Saison Cottage House Saison

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pmaster said:
Wow, its been in the primary for about 1 month, and there is still some bubbling coming out of the airlock! À very différent fermentation than last time when it took about 7-9 days! I guess ill wait it out

Gravity is at 1.00 so I might still bottle tomorrow if it hasn't changed.
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Bottled everything yesterday. Can't wait to try it out! At 8.5% abv its gonna be a strong one though!
 
armenianbrewer said:
So update on my episode from above...

The LHBS was closed Monday so I couldnt buy fresh yeast so the back up back up plan was to ask a coworker to borrow some harvested yeast from his own home bank... ironically, when I harvested my batch originally, a week or so after I had given him some of what I harvested for his own attempt at the Cottage Saison (he used Nelson hops instead), and then a month after of primary he harvested and stored his yeast in the fridge since then... which is what I pitched into my batch Monday... so it's the 3rd generation now of the yeast originally used when I made this batch.

There's plenty of blowoff tube activity in the bucket of starsan so we'll see how this turns out when all is said and done!

TLDR: brew day went perfectly (even overshot OG), pitched old harvested 3711, no fermentation, LHBS closed, pitched two time harvested 3711 from co worker originally obtained by me into wort.... will be back in 4 months to see how it all turns out
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Updating on the above... took a sample on Sunday as it had been right around 2 weeks since brew day (in basement at 66-68 degrees).... 3711 never fails to ferment dry! It clocked in at about 1.004 and now I've moved it upstairs into my 2nd floor linen closet which gets up to 77-80 during the peak of these hot summer days when I'm not home... and starting to either notice CO2 escaping from the solution or 3711 is getting happy to clean up and finish off the rest of the sugars!

However, my hydrometer sample came out quite cloudy, which is different than when I brewed it the first time but the first time I brewed it I only sampled the FG at bottling which was about 5 weeks after brewing
 
Adding this to the brew list. Any recommended water profile for this?
 
I had the last beer of my last batch last night. I must say it has changed greatly, and not for the better sadly :( Its still very decent, quite good, but just not as awesome as it was in the beginning. I brewed the 1st batch probably 4 months ago, but its been a very hot summer and I haven't been able to store the beer anywhere very cold so it suffered through temperatures between 75-95F. I thought it would keep longer but I guess I'll have to think about a better storage solution. Anyone else ever had that experience?
 
pmaster said:
I had the last beer of my last batch last night. I must say it has changed greatly, and not for the better sadly :( Its still very decent, quite good, but just not as awesome as it was in the beginning. I brewed the 1st batch probably 4 months ago, but its been a very hot summer and I haven't been able to store the beer anywhere very cold so it suffered through temperatures between 75-95F. I thought it would keep longer but I guess I'll have to think about a better storage solution. Anyone else ever had that experience?
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Probably more about minor oxidation. The first bottle is almost always the best, and it just goes slowly downhill from there, unfortunately.
 
pmaster said:
I had the last beer of my last batch last night. I must say it has changed greatly, and not for the better sadly :( Its still very decent, quite good, but just not as awesome as it was in the beginning. I brewed the 1st batch probably 4 months ago, but its been a very hot summer and I haven't been able to store the beer anywhere very cold so it suffered through temperatures between 75-95F. I thought it would keep longer but I guess I'll have to think about a better storage solution. Anyone else ever had that experience?
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Edit: Aristotelian posted when I was in the middle of writin my answer below -

Could it possibly be oxidation?
I brewed mine in April and had problems with my auto syphon. Lots of air bubbles in the cane when bottling.
About 5 months later I'm starting to taste some oxidation.
I ended up with a 9.5% beer so that probably helped to protect it for so long.
I only have 5 bottles left so I should be able to polish them off before it becomes undrinkable ;)
 
I would say it gets better with age, not worse. IMO I would actually say the first bottle is the "worst," and in this case that's not a bad thing.
 
Hmm to be honest I have no clue what oxidation tastes like. I'm not too good to describe tastes, but I'd say it didn't have as much character, and tasted "bright" for lack of a better word. Anyhow the second batch is bottled, I will make sure to keep it as fresh as possible (should be easier since summer is pretty much over!).
 
Oxidation in a beer without any significant roasted malt tastes like wet cardboard. You will recognise it once it's there.

My beer did improve with time until the oxidation set in.
 
armenianbrewer said:
Updating on the above... took a sample on Sunday as it had been right around 2 weeks since brew day (in basement at 66-68 degrees).... 3711 never fails to ferment dry! It clocked in at about 1.004 and now I've moved it upstairs into my 2nd floor linen closet which gets up to 77-80 during the peak of these hot summer days when I'm not home... and starting to either notice CO2 escaping from the solution or 3711 is getting happy to clean up and finish off the rest of the sugars!

However, my hydrometer sample came out quite cloudy, which is different than when I brewed it the first time but the first time I brewed it I only sampled the FG at bottling which was about 5 weeks after brewing
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Bottled this yesterday to about 2.8 vols... and wow the sample tasted far more fruity/yeasty/phenolic and maybe even a little spicy after I moved it to the warmer location in my house for 2 weeks as prescribed in the original post... overall tastes quite complex but aroma appeared to be more yeasty than the first time I brewed it earlier this year...

