same reading before it is "done") fermentation has ended. Many people do leave the beer in the fermenter for longer to let the yeast cleanup but IMO 21-30 days is just a ballpark range, and one that is much longer than I think most primary for. I haven't had a beer that needed longer than 14 days yet and a couple were likely done well before that mark.

Appreciate your input Andrew. I use WLP001 on most my ales and have found it to be a fairly aggressive yeast. So I haven't found the need to move to secondary and agree that my fermentation usually finished well ahead of 14 days.

 

[El Nino]

I've used mostly US-05, but every time the fermentation was done by 10 days

 

[ncbrewer]

If bottling, making sure the gravity is stable is really important because of possible bottle bombs.

 

[JordanKnudson]

A diacetyl rest is really just an "as needed" step. Some yeasts produce more diacetyl than others during fermentation (think Ringwood, Irish Ale yeast, some lager strains, etc) and may require an extra day or two at the tail end of fermentation. At ale temps, this is basically a non-issue with all but the most finicky of yeasts (see Ringwood), provided that you made sure that you had a healthy pitch of adequate yeast and ran a clean fermentation. Lager fermentations that produce diacetyl often need to be allowed to warm up a few degrees for the yeast to re-consume it.

Okay, so if I understood correctly, you fermented with WLP001 in its normal temperature range. In that case, I'd be willing to guess that no diacetyl rest is needed (001 isn't a big diacetyl producer anyway) and yes, your fermentation is in fact complete -- although it never hurts to confirm this with the whole 3-days-apart gravity readings thing.

I see recipes with the 21-30 day estimate all the time, and I actually think it's just a default setting in whatever software is being used. Or like, maybe it's some outdated "standard" that is still in use just because that's what kits and brewers from the dark ages of homebrewing adopted in an attempt to make the process foolproof. However, I don't know any brewer who actually monitors his/her fermentations who routinely needs that long for it to finish (quite frankly, if you follow that time frame, more often than not your fermentation has been done for two weeks and you just have finished beer sitting there). Assuming you follow best practices regarding yeast health, pitch rate, temps, etc., even big beers are usually done well within that window.

tl;dr - you're good.

 

[stone1ipa]

If bottling, making sure the gravity is stable is really important because of possible bottle bombs.

Thanks.....straight to Keg.

 

[kl Roosevelt brewer]

Okay guys I've been reading in on your thread because I have a few questions myself along these lines. The kit which is a Dead Ringer IPA from Northern Brewer says 1 to 2 weeks in the fermenter and two to four weeks in the secondary. It's day 10 and my fermentation has stopped. It's in a bucket so I really can't see and I don't dare take the lid off to take a gravity reading. I am not going to use a secondary and just leave it in the bucket and dry hop it by removing the airlock and dropping the pellets down through the little hole. So freaked out about oxygenation. So my question is I am at day 10 and there is no more any activity in the airlock. Is it time to dry hop at this point like today? And then once I add the Hops how long do I wait? It says to add the Hops 1 to 2 weeks before your bottle not very definitive. I use the US 05 yeast and kept it out of stable 66°. This is just a guess for me but do I add the dry hops and then keg 10 days later?

 

[kl Roosevelt brewer]

I kept it at a stable 66 degrees sorry for the typo

 

[wepeeler]

Okay guys I've been reading in on your thread because I have a few questions myself along these lines. The kit which is a Dead Ringer IPA from Northern Brewer says 1 to 2 weeks in the fermenter and two to four weeks in the secondary. It's day 10 and my fermentation has stopped. It's in a bucket so I really can't see and I don't dare take the lid off to take a gravity reading. I am not going to use a secondary and just leave it in the bucket and dry hop it by removing the airlock and dropping the pellets down through the little hole. So freaked out about oxygenation. So my question is I am at day 10 and there is no more any activity in the airlock. Is it time to dry hop at this point like today? And then once I add the Hops how long do I wait? It says to add the Hops 1 to 2 weeks before your bottle not very definitive. I use the US 05 yeast and kept it out of stable 66°. This is just a guess for me but do I add the dry hops and then keg 10 days later?

I'd add the dry hops according to the recipe schedule. Honestly, I've made nothing but NEIPAs, which are supposedly extra prone to oxidation, and I've never had an issue with cracking the top of my bucket and tossing in the dry hops. Heck, I even rack with an open bucket with an auto siphon, and most people here swear by closed transfers! There is enough of a CO2 blanket produced during primary fermentation, that you should be fine. If you feel like dropping them through the airlock hole, by all means, go ahead, but it's gonna take forever. Also, just because there is no airlock activity doesn't mean fermentation is complete. Always trust stable gravity readings, not airlock bubbles. Good luck!

 

[kl Roosevelt brewer]

Thank you for the input

 

[Wort_Hog]

Gravity readings and being familiar with the yeast one is using is key. I routinely go from grain to glass (I'm kegging I should add) in two weeks, and right now I'm in the middle of an ISA that I'm hoping to have ready in ten days from my brew day. I pitched a large, active starter and hit my final gravity after 44 hours (1.043 to 1.008). I'm currently cold crashing it in preparation for fining before kegging. If I get a beer to tap that I think tastes a little "green," I just give it a little time in the keezer.

