BruControl: Brewery control & automation software

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Kmo4040 said:
The one you recommend seems only to go 50A. Do you know of any that goes to 60A?
Click to expand...
I built a 120a panel and am using 2 of the 50a current sensors Brundog recommended. The specs seem to indicate it does in fact measure more than 50 amps of draw though I won't know until I have it in use
I looked through many pages of specs on different units but found only a few that might work..
I found the 50 cr magnetics ones with mount for like $17 if I remember correctly on amazon.. Ebay also had a could used ones.
 
augiedoggy said:
I built a 120a panel and am using 2 of the 50a current sensors Brundog recommended. The specs seem to indicate it does in fact measure more than 50 amps of draw though I won't know until I have it in use
I looked through many pages of specs on different units but found only a few that might work..
I found the 50 cr magnetics ones with mount for like $17 if I remember correctly on amazon.. Ebay also had a could used ones.
Click to expand...
This is the one I found it cost quite a bit more $55.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00KMRO3YA/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
 
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Kmo4040 said:
Update: I've tried everything I can think of. I removed the screwshield, and tried a second W5100. The lights respond to network traffic. I'm not having any issues flashing the firmware or configuring the network settings. I truly believe it is an issue with the W5100 transmit pin. My network will not recognize it. I can not ping it. I will order the W5500 and let you know how it goes.
Click to expand...

The W5500 came in today. I flashed the mega and programmed the network settings now all is well.
IMG_20180531_191002.png

I will buy a few more, they are getting harder to find.
 
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BrunDog said:
I would be careful putting more than 50A through a 50A unit. If the max output is not capped at 5 V, you could overload your analog input pin.
Click to expand...
good to note. with the design changes I made I really shouldnt ever pull more than 50 amp through each circuit.

Brundog,
On an unrelated note... Im using the output from the arduino to to control up to 4 ssrs at a time should I be concerned about the MA output not being enough? I have been wondering if I should use a single smaller arduino SSR board with a 2a SSR to power the other groups of solid state relays? the control current of the ssrs im using are each rated at 5-25MA. With the other inputs and outputs do you think ill be overtaxing my mega?
 
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augiedoggy said:
I built a 120a panel and am using 2 of the 50a current sensors Brundog recommended. The specs seem to indicate it does in fact measure more than 50 amps of draw though I won't know until I have it in use
I looked through many pages of specs on different units but found only a few that might work..
I found the 50 cr magnetics ones with mount for like $17 if I remember correctly on amazon.. Ebay also had a could used ones.
Click to expand...

Kmo4040 said:
This is the one I found it cost quite a bit more $55.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00KMRO3YA/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
Click to expand...

Found a cheaper one: http://a.co/0bGdo4p ~$29
 
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Brundog, I have a question and please forgive if it’s dumb.
Is it possible to connect the BruControl host straight to lets say a Mega with the ethernet shield using a crossover cable?
Reason is, my comcrap internet is on and off multiple times a day which includes very piss poor signal most of the time, this is not related to the location, I mean the actual speed from comcrap, so back to the question, my comp is inside in the a/c, my kegerator and brew area is in the garage, I really don’t want to keep the comp out there connected via usb, but wireless and wired internet is unreliable and slow, so I was wondering about kinda bastardizing the two?
Anyone try this?
 
bdogg171 said:
Brundog, I have a question and please forgive if it’s dumb.
Is it possible to connect the BruControl host straight to lets say a Mega with the ethernet shield using a crossover cable?
Reason is, my comcrap internet is on and off multiple times a day which includes very piss poor signal most of the time, this is not related to the location, I mean the actual speed from comcrap, so back to the question, my comp is inside in the a/c, my kegerator and brew area is in the garage, I really don’t want to keep the comp out there connected via usb, but wireless and wired internet is unreliable and slow, so I was wondering about kinda bastardizing the two?
Anyone try this?
Click to expand...

You could use a cheap switch: http://a.co/8P3WqoJ

Just remember since you are not using a router, you must assign both the computer and the arduino, static ip's on the same network. I'm not a fan of crossover cables.
 
augiedoggy said:
good to note. with the design changes I made I really shouldnt ever pull more than 50 amp through each circuit.

Brundog,
On an unrelated note... Im using the output from the arduino to to control up to 4 ssrs at a time should I be concerned about the MA output not being enough? I have been wondering if I should use a single smaller arduino SSR board with a 2a SSR to power the other groups of solid state relays? the control current of the ssrs im using are each rated at 5-25MA. With the other inputs and outputs do you think ill be overtaxing my mega?
Click to expand...

Sorry for the delay... dang notifications have stopped working on the app for some reason.

I would measure the current required by your specific SSRs. So long as 15mA or less, I wouldn’t sweat it. Quality SSRs don’t draw much.

There are two separate considerations: 1. Current per pin (and per pin bank) and 2. Current per supply. The first is documented on the website and on Arduino spec sheets etc. if each pin is around 5mA you need not worry much unless you have a ton of them. The second one is a bigger concern IMO as the 5V regulator on the MEGA only has about 200mA to give beyond the board. This means any shields which use power plus any pins you source current out of will need to stay under this limit. A simple way to work around this is to sink rather than source... meaning use active low outputs rather than active high. For SSRs for example, you could wire one side to positive voltage then tie the ground side to the pin and use an active low output. Problem is we don’t have active low on all the output based algorithms yet.

