BruControl: Brewery control & automation software

[DonWMason]

Hi Don. Trying to duplicate this... are you still having the problem with firmware v46D?

That's a coincidence. I was just going to start up the panel to continue testing. As of last week I was still having the problem.

Here's my config changes:

Sometime in early September I upgraded to BruControl 7/31/2022 release. At the same time I upgrade to firmware 45O. Everything seemed to be working. I edited my my config file to set the Wiring Map to "Ethernet_FW_v46" and renumbered the analog devices. All analog devices and digital outputs worked correctly during a test.

A couple of weeks ago, I upgrade firmware to 46D. I also downloaded BruControl again and updated it. Ever since this point, I have unreliable digital outputs. On startup, I have a script that closes all valves and I can hear valves moving. What's happening is some portion of the ports are opening but the BruControl devices show them as closed State = Off. If I click on one the devices, BruControl shows State = On without any noise from the valve (so I know it's open already). If I click again, the valve can be heard to close and the BruControl shows State = Off. Sometimes another digital output will trigger State = On but this NEVER happened before in six months of prior use.

I was going to test this one more time in an hour. Let me know if you'd like to participate.

 

[BrunDog]

OK thanks. With the "Ethernet_FW_v46" interface map used, you should use 45Q without any issues.

For 46D, I am hearing your experience is not isolated. I tried to duplicate it on the bench but could not. So my ask is that we recreate the problem, then start disabling other devices up to the point the problem goes away, if at all. If we can't duplicate it, we cant figure out how to fix it as you know.

 

[DonWMason]

OK thanks. With the "Ethernet_FW_v46" interface map used, you should use 45Q without any issues.

For 46D, I am hearing your experience is not isolated. I tried to duplicate it on the bench but could not. So my ask is that we recreate the problem, then start disabling other devices up to the point the problem goes away, if at all. If we can't duplicate it, we cant figure out how to fix it as you know.

Oops, I meant 45Q in my previous post.

I can say the specific digital ports that act up is random.

Is there any difference in the firmware initialization of 46D from 45Q? It really seems like the MEGA is (randomly) misreading port statuses on startup with 46D.

I'll test 46D while I'm still on it. I can record which ports act up on startup. I can do this 2-3 times to see if it's really random or if there's a pattern I haven't noticed yet.

Afterwards, I'm going back to 45Q first to make sure things are still working on that version.

 

[BrunDog]

We changed the internal active port database to improve memory. 45Q uses the prior database with the new map, whereas 46 uses the new database with the new map.

Hate to hear "random"... that and microcontrollers don't go hand-in-hand, lol.

 

[oakbarn]

Long road but I am finally wiring my brewery. I have my stand built and in place and wire chases made for my various wires. I am running all the 110/220m vac in their own chase. I am running all my valve wire ( 12 vdc control wires) in their own chase. I will also run some of my 10 K NTC probes along with the valve wiring (but I do not have to). I also have two 4-20 ma flow meters (SM6004) that have 4 wires. I may need to make an extension for those wires and would solder splice to those leads. I plan to run them with the valve wires. Any time the valve wire bundles cross the AC, they are at 90 degrees.

My general questions:

1. Am I correct in running the 4-20 ma along with the 12 vdc valve control wires?
2. Am I correct in running the 10 K NTC probe wire along with the 12 vdc valve control wires?
3. Can I simply splice the 4-20 ma wires?

 

[RiverCityBrewer]

1) 4-20 is more robust since EMI via voltage induction does not affect current measurement the same way, so you should be fine.
2) Yes it will be fine.
3) Yes you can splice them, it's done routinely in industry when loop powering devices so no worries there either.

Cheers,
Joe

 

[oakbarn]

Thanks for the quick response. I will start running the wires this afternoon. I have 20 valves (12 or 24 vdc control along with independent 12 vdc for LEDs), 5 pumps, 2 ignitors, 10 temp probes, 2 gas valves (12 vdc). 2 flow meter (4-20 ma) 4 heating elements and one pressure volume sensor all requiring wiring. Some of the wiring is already installed or will be above my vessels ( some of the temp probes) I have 5 hot side vessels and all have tippy stands ( mash tun and two brew kettles are bottom drain as well). I had a BCS brewery before, but BruControl has allowed me much more control and automation!