Will be back in 2 weeks after it has some time to condition and carb up in the bottle!
 
Well, I just opened a bottle of my second batch. I'm really surprised, it tastes very different from the first. I get much more of an earthy taste, probably from the fuggles. I got that in some of my other brews, but usually its from the styrian goldings. I guess its not all that easy to get consistent results. Still a very good brew.
 
pmaster said:
Well, I just opened a bottle of my second batch. I'm really surprised, it tastes very different from the first. I get much more of an earthy taste, probably from the fuggles. I got that in some of my other brews, but usually its from the styrian goldings. I guess its not all that easy to get consistent results. Still a very good brew.
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How long has it been bottled for?
I would hold off on evaluating it for at least 6 weeks or so. IME, saisons change dramatically while conditioning and the yeast slowly settles. Mine will eb fully carbed in 2 weeks but taste completely different after 2 months. You may not have noticed the change with the first batch since you are now comparing your older bottle to this young "green" bottle
 
pmaster said:
Well, I just opened a bottle of my second batch. I'm really surprised, it tastes very different from the first. I get much more of an earthy taste, probably from the fuggles. I got that in some of my other brews, but usually its from the styrian goldings. I guess its not all that easy to get consistent results. Still a very good brew.
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I swore I replied to this earlier, maybe I never hit submit....
My experience is this beer is quite consistent, did you follow the same schedule for temps and times? That is one thing I do every batch, for all recipes.... And is a key I've found in the quest for repeatability. :mug:
 
azscoob said:
I swore I replied to this earlier, maybe I never hit submit....
My experience is this beer is quite consistent, did you follow the same schedule for temps and times? That is one thing I do every batch, for all recipes.... And is a key I've found in the quest for repeatability. :mug:
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Is it still consistent even if you use previous yeast slurries or few generation old 3711?
 
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1475064314.218853.jpg

Popped open my first bottle of my second batch of this recipe and it is fantastic! This is only two weeks into bottle conditioning but carbonation seems a lot better than my first attempt and this one came out much stronger in ABV than the first one. However the higher alcohol content does not detract from the flavor, it is still really good with a very lemony spicy and peppery characteristics. I think I'll be enjoying this one quite a bit as it conditions in a bottle even further
 
m00ps said:
How long has it been bottled for?
I would hold off on evaluating it for at least 6 weeks or so. IME, saisons change dramatically while conditioning and the yeast slowly settles. Mine will eb fully carbed in 2 weeks but taste completely different after 2 months. You may not have noticed the change with the first batch since you are now comparing your older bottle to this young "green" bottle
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Bottled for about 4 weeks. I remember tasting the old batch young as well and it just didn't have that strong earthy taste. I used the same Sorachi ace, since I had some remaining from last time (not as fresh though, it stayed in the freezer for maybe 2-3 months in a ziplock). But I used a different batch of fuggles with slightly lower AA if I recall correctly and used a bag for the hops. Fermentation went quite different too, it was much slower and constant compared to the first time.

I guess I'll see how it goes when I retry the recipe next time!
 
azscoob said:
I swore I replied to this earlier, maybe I never hit submit....
My experience is this beer is quite consistent, did you follow the same schedule for temps and times? That is one thing I do every batch, for all recipes.... And is a key I've found in the quest for repeatability. :mug:
Click to expand...

I was sure everything was identical...but I guess not otherwise the results would be too! Maybe the fuggles I used this time were stronger than last time, or the Sorachi ace was too old and didn't get to shine through...
 
How long have people aged this for? Mines been kegged since May, was hoping to have it for the summer but the house flooded and since then my kegerator has been out of use and out of the house so i have no way of chilling it to serve, even with a picnic tap. The bittles tasted great young and i found 1 a few weeks ago and it was better for sure. Just want some idea of other peoples experience with aging this beer. Thanks
 
I had a few bottles that I drank at about 15 months right before moving into a new house. I aged 1 gal on dregs from a few bottles of Goose Islands Sofie and the rest was with 3711. Both were excellent at the 15 month mark. The 3711 had just a touch of Saisons funk, some citrus notes and good dry finish. The Sofie bottles had some slight green apple flavor, cleaner funk, and good dry finish.
 
Kudos to the maker of this recipe. I followed your hop schedule. I cut the honey out as and used some brown sugar instead. I also used Golden Promise as the base malt instead of pilsner.

It turned out very good. Lots of esters and peppery notes. I did ferment it on the warmer side for the duration, really wanted to get a good idea of the esters of this yeast.

Boy, this yeast is truly a work horse. Fermented down to my target attenuation in just 7 days.

I may give it another go and use the pilsner as the recipe suggests, just to see the flavor impact. I'm a huge fan of golden promise and buy bulk to use it as my base grain in pretty much everything I make, so unless the pilsner version turns out that much better I probably won't make a long term switch when i do full batches.

Just recently discovered Saisons and looking to perfect my own recipe loosely modeled off of this.
 
