extract of Jamil's Amber-Red (NOT Red Rocket clone)

[laserghost]

Hello,

I am about to brew my first batch and want to make an extract/specialty grain version of Jamil's Amber-Red, http://beerdujour.com/Recipes/Jamil/JamilsAmber-RedAle.htm

This is not to be confused with the Red Rocket Clone that seems to be quite popular, and comes with both extract and all grain recipes from his site. The above Amber-Red only provides an all-grain recipe which I entered into BeerSmith and converted for extract and scaled from 6–5 gallons. See the link above to view the original recipe.

What I am wondering is if I should use the Beersmith conversion exactly as is, or if I should use a slightly simplified rendition of it.

The beersmith conversion gave me this:

6 lbs 13.9 oz Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract
9.3 oz Amber Liquid Extract (12.5 SRM) Extract
5.7 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 30L (30.0 SRM) Grain
11.6 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain
5.8 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain
1.4 oz Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain
0.54 oz Magnum [15.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Cascade [5.40 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Centennial [9.40 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Cascade [5.40 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Centennial [9.40 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 min Hop
1 pkg California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) [35.49ml] Yeast

I am wondering if I really need to use both Crystal 30 and 40, and if I really need to use Pale and Amber LME. I copy/pasted the recipe, deleted the Amber LME and the Crystal 30, and then tweaked the extract and crystal until the OG, Color, and Alcohol matched the original. So could I do this instead?

7 lbs 8.0 oz Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract
1 lbs Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain
6.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain
1.4 oz Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain
0.54 oz Magnum [15.00 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Cascade [5.40 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Centennial [9.40 %] - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Cascade [5.40 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Centennial [9.40 %] - Aroma Steep 0.0 min Hop
1.0 pkg California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) [35.49ml] Yeast

The gravity, bitterness, color, and alcohol come out to the same numbers between the two recipes. Should this result in closely similar beers? What would I stand to lose by dropping the Amber LME and the Crystal 30?

Greatly appreciate any thoughts or suggestions with this recipe. Thanks!!

 

[Yooper]

Jamil himself converted that recipe to extract in Brewing Classic Styles. The OG is different, but the grains are the same except for the base malt, which is less.

The OG in the book is 1.067. He calls the recipe "West Coast Blaster" in the book.

This is for 6 gallons.

8.75 pounds pale LME
.7 pound Munich LME (I'd just use a pound of Munich malt in the recipe, with the rest of the grains and not use the Munich LME)
1 pound crystal 40L
.5 pound crystal 120L
.5 pound victory
3 ounces pale chocolate malt (or use 1.5 ounces of chocolate malt)

He used horizon for bittering in this version, but it doesn't matter. You could use magnum or centenial.
_____________________________________________________

I don't like using straight Beersmith's conversion, unless you have it set up right. It looks like something is set to give you amber extract, which is wrong. Crystal 30? Where did THAT come from? It's not even in the recipe!

The hops amounts shouldn't change. You'd still hop the same way. If you're doing a partial boil, add at least half of the extract at the end of the boil.

 

[laserghost]

Thanks for the reply. I could be wrong, but I think we may be talking about different beers! Isn't the West Coast Blaster the Red Rocket Clone? The one I'm about to do has really similar ingredients, but fits more in the style of a Red then the West Coast Blaster.

Also, if I were to use Munich and Victory malt, then I would need to do Extract/Partial Mash rather than Extract/Steep, right?

 

[TimTrone]

Thanks for the reply. I could be wrong, but I think we may be talking about different beers! Isn't the West Coast Blaster the Red Rocket Clone? The one I'm about to do has really similar ingredients, but fits more in the style of a Red then the West Coast Blaster.

Also, if I were to use Munich and Victory malt, then I would need to do Extract/Partial Mash rather than Extract/Steep, right?

Ah ok, she thought you wanted his real hoppy red ale. The specialty grains in the brew you're looking for are:
1lb C40
1/2lb C120
3oz pale chocolate
The victory malt is in the blaster, but not his normal red. If you can find it use the Munich LME. Make things as easy for yourself as you can if it's your first beer. Good luck!