 

[BrunDog]

Just posted v46F... this version fixes an issue where digital outputs were erroneously turning on across incorrect ports. 46F also reports 1-wire device addresses over debug during bus resets, per @clearwaterbrewer's request.

For MEGA and GC interfaces, remember not to update to 45Q or 46F without changing your wiring maps in BC. This requires manually editing your configuration file if you do not want to erase all your configured devices on that interface. Instructions above.

 

[Zartinem]

I’m just curious are the ESP32 S3 boards usable as an interface option?

 

[BrunDog]

Yes, we have the FW working. Might need some testing on all the pins, but we can publish a beta version for anyone willing to take the plunge.

I think this will be the micro to beat! Given the I/O and other features, it will have a lot of runway for the future.

 

[Zartinem]

Yes, we have the FW working. Might need some testing on all the pins, but we can publish a beta version for anyone willing to take the plunge.

I think this will be the micro to beat! Given the I/O and other features, it will have a lot of runway for the future.

I would take the plunge!

 

[aeviaanah]

I have a bunch of cheap PT100s and some of them arrive DOA or simply stop working after being in service. Rather than buying new housing, stem etc can I just replace the sensor itself (resistor?). Does anyone know a link to a part that might fit here?

The ceramic insulators are around 3/16" OD and the sensor itself around 1/8" OD. Total wire length needs to be around 10" to hook back up to terminals

 

[BrunDog]

I have a bunch of cheap PT100s and some of them arrive DOA or simply stop working after being in service. Rather than buying new housing, stem etc can I just replace the sensor itself (resistor?). Does anyone know a link to a part that might fit here?

The ceramic insulators are around 3/16" OD and the sensor itself around 1/8" OD. Total wire length needs to be around 10" to hook back up to terminals

Yes, you should be able to replace the sensor, assuming that is truly what is failing. You should test the leads with a meter to verify. Same color wires should be ~1 ohms or less and different color wires should be ~100 ohms. Nothing should be low impedance to ground.

 

[oakbarn]

FYI:

I do not need any help as I solved my issue.

I upgraded my Grand Central to 46F which did fix a problem with UNI Digital Outs being on when no called for, but it also changed the Network Setting on the board.


I had the following settings prior to upgrade:

MAC:6E:7B:81:59:B2:93
IP:192.168.0.160
GW:192.168.0.1
SN:255.255.255.0

After I upgraded the Firmware I had:
I had the following settings:

MAC:------------------
IP: 255.255.255.0
GW: 255.255.255.0
SN: 255.255.255.0

I redid the setup and it is fine .


MAC:6E:7B:81:59:B2:93
IP:192.168.0.160
GW:192.168.0.1
SN:255.255.255.0

 

[clearwaterbrewer]

We can add a control code to show you the addresses of the indexed sensors. Not sure that helps you right now but it’s easy enough.

I had my latest batch of 1-wire probe assemblies (1 probe per meter with 5m lead, 9m total length) made with the individual probe addresses enumerated, being able to statically assign 1-wire addresses would be really nice!

 

[Chokpish]

Unishield Question : input to the unishield is 24vdc, output of onboard converter is set at 5.0vdc. I would like to power VA or VB with 5 vdc from pin VCC or VR.
- what is the max amp draw from VR or VCC?

 

[Chokpish]

…or would it be safer to use a dedicated 5VDC supply? In my scenario, I intend to use 4 analog outputs via D pins to the analog amp for my proportional SSR’s.

 

[oakbarn]

Unishield Question : input to the unishield is 24vdc, output of onboard converter is set at 5.0vdc. I would like to power VA or VB with 5 vdc from pin VCC or VR.
- what is the max amp draw from VR or VCC?

