Easy Stove-Top Pasteurizing - With Pics

[bembel]

The other option I'm experimenting with is pasteurizing whole batches in small kegs then filtering, back sweetening and force carbing the final cider

 

[echardcore]

"The philosophy is that you want to sweeten until you are happy, then add the amount of carb sugar you need"

Echardcore

I'm sure your cider will be fantastic, the juice is likely from Pine Hill farm and last years blends are turning out great!

One thing, you can't sweeten to taste, and then add more sugar to carb unless you precisely measure the pressure being created and then stop the yeast by pasteurization at exactly the level of the SG that you back sweetened to. Without a pressure gauge hooked up to a test bottle this is next to impossible. Especially with 3 gallons worth.

It is very difficult to try this out first time. Essentially you are trying to guess when the yeast have eaten enough sugar to get to your desired carb level, then stopped them by pasteurization. Now sure, you can guesstimate and just pasteurize when the bottles feel firm, but you probably won't end up with the FG that you intended based on the sweetening to taste. - you might, but this would be good fortune and hard to replicate-

If you were just trying to stop fermentation at a desired sweetness without worrying about carbonation I you can simply taste the cider and then bottle and pasteurize when it's to your liking, but once they are bottled you loose the ability to take samples unless you open a bottle, and with just 3 gallons worth that's a high cost sample.

Thanks bembel!

Welp! The plastic bottle never really got much firmer after waiting 4 days. We decided to pasteurize anyway since we don't have much time for this during the week. I drank the plastic bottle and it's wonderful. I wonder if my yeast never came out of dormancy? There seems to be little to no carbonation at all. I had a feeling this might happen. I kept the bottles in the basement where it is cooler than the rest of the house. We brought them upstairs for the last day.

 

[eigua]

The plastic bottle never really got much firmer after waiting 4 days...I wonder if my yeast never came out of dormancy? There seems to be little to no carbonation at all. I had a feeling this might happen.

It looks to me has only been 8 days between bottling and now based on the date of your previous post. My cider took a lot longer than that to carbonate. I'd say it was about 3 weeks before the plastic bottles were rock hard. Both the original fermentation and carbonation were slow -- it was 38 days in primary before SG stabilized and no more bubbles were visible.

 

[echardcore]

It looks to me has only been 8 days between bottling and now based on the date of your previous post. My cider took a lot longer than that to carbonate. I'd say it was about 3 weeks before the plastic bottles were rock hard. Both the original fermentation and carbonation were slow -- it was 38 days in primary before SG stabilized and no more bubbles were visible.

Wow thats a lot longer than what OP says. Mine was in the primary/secondary since November.

 

[eigua]

Wow thats a lot longer than what OP says. Mine was in the primary/secondary since November.

Dang, that's a long primary/secondary! I would think that may make it take even longer considering nearly all of the yeast had probably settled out at that point. I imagine it would take whatever few were left a long time to replicate enough to carb.

If you had it so long in the primary/secondary, that sounds a lot different from what the OP did. He bottled while his yeast were still suspended and in active (but slowed) fermentation and there was still plenty of sugar left in the mix. Carbonation naturally would have taken place very quickly considering his yeast were still in fermentation mode when he bottled. The pasteurization was then done to kill them off after enough carbonation had taken place so he could retain the residual sugars for taste.

I'm sure it can also depend on the type of yeast used. I used Safale S04 in mine, which it seems like for malt it's a fermentation monster, but for sucrose or apple juice, it really, really takes its time.

 

[Dirt_McGirt]

I just tried this and was maybe at 195 for the first batch. I had one bottle go kablooie and the caps on two others fly off. Second batch was at about 170-175 and was fine. Is that high enough to have done the job?

 

[Blue-Frog]

I wish you brave men could get some of this kablooie & flying lids on film/tape/chips
I wanna see what I don't ever want to see in front of me, my very own frontal lobotamy.

 

[MT2sum]

I just tried this and was maybe at 195 for the first batch. I had one bottle go kablooie and the caps on two others fly off. Second batch was at about 170-175 and was fine. Is that high enough to have done the job?