 

[jwalker1140]

Brewing Classic Styles includes two American Amber Ale recipes: West Coast Blaster (aka Red Rocket Clone) and one that's more to style, which is similar to, but not exactly like, the recipe you posted above. I actually have the non-West Coast version conditioning right now (a 5.25 gal partial mash batch that used ~6.75 lbs grain and 2.75 lbs LME).

And yes, you would need to mash the Munich and Victory. While I do use Beersmith to tweak the amt of base malt and LME until I reach the OG number in the recipe, I wouldn't further tweak ingredients to hit an SRM number. This could end up changing the flavor away from the original, and I think the flavor is more important than color. Just my opinion. Good luck with your brew!

 

[jwalker1140]

The victory malt is in the blaster, but not his normal red. If you can find it use the Munich LME. Make things as easy for yourself as you can if it's your first beer. Good luck!

I guess it depends on which version of his normal red you're looking at. I'm looking at the recipe in Brewing Classic Styles and it calls for 0.5 lbs of victory (but no pale chocolate).

 

[TimTrone]

I guess it depends on which version of his normal red you're looking at. I'm looking at the recipe in Brewing Classic Styles and it calls for 0.5 lbs of victory (but no pale chocolate).

You're right. I knew one of the 2 grains wasn't in it, but I got the wrong one.

 

[laserghost]

Hey everyone, thanks for the feedback. FYI, this is the recipe I am trying to replicate in extract: http://beerdujour.com/Recipes/Jamil/JamilsAmber-RedAle.htm

It has Victory, Munich, and a light Chocolate (says to use half regular Chocolate if you can't find it).

Should I just use Pale LME and steep Crystal 40, Crystal 120, and Chocolate?

 

[TimTrone]

Yes, just steep those specialty grains. Can you get Munich LME? The Munich does add a nice malty quality.

 

[laserghost]

My LHBS has Munich extract, I think it's DME.

I'm doing a full boil 5 gal batch. After scaling the original all grain recipe from 6 to 5 gal (just multiply everything by 5/6 ???) should I then just multiply the pounds of the grains that have to be mashed by 3/4 and sub in extract? For the weight of the Victory malt, should I add that to the Pale extract or the Munich extract?

I imagine I could do either and end up with a tasty brew, though it may not be true to the original recipe. I am okay with that, but would like to get as close to the recipe as possible.

Thanks again.

 

[laserghost]

Okay, so the munich extract at the LHBS is the Briess Munich LME. According to their website it's 50/50 Pale base malt and Munich.

So here's what I've done ... left everything exactly the same as the all grain recipe except for the malts that require mashing; added the weight of the Victory to the Munich grain bill; accounted for the Munich LME's 50/50 ratio of Pale to Munich malts, and reduced the Pale LME accordingly (and bumped up the Munich LME to reach the adjusted weight in Munich+Victory)

Finally, after entering these numbers in Beersmith, it was a smidge short on OG and alcohol from the original. So then I just nudged the Pale and Munich LME's so the weights rounded off and the OG and alcohol are right where the all grain recipe's are. More specifically, I nudged the Pale LME from 5.7 lbs to 6 lbs and the Munich LME from 1.4 lbs to 1.5 lbs.

This is my recipe, sound good? Critique? Thanks again, everyone!

6 lbs Pale Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract
1.5 lbs Munich Liquid Extract (8.0 SRM) Extract
13.0 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt - 40L (40.0 SRM) Grain
6.4 oz Caramel/Crystal Malt -120L (120.0 SRM) Grain
1.6 oz Chocolate Malt (450.0 SRM) Grain
0.54 oz Magnum - Boil 60.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Cascade - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Centennial - Aroma Steep 10.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Cascade - Aroma Steep 0.0 min Hop
0.42 oz Centennial - Aroma Steep 0.0 min Hop
1.0 pkg California Ale (White Labs #WLP001) Yeast

5 gal batch / full boil

 

[jwalker1140]

I recently brewed the version of this recipe that's in BCS and just tried the first bottle last night. It's extremely good, possibly the best beer I've made. Wonderful malt/hop balance.

I can only mash 6-7 lbs of grain so I replaced some of the maris otter with 2.75 lbs pilsen LME (the only kind of light LME my LHBS carries). Next time I'll probably replace some of the pilsen LME with munich LME, which, aside from letting me use less pilsen, will let me drop the munich malt and up the amount of maris otter.