If powering an analog amp for PWM, would you not use the P Pins? For a Mega, they have the 5 vdc max you are looking for. I am not sure you can even use the D Pins for PWM.

 

[Chokpish]

Thanks for the suggestion Oakbarn; I just went with a 5.0 vdc to V+ on the AA-2 from the Unishield.

Odd scenario: I have pwm input from the Unishield, linked to a PID Element on Brucontrol. When Element is at 100%, the AA-2 input reads 5.0 vdc. When Element is at 50%, AA-2 input reads approx 2.5VDC, all good.

At the output of AA-2, I read 4.93vdc regardless of input voltage. As if the AA-2 output is always at 100%…

Any idea?

 

[oakbarn]

Have you exactly followed the instruction for the AA-2?

AA-2 Instructions

The v+ voltage has nothing to do with the output voltage. I use some of my 12 vdc for the v+.


Be aware that the V+ on the IN side and the V+ on the OUT side are the same voltage. This is provided for ease of wiring and the current to power other devices if required and NOT the Analog Control Voltage.

 

[Chokpish]

Ok, I think Igot it figured out. I now have 24vdc on V+ of AA-2. I adjusted AA-2 outputs to 5.0vdc max. When Brucontrol Élément is at 100% (255) I get 5.0 vdc on AA-2 output. When Brucontrol Élément at 50% (128), I get approx 2.5 vdc on AA-2 output.

Pete, Please note: AA-2 potentiometer 3&4 were found mislabelled. I will re-label them - but it sure got me scratching my head for a while!! Thanks to all.

 

[Chokpish]

So I have my proportional SSR’s mcpc2490a hooked up via AA-2 amp, will give her a wet trial in a few days.

My set up has 6 heating elements, with 2 SSR’s that are not pwm capable. While doing a visual inspection on those 2, I found this;

 

[Chokpish]

Both non-pwm SSR’s are in the same condition - not good..

 

[oakbarn]

I use Crydom. Those may only be poor quality knockoffs. They are CoCo.

 

[Chokpish]

Question on using a normal ssr on a port that has pwm capability : due to running out of space on my Unishield, is it ok to have a pwm-capable Element to control a non-pwm ssr? I selected PWM ´off’ in the pid Element settings..?

 

[BrunDog]

Question on using a normal ssr on a port that has pwm capability : due to running out of space on my Unishield, is it ok to have a pwm-capable Element to control a non-pwm ssr? I selected PWM ´off’ in the pid Element settings..?

Yes, with if PWM mode is turned off in the PID, it will use a binary output.

 

[BrunDog]

So I have my proportional SSR’s mcpc2490a hooked up via AA-2 amp, will give her a wet trial in a few days.

My set up has 6 heating elements, with 2 SSR’s that are not pwm capable. While doing a visual inspection on those 2, I found this;

View attachment 792787

Very known and documented problem with fake SSR's. Avoid FOTEK or other cheap knock-offs. Use a quality heatsink, not the little one which ships from Amazon, Aliexpress, etc. and make sure to use a very light application of thermal grease underneath.

 

[oakbarn]

I was trying to figure out what @Chocpish was trying to do. I was reading the manual (4/20/2022) regarding PID (Page 50) and there is no mention of the "Use PWM" switch.
@Brudog stated
"Yes, with if PWM mode is turned off in the PID, it will use a binary output."

Does this mean it will act like a Digital Output Element with just On and Off?

What is the use of the "Use PWM" switch?

 

[BrunDog]

Use PWM sets the output mode to PWM output if the output can support it. Otherwise it is a binary output (ON or OFF) aka Duty Cycle.

 

[oakbarn]

Use PWM sets the output mode to PWM output if the output can support it. Otherwise it is a binary output (ON or OFF) aka Duty Cycle.

Why would you want to set this up? Future replacement of a Standard SSR with a Proportional one? I could see that use because you would have all scripts correct and not have to delete and replace a Duty Cycle Element with a PID Element.