We are working on a universal shield - we are prototyping one for the ESP32 right now, then will build one for the Due (comparable to the MEGA).
 
bdogg171 said:
Brundog, I have a question and please forgive if it’s dumb.
Is it possible to connect the BruControl host straight to lets say a Mega with the ethernet shield using a crossover cable?
Reason is, my comcrap internet is on and off multiple times a day which includes very piss poor signal most of the time, this is not related to the location, I mean the actual speed from comcrap, so back to the question, my comp is inside in the a/c, my kegerator and brew area is in the garage, I really don’t want to keep the comp out there connected via usb, but wireless and wired internet is unreliable and slow, so I was wondering about kinda bastardizing the two?
Anyone try this?
Click to expand...

No questions are dumb! Yes I would assume you could go direct Ethernet without a router. I haven’t tested it but it should be capable.

That said you don’t need Internet in order for an interface to connect to BC. The router (or switch) should connect two devices even though access to the internet is intermittent.
 
BrunDog the W5500 works flawlessly. I don't know if anyone else had problems with the W5100 (511 models), but if so you might want to mention it in your website, or manual. Thanks
 
Kmo4040 said:
BrunDog the W5500 works flawlessly. I don't know if anyone else had problems with the W5100 (511 models), but if so you might want to mention it in your website, or manual. Thanks
Click to expand...

Ok thanks for the info. I will add the link to the documentation or make sure any source recommendations are valid!
 
@bdogg171 - Like BrunDog stated, as long as the comcast router is up and operational, so basically the internal house network is up, you would be good to go as device to device communication is all that is needed and not constant internet. However if the comcast equipment itself is crapping out on you, then you will need a hub, switch, router, or crossover cable.

I brew in my garage and was an early adapter to BruControl, well at least early when I purchased everything! At that point in time wired was recommended as it was not known if the wireless would be stable enough. I didn't feel like dropping $50 or $60 on one of those wireless extenders that also have a wired port on it so I just used an old switch that I do not use anymore not connected to my home network, which is almost like using a crossover cable. I have my Mega set to a static address which is DHCP reserved on my router, and I did the same for my laptop that I run BruControl on.

Just remember that unless things have changed with BruControl, you will need to periodically put the machine that runs BruControl on your home network to validate licensing.
 
Thanks folks, I do have an extra switch I had forgotten about so it looks like that’s solved.
 
BrunDog said:
Problem is we don’t have active low on all the output based algorithms yet.
Click to expand...

BrunDog could you elaborate on this, I think that is how I was planning to do my build. Do you now which ones do and which ones don't?

Thanks
 
Ok so you folks are going to make me be the guinea pig, ok I’m game lol. I would like to hear if Brundog sees any reason why one of those wouldn’t work in BruControl though?
 
bdogg171 said:
Ok so you folks are going to make me be the guinea pig, ok I’m game lol. I would like to hear if Brundog sees any reason why one of those wouldn’t work in BruControl though?
Click to expand...
I would love to see if it works, I can't find the W5500 shield for less than $23 shipped. I would prefer this for $12.
 
Sorry for the delay guys... Digital outputs and Hysteresis have active low. Duty and PID % would need to be inverted - we will need to fix that in BC which is easy to do.

Regarding boards versus shields... it’s no problem as long as they are wired correctly. The firmware communicates to the Ethernet module via the SPI bus, so whether it’s wired via vertical pins like the shield or short length wires matters not.
 
augiedoggy said:
The electrician should be putting in my 60a circuits today at the brewpub... getting excited to get this thing operational and also anxiously anticipating the release of version 1.1.
Click to expand...

Whats your plan for heating your kettle and how much power are you directing to it? Using multiple 5500watt elements I assume (given the 60a circuits)?
 
asparknz said:
Whats your plan for heating your kettle and how much power are you directing to it? Using multiple 5500watt elements I assume (given the 60a circuits)?
Click to expand...
(4) 5500w elements in each kettle and 4400w worth of elements in my rims. When the rims is on ,one of the elements in the HLT goes off. We are currently limited to a small 200a single phase service. Technically I could have run the rims elements each off one circuit along with 2 elements off each at the same time but I wanted to have room for the pumps and such as well as not maxing out power.
 
Hi all,

Some amazing stuff in this thread! I'm planning to get back into brewing after a 4 year hiatus (kids, life, etc.). I was initially planning to build a simple EBIAB kettle/controller by upgrading my 120v RIMS PID enclosure with 240v contactors and wiring, but then I saw this thread and my mind exploded. Now I'm thinking of doing a full 50-amp 2-element panel running Brucontrol. I'm still thinking that I'll start with a single-vessel recirculating EBIAB (with optional on-demand sparge water a la Brundog's setup). One of the major appeals of Brucontrol is that if I decide to add a second (or even third) kettle down the road, I have the flexibility to do so. I've started ordering the parts for my panel, and I'll download and play with Brucontrol once I have something for the software to connect to...

