eHerms strike and mash temp setup

[TrickyDick]

So...

switched to electric from propane back in 2014/15 and then brewed maybe 4 batches and haven't brewed since for various reasons. Brewed again yesterday and had some issues.

My system is a eHerms setup, 3 vessels, 2 with heating elements: HLT and Boil Kettle. The Herms Coil is (obviously) setup in the HLT.

My general setup is to fill the HLT and the MLT with the appropriate amount of water, the HLT holding WAY more water than needed for a single batch sparge, just to cover the coil.

The question I have is this:

If I set the MLT temp to strike of say 169 degrees by recirculation through the HLT at say 170 degrees, after I mash in with a target mash temp of 152 for example, my HLT is now sitting at 170 and I can't recirculate the mash because the HLT is too hot.

How are others using their eHerms setup to do this? Ideally would be nice to have the HLT at the first mash temp target with the mash tun water at strike temp.

I suppose I could heat the strike water in the boil kettle at the strike temp (169 in the example) and then set the HLT to the mash temp, but then going to lose a few degrees heating the mash tun and false bottom, plus not ideally plumbed to do without a manual technique, such that it wouldn't be automated on my BCS controller.

thanks

TD

 

[day_trippr]

I have a 3v2p herms - but gas - and I heat my strike water in my boil kettle separately for all of your noted reasons. Makes everything easier.

I add mash salts/acids for the strike and sparge volumes separately so they only get what they need, respectively, heat up the strike water to the temperature prescribed by BeerSmith3 based on grain and MLT temperatures (I add the grain just before the strike and then underlet so take their temperatures separately to plug into BS3) and after one good stir and a ~five minute stand before starting the recirculation the mash is almost always within a degree of target (one thing that Beer Smith with a solid equipment profile is very good at). Meanwhile the HLT temperature is ready for recirculation at roughly 1.5°F above mash temperature.

I'm not familiar with BCS (of any vintage) but still I'm surprised one couldn't script that process somehow. Even a crude microcontroller could manage it with appropriate code...

Cheers!

 

[lapolvora]

This may help.. http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/brew-day-step-by-step

 

[TrickyDick]

I have a 3v2p herms - but gas - and I heat my strike water in my boil kettle separately for all of your noted reasons. Makes everything easier.

I add mash salts/acids for the strike and sparge volumes separately so they only get what they need, respectively, heat up the strike water to the temperature prescribed by BeerSmith3 based on grain and MLT temperatures (I add the grain just before the strike and then underlet so take their temperatures separately to plug into BS3) and after one good stir and a ~five minute stand before starting the recirculation the mash is almost always within a degree of target (one thing that Beer Smith with a solid equipment profile is very good at). Meanwhile the HLT temperature is ready for recirculation at roughly 1.5°F above mash temperature.

I'm not familiar with BCS (of any vintage) but still I'm surprised one couldn't script that process somehow. Even a crude microcontroller could manage it with appropriate code...

Cheers!

Thanks! I don’t know how to do any scripting. I’m sure there is a way to make scripts or what-not for the BCS controllers for every recipe you’ve got if you want to, and load them as needed. I know you can do it but honestly, I’m pretty clueless on the programming aspects. I enjoy the bcs because I can automate the filling (via electric ball valve) of the HLT and heating to strike and holding temp such that when I roll out of bed, assuming I had it all set up and the pumps primed the night before , it’s ready to mash in.

My old system I had in BeerSmith 2 and was also very good at hitting the numbers once you had all the info for your system. My new setup I haven’t had enough use to get everything dialed in. I may have to resort to fly sparging because I get a vacuum effect below the false bottom if I drain the MLT. Also no sight glass on the MLT. The boil kettle sight glass feeds off a T after the outlet valve. When I Whirlpool it throws off the measurements. I may end up adding a second set of volume markings to account for this issue on the boil kettle sight glass.

Heating the strike water in the boil kettle seems the best way to go. Kinda messes with my automation plan.

By the way, what does 3v2p mean? 3 vessel 2 with heat?

TD

 

[Dustin_J]

So...

How are others using their eHerms setup to do this? Ideally would be nice to have the HLT at the first mash temp target with the mash tun water at strike temp.

TD

The technique of heating the strike water in the boil kettle will work, but it's a bit of a hassle as you note.

Another option is to start with your HLT full and your strike water in the mash tun without the grain. You can then recirculate the strike water through the HERMS coil as things are heating up in the HLT, which will warm up the HLT and strike water at the same time. There will be a bit of a lag with the strike water as it heats, but no big deal. Then, just dump the grains in the mash tun when you're ready to mash in. You'll lose some temp here, but it'll get back to mash temp pretty quickly by continuing to recirculate. I did this for my 3 vessel/2 pump EHERMS for a while before moving to full volume mashes/preboiling the strike water.

To compensate for some of the mash in temp drop, I used to set my HLT temp about 3-4 degrees above mash target then mash in (I.E., If I wanted to mash in at 152, I'd set the HLT for ~156). Then, once mashed in, I'd immediately turn the HLT down to target temp (in my case to 154, as my mash tun runs about 1.5-2 degrees cooler than the HLT) and things would equalize about right after 5-10 minutes. This isn't really critical, but it saves a bit of time.

 

[sicktght311]

I've done this both ways.........

1) Fill my HLT to the top, and start to heat the HLT to my target mash temp, circulate the strike water from the MLT through the Herms coil to heat it. Dough in once i hit my target mash temp, let it sit for 5 minutes after stirring, and then slowly open the recirculation valve. The temp eventually settles in at my target mash temp after about 10 minutes max
OR
2) Fill my HLT to around 7 gallons which leaves a couple inches of the Herms Coil exposed. Fill the MLT with my strike water, heat up to a strike temp of 167-170 depending on my target mash temp by the same method as one, recirculating through the herms coil while the HLT heats up. Recirculate until i hit temp, and then dough in. Mash settles right at my target temp, and then i'll top off the HLT with cold water until the HLT reaches my target mash temp. Then i start recirculation. Holds the temp steady quicker.

Both have worked fine with minimal if no affect on the final beer. I always hit my numbers. I prefer number 2 just because if i DO have an issue with the recirculation getting clogged at the beginning, i'm not struggling with a mash at 142 degrees instead of 152. Its still sitting at its target temp while i fix the problem

 

[WesBrew]

I'm not sure I understand your setup well as mine is simpler.... you typically wait 10 minutes after dough in before recirculating so the hlt temp should drop a bit, could you adjust the strike temp down a few degrees, leaving you just below the 152 mash target to start, recirculating the slightly low temp wort through the hotter herms/hlt should have you balanced out pretty fast?