IowaHomeBrewer said:
Kudos to the maker of this recipe. I followed your hop schedule. I cut the honey out as and used some brown sugar instead. I also used Golden Promise as the base malt instead of pilsner.

It turned out very good. Lots of esters and peppery notes. I did ferment it on the warmer side for the duration, really wanted to get a good idea of the esters of this yeast.

Boy, this yeast is truly a work horse. Fermented down to my target attenuation in just 7 days.

I may give it another go and use the pilsner as the recipe suggests, just to see the flavor impact. I'm a huge fan of golden promise and buy bulk to use it as my base grain in pretty much everything I make, so unless the pilsner version turns out that much better I probably won't make a long term switch when i do full batches.

Just recently discovered Saisons and looking to perfect my own recipe loosely modeled off of this.
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If you promise not to tell anyone my secret, I'll let you in on it..... I rarely use Pilsner malt anymore, I mostly use plain 2-row, used golden promise once after buying a sack for doing Scottish ales, and even used Munich malt as a base as well, it's all really good in this recipe!!!!!! :tank:
 
azscoob said:
If you promise not to tell anyone my secret, I'll let you in on it..... I rarely use Pilsner malt anymore, I mostly use plain 2-row, used golden promise once after buying a sack for doing Scottish ales, and even used Munich malt as a base as well, it's all really good in this recipe!!!!!! :tank:
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Gasp! Have you done a side by side tasting to compare?

Also, ever try adding a specialty malt to change it up? Maybe honey malt for example
 
Anyone ever make this with the imperial B64 napoleon yeast? Have it bubbling away now... Looking forward to it.
 
azscoob said:
If you promise not to tell anyone my secret, I'll let you in on it..... I rarely use Pilsner malt anymore, I mostly use plain 2-row, used golden promise once after buying a sack for doing Scottish ales, and even used Munich malt as a base as well, it's all really good in this recipe!!!!!! :tank:
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If you promise not to tell anyone, I've made this with both pilsner and two row. I've even made it splitting it 50/50. {To me} I can't tell enough of a difference for it to matter. It was amazing all three ways. :mug:
 
I made this yesterday BIAB.
I used 9lbs pilsner and 1.5lbs sugar (and ommitted the honey) to compensate for my poor effiency. I got an OG of 1.060 and will pitch Belle Saison this morning
 
Just brewed a double batch of this today for my friend's first brew. Hit 1.060 on the dot. Only switched from honey to sugar to test for any differences and my hops were slightly higher AA so I should be around 40 IBUs. If it's half as good as last time, it'll be a hit!

Might dry hop with sage, rosemary, or thyme for my half. Does anyone have experience with herbs in this recipe?
 
This is my go to saison, but getting tired of 3711. Just pitched omega saisonstein and will update on differences. Fermenting at 72.
 
Brewed this at the end of August using Belle Saison. Life got in the way, and didn't bottle until this past Monday (10/24). OG was 1.064...down to 1.002. Hydro sample was tasty, but I thought there was a hint of peat, almost like Scotch. Don't recall that taste the last time I brewed this.

Will report back in a couple of weeks on whether the taste remains.
 
danok1 said:
Brewed this at the end of August using Belle Saison. Life got in the way, and didn't bottle until this past Monday (10/24). OG was 1.064...down to 1.002. Hydro sample was tasty, but I thought there was a hint of peat, almost like Scotch. Don't recall that taste the last time I brewed this.

Will report back in a couple of weeks on whether the taste remains.
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It sounds like what I experienced... An earthy taste?
It didn't happen to me the first time around so I guess I did something different between the two times
 
stever1000 said:
I made this yesterday BIAB.
I used 9lbs pilsner and 1.5lbs sugar (and ommitted the honey) to compensate for my poor effiency. I got an OG of 1.060 and will pitch Belle Saison this morning
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Hit 1.002 today... still making progress :mug:
 
pmaster said:
It sounds like what I experienced... An earthy taste?
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I wouldn't describe it as "earthy," but "peaty." As I said, it reminded me a bit of Scotch (a blended, watered-down Scotch).

I may try one this weekend. Belle Saison seems to be an aggressive yeast (active fermentation appeared to be done in 4 days), so I wouldn't be at all surprised to find that carbonation has already reached an acceptable level.

-Dan
 
A friend brewed a big batch of saison and split it among yeasts (3711 was not among them). Of the yeasts he used, I like the belle saison the best. It's got good spice, but with a strong clove undercurrent.
 
tellyho said:
A friend brewed a big batch of saison and split it among yeasts (3711 was not among them). Of the yeasts he used, I like the belle saison the best. It's got good spice, but with a strong clove undercurrent.
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Nice, I have a pack of Belle Saison I need to use before it goes out of date.
What temperature did he ferment at?
 
Going to rebrew with almost the same malt build but going to try belle for the first time and use mosaic or mandarina hops haven't decided yet haven't tried either one of those hops
 
I'd say use mandarina to complement the light esters produced by belle season. I've come to dislike using mosaic in beers that finish very dry (like this one) because it lends too sharp of a hop flavor. It might be better in a beer backed up with some maltiness.
 

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