 

[kl Roosevelt brewer]

I do have a little chest freezer with an inkbird temperature controller. Can you talk to me a little bit about cold crashing this is my first batch. What temperature and for how long? I'm only using my fermenter bucket and not using a secondary

 

[Wort_Hog]

When my fermentation is complete, I crash my primary (I don't "secondary") to 38 degrees (that's as cold as I can get my jacketed fermenter) and add gelatin finings. For me cold crashing is just a way of clearing my final product - and gelatin is cheap and works like a charm! I'll leave it for a couple days, and then I rack to my kegs.

 

[JordanKnudson]

I do have a little chest freezer with an inkbird temperature controller. Can you talk to me a little bit about cold crashing this is my first batch. What temperature and for how long? I'm only using my fermenter bucket and not using a secondary

I am into your spirit of "adventurousness meets caution" as far as how you are treating your beer (you know enough to be cognisant of oxidation when adding dry hops, yet you hear about cold crashing and immediately say, "go on"). It's awesome.

If I can humbly make a suggestion, I'd forget about cold crashing if this is your first batch. There's no reason to think that you would mess anything up, as it's a fairly easy step, but it *is* an extra step (kind of 2 extra steps if you think cold crash and gelatin). The first time around, I think that there is a lot of value in going through the basic steps only and just getting that first successful beer into your glass. The bells-and-whistles stuff like crashing, fining, and other such steps can make a difference, but you'd mostly just be gilding the lily on a first batch. It probably won't hurt to do it, but you also won't know if it actually made a difference, since you don't yet know what you can get from the fundamental steps alone.

Besides, cold crashing and fining are for clarification, and Dead Ringer is supposed to be a clone of Bell's Two Hearted, which sure wasn't crystal clear the last time I had it!

 

[kl Roosevelt brewer]

Thank you sir

 

[specharka]

I'd add the dry hops according to the recipe schedule. Honestly, I've made nothing but NEIPAs, which are supposedly extra prone to oxidation, and I've never had an issue with cracking the top of my bucket and tossing in the dry hops. Heck, I even rack with an open bucket with an auto siphon, and most people here swear by closed transfers! There is enough of a CO2 blanket produced during primary fermentation, that you should be fine. If you feel like dropping them through the airlock hole, by all means, go ahead, but it's gonna take forever. Also, just because there is no airlock activity doesn't mean fermentation is complete. Always trust stable gravity readings, not airlock bubbles. Good luck!

Just because you can’t discern the effects of oxidation doesn’t mean it’s not a factor. Buckets are terrible for allowing oxygen ingress, either by leaking gaskets or permeability, and auto siphons are notoriously leaky (ever wonder where the bubbles in your line came from). The “CO2 blanket” idea is a total myth — inert gases offer no protection when the vessel is open to ambient air.

I would imagine if you upgraded your process to incorporate a closed transfer you would notice a dramatic difference in the finished quality and shelf stability of your beer. I understand that it’s outside the means of many homebrewers, but it’s definitely achievable with a few tweaks — ferment in carboys, use a stainless racking cane w/ silicone bung, and rack to a purged keg or purged bottles directly from your FV.

 

[BarleyStanding]

As a general rule (no secondary and moderate ABVs), I usually let the yeast clean up 5-7 days after hitting FG, then a day or two crash, and into the keg. Total fermentation time to keg is usually around 15-20 days. Never had an oxygen issue, but the beer goes pretty fast once it's kegged (funny how word spreads when you have a few new brews on tap)

 

[wepeeler]

Just because you can’t discern the effects of oxidation doesn’t mean it’s not a factor. Buckets are terrible for allowing oxygen ingress, either by leaking gaskets or permeability, and auto siphons are notoriously leaky (ever wonder where the bubbles in your line came from). The “CO2 blanket” idea is a total myth — inert gases offer no protection when the vessel is open to ambient air.

I would imagine if you upgraded your process to incorporate a closed transfer you would notice a dramatic difference in the finished quality and shelf stability of your beer. I understand that it’s outside the means of many homebrewers, but it’s definitely achievable with a few tweaks — ferment in carboys, use a stainless racking cane w/ silicone bung, and rack to a purged keg or purged bottles directly from your FV.

I never said it wasn't a factor, I was simply stating that, for me, it hasn't been an issue. In the NEIPA thread there are a ton of people posting how dark their beer was getting, even after just a few days. I'm guessing it's something with their technique. I have a few home brew friends who are a lot less careful than I am with technique, and they too, haven't had oxidation issues. If you dry hop while fermentation is still occurring, the O2 that you introduce will be pushed out through the airlock anyway.

 

[kl Roosevelt brewer]

I have to agree with that last statement because as soon as I added the dry Hops and closed the lid on the bucket my airlock went crazy

 

[aprichman]

With the proper amount of healthy yeast pitched into well made, oxygenated wort most ales shouldn't take any longer than 7 days to finish as long as it isn't a bigger style (DIPA, RIS, etc.). Some Belgian yeasts also require longer fermentation times. You may also need additional time for crashing and clarification depending on the yeast.

 

[Kealia]

No matter which forum I'm on, the question of "how long do I..." and the associated answers always reminds me of this scene from Swingers:

 

[stone1ipa]

No matter which forum I'm on, the question of "how long do I..." and the associated answers always reminds me of this scene from Swingers:

Kealia.......You're money and you don't even know it.....

 

[Kealia]

Kealia.......You're money and you don't even know it.....

Haha, well played, sir. And greetings from NorCal!