DIY Conical Fermenter idea

[dantodd]

I think that's the same tank they have at plastic-mart. But plastic-mart's 15gallon is $99 including stand.

Plastic-mart has smaller conicals too.. http://www.plastic-mart.com/

 

[Grimsawyer]

Woah.... Is the plastic used on those food grade. Had alot of them fancy book learnin' smart people words to describe what it was made of. Does the phraise "meets FDA standards" mean food grade? I assume so, but you know what they say about assumptions. If I'm reading that right a 15 gallon conical fermenter would be $135.86 plus shipping plus the cost to outfit it with some ball valves? that would be what, 180, 190ish?:rockin: Man! I Need a few of those!!!

 

[Spoonta]

IMam thinking of building a mould an building 1 or 2 out of fiber glass

 

[Sir Humpsalot]

IMam thinking of building a mould an building 1 or 2 out of fiber glass

I've done some glass work. They do make a Food-Grade epoxy resin. I don't know much about it, but since we're talking about long-ish term storage, using anything else would seem to be very foolish.

 

[dantodd]

I fired an email off to plastic-mart to ask about food-safe status of the conicals.

 

[Spoonta]

I've done some glass work. They do make a Food-Grade epoxy resin. I don't know much about it, but since we're talking about long-ish term storage, using anything else would seem to be very foolish.

That the 1 I hade in mind or an ozo resin the same as we build the wine vats out of

 

[alemonkey]

Wouldn't it be hard to get a smooth enough surface with fiberglass? Even the best gel coat I've seen usually needs some filler, and you probably wouldn't want that in contact with your beer.

 

[the_bird]

Food grade, in the context of a fermenter, basically means completely smooth, right? That's my understanding of why a bucket from the HBS is food-grade and one from Home Depot is not. I know there could also be issues with the materials itself, but I'm been under the impression that the primary differentiator is how thoroughly they can be sanitized.

My concern with this whole project, whether it's melting/deforming a bucket, or putting something together with fiberglass, or whatever, is that you can't have the little cracks, crevices, nooks, and crannies where nasties like to hide and where sanitizer doesn't reach.

 

[dantodd]

I just got an email back from the mfg. of these conical tanks. The LDPE material they use to manufacture the tanks is FDA approved for food. However; they are not specifically designed for food service so they have not been submitted to NSF for certification. NSF is an NGO and certification is not required for food-service use. AFAIK using these tanks in a restaurant environment would not get you dinged in inspection. If I ever move up to 10+ gallon batches I will almost certainly use one of these and would have no qualms about drinking beer fermented in one.

 

[Orfy]

If you need a guinea pig to test all of your first 10 gallon batch then I'm sure I could help out a fellow brewer in need.

 

[alemonkey]

I wonder how the lids seal in this tanks?

 

[Bsquared]

. If I ever move up to 10+ gallon batches I will almost certainly use one of these and would have no qualms about drinking beer fermented in one.

Thanks for the info, I want to upgrade to 10+ batches as well. looks like a fun project to convert one to those to a Fermentation vessel.

 

[Bernie Brewer]

I live in a house with a full breaker box.

I put a new 220V breaker in for the air compressor.

I doubled up the dryer breaker for the welder. I have a big 250A Miller stick welder. Its easy to prevent blowing the breaker. I just tell my wife that I am going to do some welding and not to use the dryer. No big deal.

Add a subpanel. If you know enough to add breakers, you know enough to add panels. Don't double up on a breaker.

 

[dantodd]

I wonder how the lids seal in this tanks?

I'm sure they seal well enough to keep out the stray nasties floating around and probably not well enough to be a pressure vessel.

 

[brewman !]

Add a subpanel. If you know enough to add breakers, you know enough to add panels. Don't double up on a breaker.

The feed isn't big enough into the box and the box is full. I can't add a sub panel without getting an electrical inspection. You can double up a breaker without an inspection. Its an older house. The wiring is a real mess.

 

[brewman !]

I was thinking about my perfect fermentor vessel tonight as I was racking my wine.

It would be a 7.5 gallon conical fermentor. 60 degree cone. Made of clear plastic like the Better Bottles are. The neck would be just like the neck on the BB, but with screw in inserts so that the vessel could be pressurized somewhat. Maybe enough to carbonate with, but surely enough to pressure rack/filter from.

It would be nice to have a screw on lid, but I'd guess it couldn't be pressurized then.

