Cold Crashing BEFORE Secondary

[MatchstickBrewingCo.]

So I brewed an IPA outside after work last night for the first time in a while. Since the temp was in the 30's and it was midnight by the time we finished up I think I was too tired and cold to think clearly. Which led me to pour the entire kettle into the fermenter with the hops, hot and cold break.

Since I realize this was dumb but it's too late to fix I've been thinking about what to do to minimize my mistakes.

I've been thinking that maybe I should let it ferment in primary until it stops bubbling, cold crash it, then rack it (off the huge amount of trub I expect to have) to secondary and bring heat back up to about 66.

I have a ferm chamber so temps aren't a problem. But does anybody have any experience with anything like this or have any other ideas on how to stop this beer from being an extremely hazy particle mess in the bottle???

 

[m1k3]

You could have cold crashed or at least let it settle over night and then pitch in the morning.

But it sounds like you have pitched yeast.

At this point you need to wait until fermentation is complete and the yeast has flocked.

If you plan to dry hop in secondary, I see no problem cold crashing prior to that.
Just rack with minimal O2 pick up. Or even purge the secondary fermenter with CO2 if you can. That is because the yeast will not be as active after cold crashing (and will not pick up the extra oxygen introduced as readily). Not that IPA is a a beer type you'd age.

At any rate... the beer should still be great.

 

[Homercidal]

You could have cold crashed or at least let it settle over night and then pitch in the morning.

But it sounds like you have pitched yeast.

At this point you need to wait until fermentation is complete and the yeast has flocked.

If you plan to dry hop in secondary, I see no problem cold crashing prior to that.
Just rack with minimal O2 pick up. Or even purge the secondary fermenter with CO2 if you can. That is because the yeast will not be as active after cold crashing (and will not pick up the extra oxygen introduced as readily). Not that IPA is a a beer type you'd age.

At any rate... the beer should still be great.

+1. It will be fine. The hops and gunk will settle out pretty quick and not affect the beer too much. MANY people ferment with all of the stuff still in the primary.

I would recommend a secondary as soon as the primary ferment is over and let it sit maybe a couple of days before cold crashing. The secondary is more to just make bottling easier since there will be less gunk at the bottom that can get sucked up into the bottle bucket.

 

[Jaybird]

Let it ferment! Forget about it for a couple weeks. Let the yeast do their job and then flock and then continue to do their job. Yes you can cold crash before secondary but I would personally wait till the beer is finished fermenting, transfer to secondary, wait a few days then start the cold crash. I am in the club of slow crash. If I am going to crash a beer I do it over several days dropping the temps 5-6 deg a day. By the time I am at 40 deg or so the beer is clear as a bell and ready for gas or a bottle.

Just my process and .02

Cheers
Jay

 

[JustLooking]

IPA so dry hopping? Yes, cold crash primary (after reaching final gravity and holding there for a couple of days.) Transfer cold to secondary with dry hops. Allow to raise back to your fermentation temperature for a few days before cold crashing again.

 

[MatchstickBrewingCo.]

Ok great, thanks for your input guys!

Another question regarding this brew day though. I tried to take a gravity reading but I'm suspecting that all the hop and break particles would make the reading inaccurate. Is that right? because it seemed about 10 points higher than I had planned for.

The mash temp was a little lower than I had planned though, would that have anything to do with it? My mash temp was supposed to be 149 but was about 148.6 after mashing in and after an hour in the kettle mashing, was down to like 139.

 

[JustLooking]

With a lower mash temperature you sometimes have to mash longer to get full conversion, depending on crush.

I usually leave my hydrometer in the test tube over night to get a final reading after everything has settled.

 

[kombat]

IPA so dry hopping? Yes, cold crash primary (after reaching final gravity and holding there for a couple of days.) Transfer cold to secondary with dry hops. Allow to raise back to your fermentation temperature for a few days before cold crashing again.

+1

This is exactly what I do for my IPAs. I also add gelatin for extra clarity. The problem is that gelatin can strip out precious hop aroma infused during dry hopping. So my IPA schedule is:

1. Ferment in primary at 60-65°F for 14-21 days.
2. Replace airlock with sanitized foil. Move carboy into fridge to cold crash for 2 days.
3. Add gelatin mixture. Wait 3-5 more days.
4. While still cold, carefully rack clear beer to smaller, 5 gallon carboy, with minimal agitation, and being careful to leave as much trub behind as possible.
5. Leave the carboy at room temperature to warm up. Add dry hops. Affix airlock. Wait 7 more days.
6. Replace airlock with sanitized foil. Move carboy into fridge to cold crash again. No gelatin this time. Wait 3-5 days.
7. Rack to keg, purge with CO2, begin carbing.

The beer will still be a little hazy, but it's hop-haze, not chill haze or residual yeast, so the flavour contribution is totally different (and much more pleasant, IMHO). Also, it's to style. IPAs are allowed to be a little hazy, owing to the high hop content.

 

[Homercidal]

Ok great, thanks for your input guys!

Another question regarding this brew day though. I tried to take a gravity reading but I'm suspecting that all the hop and break particles would make the reading inaccurate. Is that right? because it seemed about 10 points higher than I had planned for.

The mash temp was a little lower than I had planned though, would that have anything to do with it? My mash temp was supposed to be 149 but was about 148.6 after mashing in and after an hour in the kettle mashing, was down to like 139.

Particulate matter does not affect a hydrometer reading. That stuff is floating in the wort just like the hydrometer is. Gravity readings are temp sensitive, as temperature affects wort density. It could be you measured too warm or too cold. 10 points is a fair amount though.

It's likely a problem with volumes or efficiency. (not a problem in this case, but just an unexpected reading.)

