Dry Yeast and Rates for 1.070+ IPA

[FTABS]

Hi All,

Thanks for taking the time to check out this thread, I love this forum!

I'm working on my third home brew batch, so I'm still a newbie. I've been reading everything I can get my hands on, and loving every minute of it.

The first two batches that I did (and now my third), were True Brew kits (extract & specialty grains), which I bought mainly for the convenience and to get my feet wet. The first batch was the IPA, and the second was the Irish Stout. Also, both of the first two kits came with Muntons Ale yeast (6g pack). I didn't have any problems with fermentation, both were vigorous; but the FG only got down to 1.020 and 1.018 for both after 2+ weeks in the primary. (I'm leaving my brews in the primary for now, haven't had any reason to rack to secondary yet.)

After reading some of the general opinions on Muntons dry ale yeast here, I'll most likely stay away in the future.

The third batch that's upcoming is the True Brew Double IPA, after which I'll probably start just buying extract/materials individually since I'm getting more comfortable.

This Double IPA is billed as having an OG of 1.069 -1.073, so it's a bigger beer.

My current dilemma (aside from deciding how I want to work my boil gravity and hop additions), is deciding how much yeast to add to this guy.

Luckily, the Double IPA came with a 11.5g pack of Safale US-05, so I'm starting with a better yeast. My problem now is that I'm torn over how much to use, as I can easily pick up some more of the same yeast at my LHBS:

• Of Course, the True Brew instructions say to use 1 packet of yeast, though those instructions are practically useless anyway.
• Palmer's general Ale pitching rates are 170-225 billion for 5 gallons at 1.065-1.075, and he also states that, in general, dry yeast packs contain about 6 billion cells per gram.
• The Mr Malty calculator says to use ~260 billion cells for 5.25 gallons at 1.073, or 1.3 11.5g dry yeast packs.
• The Fermentis Product Guideline PDF for US-05 says that the Viable cells at packaging: 6 billion per gram, which equals about 69 billion per 11.5g by my calculations.

I'm not sure how the Mr Malty calculator is coming up with those numbers, and by the other guidelines that I can find, I'd have to use three 11.5g packs of US-05 to get to ~210 billion cells to even be close to a safe range.

Overall, I just want to make sure that I pitch enough quality yeast to ensure that I get the job done, and I want to make sure I'm doing it right. I really have high hopes for this batch, and I'm really looking forward to any opinions/tips/thoughts anyone might have.

Thanks all, cheers!

 

[Malticulous]

I pitched one rehydrated pack US-05 in my 1.074 IPA. Seemed to work fine. I still haven't taken the FG reading yet. It's sitting on dry hops now.

 

[KYB]

I say rehydrate 2 packets. Can (almost) never use too much yeast. Dry yeast is cheap. My 1.091 RIS I used 4 packets rehydrated, hah. I kinda planned for a higher OG, but only got 60% efficiency. Needless to say major blowoff in under 12 hours. It's better to have lots of yeast for a healthy fermentation, than not enough and they struggle to reproduce and ferment.

 

[FTABS]

Ok, thanks for the opinions guys...I guess I'll just pitch two of the re-hydrated US-05 to split the difference.

By my calculations that'll only be around 140 billion cells, but we'll see how it goes.

 

[GlassblowersBrew]

I am still unclear about what the proper pitching rate for US-05 dry yeast is. It seems to me that there is some conflicting opinions.

I wonder what happens to the viable yeast cell rate when you rehydrate the yeast in warm h2o for 30 min and then mix it with chilled wort for 30 min, then pitch it.

I would like to have found more info about dry yeast. Most of what I have heard from sources like the Jamil show and Brew Strong podcasts revolve around White Labs yeast rather than safale yeast, in reference to starters and such, praising liquid yeast as the "go to" yeast. I wonder if it has to do with sponsorship. I have read on the forums that there are people that are just as happy with dry yeast. I truly wonder if liquid yeast is that much better, or just that it is a different product and that is it. Any opinion?

Dry yeast seem so easy. All I brew is mostly high gravity IPA's and some PA's and I really enjoy the clean flavor of California ale yeast strains.

Is the US-05 a inferior strain to White Labs 001 California ale yeast or Wyeast 1056 or is it just a different brand? Anyone with more experience than myself have anything to add?



ps ... Ive had a few , sorry for the rambling post

 

[michael.berta]

Go w/ Mr Malty. White Labs even stands by his calculator...

 

[samc]

1 packet of S05 for that beer is more than enough. I do it all the time and always ferment to FG numbers with ease. Sometimes I rehydrate other times I just dump it in dry. If you do the dry pitch your wort should be a bit warmer 75F+, otherwise I pitch when wort is under 70F. (Fermentis recommends the warmer pitch for dry)

 

[sean6247]

Is the US-05 a inferior strain to White Labs 001 California ale yeast or Wyeast 1056 or is it just a different brand? Anyone with more experience than myself have anything to add?

I have used both the 1056 and the US-05 and find them to be identical. I have had exactly the same results with both yeasts. Because of this I have started using alot more of the fermentis dry-yeasts. For my Oktoberfest Altbier I used the S-33 (my LHBS was out of the 1007) and the results were phenominal, my alt tastes great and the yeast fermented my 1.054 wort down to 1.009. I find myself reaching for the dry yeast more and more frequently. I still prefer the WYeast for specialty strains, but there is not much out there that is better than the S-04 and S-05.

 

[FTABS]

Hmm...