The whole idea of pasteurizing is to kill the yeast. which, if you read some of the threads on HBT can be done at 100F-125F, but that would probably take several hours with your carbonated cider, and who wants a brew day to last that long? Also, you've got to do this fairly soon after reaching the proper carbonation - so don't wait too long, from what I've read. If you look in the past threads, it can be as low as 150F (lower in some cases) - as long as you leave it in long enough so that the whole bottle reaches the set point - I'd recommend using one of those remote thermometers (where you just use a probe in the bottle) and put that bottle in the center of the pile - then make sure that you keep it at the set temperature for the proper amount of time - that means wasting one bottle of cider (which you can drink, even tho it will be flat, not sparkling), but at least you have a liquid of the same density as the rest of the bottles ..... you can stick the probe thru a cork so that the water heating environment isn't affecting the temp of an open bottle. Remember, you have to heat a glass bottle to bring up the temps of the liquid inside of that bottle - it takes time because both don't heat at the same speed, the bottle heats slower than the liquid inside, that's why I put a thermometer in the water and a second thermometer (the one with a probe) in the cider bottle. That tells me when the cider has reached the proper temp for pasteurization. I followed Pappers' instructions for part of this - other than the temp/time itself, using the ideas of others for measuring the temps, and my cider worked out great. I first brought the water up to temp, put the bottles in one at a time, and didn't start the timer until the water temp was back up to my set-temp. I maintained the set-temp throughout the whole set-time. I don't drink cider but the wife does, so I haven't made it in a few years or so - she says it gets better with age! I'll try to backtrack this thread and see exactly what the temps and time are supposed to be and edit this when I come up with a more explicit answer ;>)

NOTE: Be sure you have something between the bottom of the bottles & the bottom surface of the water pot. I use a canning plate (looks like a false bottom, but the holes in it are about 1/2" in size), although some posters have said that a rag will do. Since I used an old canner pot for pasteurizing (you can tighten down the top to prevent bottle bomb problems) we still had the plate that goes with it - just take out the rubber pop-valve so you can put the probe and long-stemmed thermometer in!

OK, I read a few pages toward the front of the thread - Pappers says he puts room temp bottles into 190F water for 10 minutes and it usually drops the water temp to about 160F, so he apparently doesn't keep heat under it all the time. Another poster says 160F for 20 min. You might read pages 3&4 because supposedly certain yeasts are not affected by this pasteurization technique. On pg 7, post #61, Joe Sponge shows some calcs he found for pasteurizing water as low as 128F/56 min., 140F/5.6 min., 152F 5.6 min as well as a lot of other good info if you have a scientific mind (I dont!). I believe I used 165F/20 min. as a set point/time, and had/have had NO bottle bombs. I think you went over the 190F too much and also you need to be sure you didn't over-carbonate as that will also cause bottle bombs, volcanoes/foam fountains, etc. Just be sure you read thru the first 10 or 15 pages of this thread (and even take a look at the links to some other threads), so you're aware if the risks involved in pasteurizing! If you have questions, ask Pappers - he's the mod of this thread AFAIK.
BTW, one poster - cyberbackpacker - says that he visited Yeunglings Brewery and they told him that they pasteurize their beer at 140F/12 min.
MT2sum

 

[GioGomez2010]

Stove top pasteurized. Didn't die! Worked like a charm but also my cider was lightly carbed so lessened bomb risk Haha Great tutorial so many years down the road.

 

[katzgirl]

So I'm planning a carbonated hard lemonade. Can the pasteurization be done in a wine bottle? What would be the best type of closure for the bottle? The plastic cork with wire cage?

 

[eigua]

So I'm planning a carbonated hard lemonade. Can the pasteurization be done in a wine bottle? What would be the best type of closure for the bottle? The plastic cork with wire cage?

Don't store carbonated drinks in wine bottles. They're not made for pressure. You should use champagne bottles or large flip tops.

 

[katzgirl]

Very new to the carbonation process. Is the yeast nutrient and Lalvin EC1118 champagne yeast two different yeasts? One comes in a small packet and the other in a pound bag. It would take alot of packets to get 7 tsp. Thanks!

 

[TandemTails]

I'm bottle carbing a 1 gallon test batch that I added 1 can of FAJC to. The SG at bottling was 1.021.

I sanitized a 20oz sprite bottle and filled that, leaving the same headroom in the bottle as I did the glass ones. I then squeezed it until the cider came to the top and twisted the cap on tight. I'm using this as my 'pressure gauge'.

3 days later the sprite bottle is almost fully expanded so I'll probably be pasteurizing tomorrow. I'm planning on pasteurizing a little lower than 190 just to play it safe. I'll probably aim for 175 or 180 for 15 minutes.

I used Lalvin D-47 yeast for the initial fermentation, so we'll see how this goes

 

[eigua]

Very new to the carbonation process. Is the yeast nutrient and Lalvin EC1118 champagne yeast two different yeasts? One comes in a small packet and the other in a pound bag. It would take alot of packets to get 7 tsp. Thanks!