Mashing low will yield a more fermentable wort and likely lead to a somewhat drier beer. It's not likely to affect mash efficiency as far as I know, at least not much. A lot of recipes will call out for a 70% efficiency when determining the grain bill. If you got 82% instead (totally possible) then you might have needed a little less grain. Over a 60 minute mash you should get full conversion unless the pH was way off.

Losing 10 points of temp over an hour is not optimum. Your initial temp reading was likely still dropping due to either the mass of the cooler or mash tun warming up from the mash, or from heat loss in a BIAB kettle. No biggie. You will settle in on a good temp after some practice. With a 48 Quart cooler I lose maybe 1-2 points of temp depending on the volume of the mash. A bigger mash volume provides more thermal mass and hence can give up more heat without dropping temp overall. Consider the thermal mass of the mash vs the thermal mass of your mash tun. The bigger the mash the more heat it can give up before dropping temp.

You can preheat the mash tun with some hot water to minimize this, or just use a higher strike water temp to compensate. My current favorite method is to strike a bit higher and then add ice cubes to the mash to drop it down into range. Give about 5 minutes to stir and let the mash tun absorb at much heat at is can, then measure and add ice if necessary. It's always easier to drop temp than to raise it (In an unheated mash tun...)

 

[MatchstickBrewingCo.]

Kombat, thanks for the schedule that seems perfect. Just one clarification though, you put the gelatin in AFTER the carboy has been cold crashing for 2 days?

 

[MatchstickBrewingCo.]

Homercidal, yeah I figured I was going to get a good amount of temp loss during mash but I guess I didn't figure THAT much. I was just using the kettle as the mash tun since I don't have one yet. This was actually my first partial mash brew so you live and you learn. Thanks again!

 

[kombat]

Kombat, thanks for the schedule that seems perfect. Just one clarification though, you put the gelatin in AFTER the carboy has been cold crashing for 2 days?

Yes, that's correct. Gelatin is much more effective when the beer is already cold, so I don't want to add it while the beer is still warm (but in the fridge) and have all the gelatin sink to the bottom before the beer fully cools down and precipitates the very chill haze that the gelatin is intended to pull down with it.

 

[Homercidal]

Homercidal, yeah I figured I was going to get a good amount of temp loss during mash but I guess I didn't figure THAT much. I was just using the kettle as the mash tun since I don't have one yet. This was actually my first partial mash brew so you live and you learn. Thanks again!

If you are able, check temp about 4 times and turn on the low heat now and again to maintain the temp. I do that when I BIAB on the stovetop. Some people wrap a towel and a blanket around it to help hold in the heat and I think most don't need to reheat that way.

 

[MatchstickBrewingCo.]

Still trying to figure out how I got such a high OG and I was thinking, would using a qt/lb of over 2.25 effect things this way? I mashed with 4 gallons of water and about 8.75 lb of grain. Are there any other side effects (good or bad) of doing a mash with that ratio so high? Would that in combination of the low mash temps give me more of an efficiency? Will that effect the taste of the final product negatively?

 

[Yooper]

Still trying to figure out how I got such a high OG and I was thinking, would using a qt/lb of over 2.25 effect things this way? I mashed with 4 gallons of water and about 8.75 lb of grain. Are there any other side effects (good or bad) of doing a mash with that ratio so high? Would that in combination of the low mash temps give me more of an efficiency? Will that effect the taste of the final product negatively?

The only issue I know with a thin mash may be a too-high mash pH, depending on your water. Otherwise, it shouldn't affect anything.

Just for the record, I usually have a ton of hops debris and cold break in my fermenter (I have a CFC and no way to strain it) and my beers are ultra clear. I don't cold crash or anything, either- gravity does all the work. Your beer will be fine.

 

[MindenMan]

I don't have an insulated mash tun either. I mash in my BK covered with a jacket or blanket. After boiling, I cool as low as is practical, and put my wort through a double thickness paint strainer into my fermenter. There is still a very small amount of "silt" that gets through, but after fermentation stops, I cold crash for 3 or 4 days, and rack clear beer into bottling bucket.

 

[m00ps]

Still trying to figure out how I got such a high OG and I was thinking, would using a qt/lb of over 2.25 effect things this way? I mashed with 4 gallons of water and about 8.75 lb of grain. Are there any other side effects (good or bad) of doing a mash with that ratio so high? Would that in combination of the low mash temps give me more of an efficiency? Will that effect the taste of the final product negatively?

I've had enough particulate matter in a sample that it definitely affected the reading. I could tell because the hydrometer just sank and stopped, no bobbing up and down. It was like it got stuck in quicksand. If there is enough particulate matter that it makes a trub cake at the bottom of your sample tube, the hydrometer will jsut sit on top of it. I think my reading was like 1.110 when theres no way it couldve been above 1.060

Low mash temps will affect the FG more than the OG. I think it actually takes longer to extract sugars with lower temps, but the resulting wort is much more fermentable (=lower FG). Either way, i doubt itll affect the final product too much. Id worry more if the FG was very off

 

[C-Rider]

Shoots, it's an IPA Forget the secondary. Let it ferment about 3 weeks, then dry hop a week and then cold crash 3-4 days. Watch what you are doing keep the siphon tube off the bottom and the amt of junk you pick up will be at a minimum if any. Set your fermenter under a good light when racking so you can see what's going on w/the end of the siphon. Why make life difficult w/a secondary?

 

[AndrewMBrew]

I agree with C-Rider. I've brewed many awesome IPAs without straining. I also dry hop without bags in the primary. It is the same concept. You can cold crash and rack carefully, or use a grain bag to strain the siphon. I've done both. I prefer just racking carefully.