Now I find myself even more up in the air about whether to pitch one pack or two, though I really don't know if I'll be necessarily over-pitching if I use two...and that might be the safest bet.

I'm just nervous because I haven't been able to get a beer down below 1.018, using one pack...though granted that was an inferior yeast in a smaller pack. (Muntons ale yeast).

 

[eanmcnulty]

I have been using US05 for the past 12 brews, and they all ferment to the expected FG. Most of my ales have been around 1.050 to 1.066. If I were to brew 1.070-1.075 I would still probably use just one packet. Over that I would need to do research. I have never tried to brew that big yet.

 

[Brocster]

Hmm...

Now I find myself even more up in the air about whether to pitch one pack or two, though I really don't know if I'll be necessarily over-pitching if I use two...and that might be the safest bet.

I'm just nervous because I haven't been able to get a beer down below 1.018, using one pack...though granted that was an inferior yeast in a smaller pack. (Muntons ale yeast).

I make a strong ale that has an OG around 1.070. Although I use s-04 for that recipe instead of S-05, I do pitch 2 packs of dry yeast per 5.5 gallon batch. Works like a charm and does not even come close to what would constitute overpitching. Beer finishes out fantastic every time and gets going real quick once I 'lock er' up'.

For my two cents, I would go with 2 rehydrated packs of dry yeast for every 5 gallon or so batch you are doing. The upside of that is far more favorable than any potential downside. It is cheap to use dry yeast and you remove any thoughts of underpitching (which is the real concern versus overpitching).

Again, just my thoughts.

 

[ksbrain]

IMO 1.070 is right on the border between one pack and two packs of US-05. You're probably fine with one, but two wouldn't hurt for your IPA.

 

[Bobby_M]

I'll say it this way. If you want to sprinkle the yeast right into the carboy, go with two packs. If you don't mind rehydrating in 80F water for 30 minutes, you will be OK with one pack.

 

[JuanMoore]

I'll say it this way. If you want to sprinkle the yeast right into the carboy, go with two packs. If you don't mind rehydrating in 80F water for 30 minutes, you will be OK with one pack.

+1.... My thoughts exactly.
I use US-05 a lot, and always rehydrate in 95F water. I use one packet for brews under 1.070, and two for over. Dry yeast is relatively cheap, and using two packets certainly won't hurt anything. If you're just going to sprinkle it on top of the wort definately use two as it stresses the yeast more than if it's properly rehydrated.

 

[Reelale]

Just did an IIPA at 1.083 with one pack of rehydrated S-05. Looks like fermentation went as usual (still in primary). I am hoping this particular brew stops around 1.020 though. After I was done, I did wonder why I didn't pitch 2 sachets of notty though.

 

[VirginiaHops1]

I know this is a very old thread, but I had a question on the exact same topic so figured why not just piggyback on this one instead of starting a new one.

I just did a DIPA that had on OG of 1.080. I used one pack of US-05 sprinkled and stirred into the wort, and it fermented down to 1.015. Both readings in line with what the kit said. It's been bottled for about 3 weeks and is still carbing up, but I tasted it and it seems a bit off, and my first brew kind of had a similar taste. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what in my process is causing this but my question is, is it possible I underpitched and got some off flavors even though it seemed to attenuate exactly as the recipe said it should?

 

[couchsending]

I know this is a very old thread, but I had a question on the exact same topic so figured why not just piggyback on this one instead of starting a new one.

I just did a DIPA that had on OG of 1.080. I used one pack of US-05 sprinkled and stirred into the wort, and it fermented down to 1.015. Both readings in line with what the kit said. It's been bottled for about 3 weeks and is still carbing up, but I tasted it and it seems a bit off, and my first brew kind of had a similar taste. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what in my process is causing this but my question is, is it possible I underpitched and got some off flavors even though it seemed to attenuate exactly as the recipe said it should?

What is the “off” flavor exactly?

 

[VirginiaHops1]

What is the “off” flavor exactly?

I'm new, so I'm really not great at identifying or describing off flavors yet but it's kind of a toasty/malty/caramely flavor. I picked it up in my first beer too. I thought in the first beer maybe it was the specialty grains used, or I scorched the LME. The 2nd one had lighter grains but it's still there. In reading about off flavors I read about benzaldehyde from oxidation, which produces an almond-like flavor. Maybe that's it, just wish I could pinpoint the cause. This was a really high gravity beer and I only used 1 dry yeast packet(unhydrated), so I don't know if that contributed anything.

I didn't do late extract addition in those first 2 brews but did in an amber ale I have fermenting, so when I taste that I can see if that helped at all.

 

[couchsending]

I'm new, so I'm really not great at identifying or describing off flavors yet but it's kind of a toasty/malty/caramely flavor. I picked it up in my first beer too. I thought in the first beer maybe it was the specialty grains used, or I scorched the LME. The 2nd one had lighter grains but it's still there. In reading about off flavors I read about benzaldehyde from oxidation, which produces an almond-like flavor. Maybe that's it, just wish I could pinpoint the cause. This was a really high gravity beer and I only used 1 dry yeast packet(unhydrated), so I don't know if that contributed anything.

I didn't do late extract addition in those first 2 brews but did in an amber ale I have fermenting, so when I taste that I can see if that helped at all.

it sounds like what you're tasting is not necessarily the result of under pitching. It could be oxidation or water chemistry related but those aren't typical flavor descriptors of under pitch, generally. hard to know.

 

[twh]

I'm new too. But I found that pitching S-05 regardless of style or gravity, my beers tasted the same. When I pitched with liquid yeast is when I discovered there is a difference.