Yeast nutrient is not yeast. It's food for the yeast to help it grow and survive while it's fermenting. It's not always necessary, but it can help when you're fermenting something that doesn't naturally contain the necessary nutrients for the yeast (for example, sugar water).

Why do you need 7 tsp of yeast? Each packet of champagne yeast is enough for 5 gallons of wine. Check the back of the packet for instructions.

 

[katzgirl]

Kevin, yes, there is always sediment in the bottles.

Is there anyway to get past the sediment or even decrease it? I use Lalvin EC 1118 yesst. There is alot if sediment and doesnt look very appealing in the bottles. I did a hard lemonade and bottled in champagne bottles.

 

[TandemTails]

Is there anyway to get past the sediment or even decrease it? I use Lalvin EC 1118 yesst. There is alot if sediment and doesnt look very appealing in the bottles. I did a hard lemonade and bottled in champagne bottles.

As long as you're carbonating in the bottle you'll get sediment. That's the yeast dying off after converting the remaining sugar to alcohol/co2.

The only way to get a sediment free bottle is to either bottle it still (after a lot of aging or using clarifying agents) or to use a keg and bottle from there with co2 forced in.

 

[chevalcider]

As long as you're carbonating in the bottle you'll get sediment. That's the yeast dying off after converting the remaining sugar to alcohol/co2.

The only way to get a sediment free bottle is to either bottle it still (after a lot of aging or using clarifying agents) or to use a keg and bottle from there with co2 forced in.

I toured Sociables Cider Werks in Minneapolis in April and started talking technical with the tour guide (one of the company founders) after the rest of the tour group moved on. When I mentioned bottle carbing and sediment he suggested filtering to remove yeast and inoculating with another variety that has a minimal amount of sediment. I can't remember the yeast he mentioned.

 

[Pappers_]

I toured Sociables Cider Werks in Minneapolis in April and started talking technical with the tour guide (one of the company founders) after the rest of the tour group moved on. When I mentioned bottle carbing and sediment he suggested filtering to remove yeast and inoculating with another variety that has a minimal amount of sediment. I can't remember the yeast he mentioned.

If you're going to the bother of filtering, its easier to just keg carbonate it - at the homebrew scale.

 

[siderluver]

I'll be more careful next time, jeez.

 

[Aushunter]

I know I'm digging up an old thread but oldmate suggested I read this. Fantastic advise, planning on doing it myself. Pappers, was your cider clear before you bottled it? My cider is still cloudy, but has been fermenting 8 days has is bubbling very slow now, but I don't want it to ferment all the sugar and become too dry just because I was waiting for it to clear. So could I bottle and carb now, and will it clear up in the bottle? Another question also haha if I leave all the sediment behind in the carboy when I bottle, does that mean there's no yeast in the bottles to "eat" my carb drops? Sorry might be a dumb question but this is my very fist time haha.

 

[buMbLeB]

I've not pasteurized before, but I can say with confidence that sediment does not equal yeast - there are still microsopic yeast cells left behind after racking that you can't see, but which can absolutely restart. But if you pasteurize them this will kill them and stop further activity.

 

[globell]

I understand why pasteurization works, but in killing the yeast, and letting it sit in the bottle, will it clear?

 

[treacheroustexan]

I brewed 3 gallons of cider using notty. I kegged it, back sweetened with apple juice concentrate, carbed it in the keg, and bottled it with my beer gun. I just pasteurized the bottles using this method. Worked great.

 

[Ike]

I brewed 3 gallons of cider using notty. I kegged it, back sweetened with apple juice concentrate, carbed it in the keg, and bottled it with my beer gun. I just pasteurized the bottles using this method. Worked great.

This, this, so much... this. I have my first beer kegging going on TODAY, after 3+ years of bottling. But even better than having beer on tap, I'm looking forward to keg-carbing my cider, filling bottles once it's clear, and dropping them right into the pasteurizing bath. ACTUALLY, I'm really looking forward to filtering as well, and hopefully being able to quit pasteurizing all together... but we'll see about that.

 

[Maylar]

This, this, so much... this. I have my first beer kegging going on TODAY, after 3+ years of bottling. But even better than having beer on tap, I'm looking forward to keg-carbing my cider, filling bottles once it's clear, and dropping them right into the pasteurizing bath. ACTUALLY, I'm really looking forward to filtering as well, and hopefully being able to quit pasteurizing all together... but we'll see about that.