Thanks!
-Adam
 
Thanks Brundog. To start, is there a free and/or easy piece of software for drawing wiring diagrams? The 50 amp diagram on the brucontrol website is a great reference, but I want to diagram the exact wiring I’ll be doing, both to let the experts here on hbt review, and for my own reference.
 
Courtesy of @BrunDog, I modified the 50A wiring diagram on the Brucontrol website to reflect my anticipated modifications: using relays instead of SSRs for handling all of the non-element switching, adding a couple of pressure sensors to measure volumes, and adding a power select relay to run the RIMs tube element at either 120v/1375W or 240v/5500W. I also leave the DC power active on an E-Stop condition to maintain power to the Arduino, something that @GParkins (and others, I'm sure) will disagree with, based on my reading of this thread and and his build thread.

Please let me know if there's anything obvious that I screwed up. I'd clearly much rather catch errors here rather than when building/testing.

Thanks!
-Adam
 

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I didn't review the changes, but there is no problem using electromechanical relays instead of SSRs for non-element switching in brewing.

I know I advocated Hi/Low power switching in RIMs applications, but I created it in my previous control system and feel is this is unecessary with BruControl. Reason: you can set your PID "Max Output %" dynamically via a script, effectively turning a 240VAC element into a 120VAC one. Just set this to 100% for full power operation or 25% for simulated "120VAC" operation. This would provide less hardware, wiring, etc., and at this point I don't see any reason for it. I have tested my rig that way and it works just fine. I am actually considering removing it to simplify and remove a potential failure point.

I also leave my DC power on during an E-Stop. An E-stop's primary function is to prevent injury to people. I honestly don't see a downside with this as it is low power. There is nothing outside the control system that can hurt a person when my E-stop is selected as only 24V is exposed external to the enclosure. I have no issue with it and I'm down with a good ol' fashioned internet forum throwdown with @GParkins are anyone else on the topic!
 
Thanks for the feedback BrunDog. I'll rough out the parts in the panel once they arrive; if I'm feeling like things are a bit tight I'm glad to know that the power relay is probably unnecessary.

Your response regarding the E-Stop and DC power configuration raises another couple of questions: in your rig, the E-Stop terminates the 24V power supply? I had planned to use 12V valves so I didn't have to install an additional DC power supply, but that means that I will have some components outside of the enclosure that have power in the event of an e-stop, which I hadn't thought through. Your approach is safer, and I think worth the additional trouble of having another power supply in the enclosure (maybe I'll ditch the power relay after all). Other than this marginal safety benefit, is there any other benefit to going with 24V for the valves?

Thanks again!

Edited to add updated drawings with a 24V supply.
 

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I have three DC power supplies in my personal rig. These were added as a result of upgrades along the way. All three remain live in E-stop. My valves are 24V. So in E-stop situation the valves continue to receive 24V power, the flowmeter and pressure sensors continue to receive 5V power, etc. again I have no problem with this as there is no need to kill external DC low voltage DC power in E-Stop.

Depending on your valve selection you probably don’t want them switching in an E-Stop, so that’s something to consider. I selected 24V for them since the proportional valve I use only comes in 24V version. But you could easily build a rig with 12V power only.
 
Ok, so in your opinion the 12v (or 24v) load that’s exposed outside the panel via the valves is safe enough that it’s ok for the valves to remain powered in an E-Stop? In that case I’d probably stick with the 12v supply.
I think all of the valves I'm looking at accept 9v-24v, so I can always add a 24v circuit in the future if I need to.

Another question: in your opinion, should I also put an additional 5v DC supply in there or does the MEGA have the capacity to run the 5v circuits? Re-checking the diagram, it seems like there’s not really much current being drawn on the 5v circuit.
 
I totally believe that 24V (or 12 or 5) out to the sensors and devices beyond the enclosure is fin in an E-Stop. Certainly capable of producing a fire in the right circumstances but not going to electrocute anyone.

The MEGA has a 5V regulator that can supply about 200mA of current. You need to calculate if you will approach or exceed that for shields, I/O, sensors, etc. If you will, I suggest you add a dedicated 5V supply. I can't speculate until I know exactly the I/O on your system.
 
Just curious if it's possible to use a NodeMCU (or Wemos D1, for that matter) to add WiFi connectivity to the MEGA, or if I need to get the WINC1500 shield from Adafruit. I have several 8266 wireless micro-controllers hanging around from other projects, so if I could put one to use here that'd be great. If not, NBD, I'll just go with the officially supported hardware.

Thanks!
 
Hi. At this time, we do not have that capability. We had considered making devices "pass-through" capable, but as of yet have not added that ability. Still focusing on 1.1... then more firmware improvements.
 
Thanks for the response BrunDog. My panel parts are mostly here, so soon it'll be time to start dry fitting and then cutting/assembling/wiring! I'm hopeful that I can fit the components without too many compromises, but the enclosure I bought is probably too small (15.5"x12"x4.5"), and I may have to return it. I have to say the description of the enclosure was pretty misleading, as it was supposedly 17x14x6. Boo to that.
 

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