Does the ratio of grains scale up or down with increased/decreased batch size?

[Corwin1968]

Not sure I'm wording this correctly, but if I take a 5 gallon recipe and use those ingredients to brew a 3 gallon batch, will the result just be a stronger version or will the flavor profile be massively different?

How would hops scale? My understanding is that the higher the ABV, the more hops needed for balance. Would using the hop profile of a 5 gallon recipe in a 3 gallon recipe be too hoppy, or would the higher ABV balance it out?

 

[Bobby_M]

All the parameters scale pretty linearly from starting gravity to final gravity. However, there is a point where the yeast can reach its abv limit and quit ir at least require a non proportional increase in cell count.

The result of hop use depends on if you are doing a concentrated boil and topping off off a significant portion of the total volume or not.

It's complicated. You will not be making the recipe as intended so results may be interesting or unpleasant.

 

[kevin58]

I guess I'm spoiled. I use Beersmith 3 and just use the scale tool to adjust batch sizes. It will adjust everything accordingly. Using software makes calculations like these easy.

 

[Corwin1968]

All the parameters scale pretty linearly from starting gravity to final gravity. However, there is a point where the yeast can reach its abv limit and quit ir at least require a non proportional increase in cell count.

The result of hop use depends on if you are doing a concentrated boil and topping off off a significant portion of the total volume or not.

It's complicated. You will not be making the recipe as intended so results may be interesting or unpleasant.

I'm only doing this because Morebeer has a Deschutes Black Butte Porter 5 gallon kit and I loved the anniversary Imperial version of that beer, that Deschutes put out. I'm only going from a 5.3% ABV to something like an 8% ABV, so I'm not worried about the yeast.

I found a colorful chart showing optimum IBU vs OG and I may just use that to scale up my ratio of hops to OG.

I view this as totally experimental and the kit was pretty cheap, so not a big deal if it turns out to be a drain pour.

My only concern is that the kit recipe calls for one 15 minute hop addition and two 1 minute additions, whereas all the Black Butte clone recipes I've seen and one of the main guys from Deschutes, have a more traditional hop schedule (ie, bittering at 60 minutes, plus some shorter additions). Not sure what I'm going to do there.

Also, I use Brewfather for all of my batches, including this one, so I at least have an idea what my result might look like.

 

[mac_1103]

Not sure I'm wording this correctly...

What's your goal? Are you trying to turn a five gallon session IPA into a 3 gallon DIPA, or something like that? Why not just find a recipe for the style and strength of beer you want to brew and scale the batch size accordingly?

 

[mac_1103]

I'm only doing this because Morebeer has a Deschutes Black Butte Porter 5 gallon kit and I loved the anniversary Imperial version of that beer

According to the Deschutes website, the Anniversary Imperial version is 11% ABV and 40 IBU, and was "brewed with chocolate, coffee, vanilla, milk sugar, and aged in bourbon barrels." I don't think you're going to get what you loved just by making the Morebeer kit with less water.

 

[Corwin1968]

I don't expect too get the anniversary Imperial porter, it's just an experiment. I like the regular Black Butte Porter but it's a little on the "light" side for me, so I'm curious what this experiment will result in.

 

[lumpher]

I wouldn't take a 5g kit and turn it into a 3g stronger batch. The hops to grain to water ratio would make it a different beer. As some have suggested, I'd find a recipe that is what I'm looking for and do that. Overall attenuation and IBU would be off with what you're talking about. You could look for an Imperial Porter recipe.

 

[mac_1103]

Another thing that will be very different with that grain bill in 3 gallons instead of 5 is the color.

 

[Willy]

Another thing that will be very different with that grain bill in 3 gallons instead of 5 is the color.

Yup. Was going to mention the same thing. It will be more malty and a darker color with less water. Did Brewsmith show that in the SRM?

 

[Corwin1968]

I didn't think to compare the SRM's.

The wort is in the fermenter, as of today. I've been having efficiency issues and it just got much worse. I think Brewfather defaults to like 62% and I've been coming short, so I set it to 54% and still missed my OG by over 10 points.

This is the first pre-milled kit I've used, so maybe the milling wasn't fine enough.

Also, this totally maxed out my grain basket. I don't know how much that impacts efficiency, when the grain is so packed into a confined space. I suspect it probably lowers it.

So, my final beer isn't going to be much higher ABV than the 5 gallon version. I'll be lucky to hit 6% ABV.

The wort is freaking delicious!