It would have a side port like the BB do for sampling and racking (if necessary) and bottling from.

I'd definitely want it clear so that you can see what is going on.

I'd definitely want it a pressure vessel so that one could filter as its bottled or racked.

There isn't anything wrong with the BB plastic. I'd like that over SS for cost and being able to see in.

 

[dantodd]

The feed isn't big enough into the box and the box is full. I can't add a sub panel without getting an electrical inspection. You can double up a breaker without an inspection. Its an older house. The wiring is a real mess.

I added a primary and made my existing panel a sub-panel. Some day I'll have to get an inspection....

 

[brewman !]

I added a primary and made my existing panel a sub-panel. Some day I'll have to get an inspection....

I was wondering about that. I didn't want to say anything. Did you change the feed coming into the house to handle the higher load or was it adequate already ?

Some jurisdictions say that if you start changing one major thing about the electrical system that you have to bring it all up to spec. My friend couldn't put an addition onto his house for that reason.

 

[dantodd]

I actually have really old knob and tube wiring in the house and I added a hot tub. So, I dropped in a load box and ran nice 200 amp capable copper to the old load box. Unfortunately I only have 100amp service and aluminum wiring into the service entry. I'm pretty sure that when I get a permit I'll have to upgrade the rest of the house, I also want to get 200 amp service, the hot tub and fish tanks really suck up the juice.

 

[Spoonta]

I did my apprenticeship in boat building and was thing tha a male plug would be the way to go

 

[Porcelon]

Food grade, in the context of a fermenter, basically means completely smooth, right?

Wrong. It means that all the extra compounds they put into plastic to make it pliable, extrudable and set up properly are safe to eat.

So with non-food-safe plastic these random molecules are melted in, you can't wash them off and they will leach out of the plastic for as long as you use it.

Personally, I get small buckets from the grocery store for half batches (3.5 gal). They are food safe and sometimes have the silicone gasket in the lid.

Oh, and sometimes they have leftover frosting!

Matt

 

[the_bird]

Well, I'm pretty sure the answer is "both". The buckets you buy at Home Depot *would* be food-grade, but the process by which they make them is not as precise. It's the exact same material as the buckets we get at the HBS, but they still aren't food grade because of the manufacturing process.

 

[Porcelon]

Right, the material is the same (ie. HDPE, PET etc.) but the little extras they use to produce the bucket are not guaranteed safe.

If you can pick up bottled water, the bottle would be ok to use, and sometimes infomation is written on the bottom of the item. You just have to be aware of it's intended use, and if it's used, what's been put in it.

I've used food grade buckets for mixing mortar, so now I'd never use it for beer again.

 

[dantodd]

Yep, HDPE and most other plastics CAN be made into food-safe products. The buckets at home depot may use toxic (or non-approved) release agents to pull them out of the mold. The coloration may also be non-approved. Finally, the production line doesn't have to follow the same sanitation procedures. We all know how important sanitation is!

 

[Grimsawyer]

Is this a good idea or not, I mean getting One of these and fermenting in it? This seems like a plausable alternitave to ******* out the cash for a stainless steel conical fermenter. I am seriously thinking about it. I want to ferment my 10-12 gallon batches in something other than 2 or 3 glass carboys.

 

[dantodd]

When I'm ready to move up to 10 gallon batches I'm getting one.

A nice valve on the bottom and a better bottle racking spigot, drill the top for airlock and you're done.

 

[Orfy]

Is that top air tight?

 

[Dude]

OMG, I just saw this thread. All I can say is--I hope I'm not reading about you in the next publication of the Darwin Award winners.

 

[Sir Humpsalot]

You never fried a turkey, worked with an oxy-acetylene torch, or used a chainsaw, I gather? Heck, if you've ever fried french fries, you've probably dealt with more grease than what I'm talking about.

 

[Bernie Brewer]

The feed isn't big enough into the box and the box is full. I can't add a sub panel without getting an electrical inspection. You can double up a breaker without an inspection. Its an older house. The wiring is a real mess.

You can add a subpanel without an inspection, and even if you couldn't why would it matter? The inspector only wants to see that you made a safe installation. He's not the enemy. If your wiring is such a mess, you're only making it worse by jury-rigging things. Oh and even if your box is full,you can still do it. Take out two circuits and move them to the subpanel. Then you have room for the 2-pole breaker for the sub.