Tell ya what -

Make cider. Age in secondary for 4 months and let it drop crystal clear. Then rack to your keg with potassium sorbate and sulfite. Sweeten to whatever level you heart desires. Purge the keg, chill and carbonate. Bottle directly from the keg, cider foams very little. It's awesome and you'll never pasteurize again.

These babies are ready for the keg:

Brew hah.

 

[jonnypet]

I bottled up my cider (first attempt) yesterday. I had let the SG to drop to around 1.010, then added some sugar and bottled. I opened a bottle after one day and it is already gushing out, which makes me worry about putting them in hot water! Why are they gushing so soon?

 

[MarkKF]

Cuz you bottled them at 1.010

 

[jonnypet]

Cuz you bottled them at 1.010

Page 1 of this thread says to bottle 1.010 to 1.014 so the cider is not so dry

 

[MarkKF]

If a cider goes from 1.060 to 1.010 in a week it's gonna go to 1.000 in a day. That's a lot of fizz.

 

[jonnypet]

What would cause it to drop so quickly? I was monitoring the temp, and it was kept around 16degC, and I used a yeast specific for cider.

 

[MarkKF]

I don't know but after a week or so of active fermentation and there is still sugar present there are millions if not billions of hungry yeasties.

 

[Maylar]

Page 1 of this thread says to bottle 1.010 to 1.014 so the cider is not so dry

But you also added more sugar. The ferment was still in the active phase. It only takes 2 gravity points of sugar to make carbonation, which could go very quickly from where you were. Refrigerate them, keep them very cold and start drinking your cider. If you pasteurize with that level of carbonation the bottles will not survive.

 

[jonnypet]

yeah, but does Pappers then not say to add priming solution, so more sugar. I guess I added too much sugar? Should I just pour bottles back into demijohn and let the fermentation finish then back sweeten? I know it will make the cider stronger, but I have a lot of bottles and can't cool / drink them all!

 

[Maylar]

yeah, but does Pappers then not say to add priming solution, so more sugar. I guess I added too much sugar? Should I just pour bottles back into demijohn and let the fermentation finish then back sweeten? I know it will make the cider stronger, but I have a lot of bottles and can't cool / drink them all!

Yes, that's what I would do.

 

[buMbLeB]

My ciders generally fall from 1.070-80 to 1.003 in about 7-9 days, FYI. I thought this was normal.

 

[globell]

What is the ideal carbination level when you open a bottle to test - what's the benchmark? Just foaming up to the top of the bottle and slightly over? I popped the top on one tonight and it sounded like carbination present (hiss as I took crown cap off) and it slightly foamed. I do like my drinks very bubbly. No gusher or giesers! I've had that happen previously...

It's a sweet cider of 1.025 ish so it carbinates fast. 4-12 hours.

Started pasteurizing today (with success so far)

 

[SimonMM]

To all,

Thanks for the very informative original post and the subsequent posts.

I would like to confirm something regarding 'cold crashing'.

After letting my juice sit in the original carboy for 4-5 weeks and then adding my sugar (mixed with water) to the juice, I then syphon into individual bottles and leave them at room temp for a few weeks. Ideally, like everyone, I would like to have reasonably well-carbonated cider that doesn't explode in the bottles

I have a lot of fridge space, so I am going to opt for cold crashing.

My questions.

1- If I were to cold crash, does this kill the yeast entirely?

2- Do you have to wait until you have reached your desired level of carbonation in the bottle before you cold crash, therefore, ensuring the carbonation achieved up to this point is maintained and none further is achieved? - Is this the point of cold crashing, or indeed pasteurising?

Many thanks in advance for any feedback
Simon MM

 

[globell]

Cold crashing does not kill the yeast - puts them to sleep until they warm up

 

[globell]

Ok. So I got unlucky and lucky at the same time. I don't think the bottles were over carbonated but there's always some variability.

When I pastuerize carbonated cider and I always have the lid as a blocker between me and the bottle in case a bottle blows. Well. One fell over on the counter and I'm not sure if I touched it with the lid or it blew first but KABOOM. Louder than I can explain. My ears still hurt hours later. Blood splatter on the back of the lid. Very lucky I blocked it with the lid. Mostly. Glass flew at least 15'.

Wowzers. One laceration to the inside of the forearm.

Be careful. Be prepared. I knew it would happen eventually and came away ok.

Should I be concerned about the others?

Oh and lesson learned to put the bottles Directly into the boxes and not into counter where they can fall over.

 

[Maylar]

This is why I keg.