Brewhouse Kits

[stp]

Thanks! The primary is not new but i did get it very clean.....right now there is fermenting like crazy going on....about 8 - 10in of foam. Once its done (3-5 days according to the instructions) i am moving it to a 6gal glass carboy.

The instructions say 20 days in the secondary....i have read that people are leaving them for a lot longer then that....any reason?

and one last new guy question....can i taste some when i put it into the secondary?

Just wanted to let you know what I did for this kit. It was my first brew so I'm definitely a beginner. I made the Prairie Wheat on Nov 10th. I read the formus here first and the one thing I did was pick up the Wyeast 3068 smack pack. It's my first brew so I also wanted to follow the instructions for the most part. On day 4 I checked the gravity and it was still above 1.02 so I ended up leaving it in there (a fermenting bucket like it seems you have) for 8 days. On day 8 I transferred it to a secondary (better bottle) and the gravity was 1.019. FYI, I was fermenting at about 70 which is about the middle of the road for that yeast. I ended up leaving it in the secondary for 19 days (so 27 total as opposed to the 20 they recommend in the instructions) and the gravity going into the bottling bucket was 1.009. So I still had good fermentation in the secondary.
I bottled this on Dec 7th so it's been about a week and a half. I wanted to test a bottle every week to check on carbonation and taste but I've been sick for over a week and didn't want to waste the beer. I'll check it as soon as I'm able.

As for your last question, absolutely, taste away. I tasted the sample when I took the first reading before I pitched my yeast and I've tasted every sample afterwards. Even when I was bottling I had a half bottle left and stuck it in the fridge. It was staring at me for a while so I tried it the other day but can't really comment on the taste because I couldn't taste anything with plugged sinuses.

I hope your beer turns out great. Can't wait to try mine.
Also, I have a Brew House Cream Ale that I used the Kolsch yeast with in the secondary right now too. That one smells great

 

[CTS]

Just wanted to let you know what I did for this kit. It was my first brew so I'm definitely a beginner. I made the Prairie Wheat on Nov 10th. I read the formus here first and the one thing I did was pick up the Wyeast 3068 smack pack. It's my first brew so I also wanted to follow the instructions for the most part. On day 4 I checked the gravity and it was still above 1.02 so I ended up leaving it in there (a fermenting bucket like it seems you have) for 8 days. On day 8 I transferred it to a secondary (better bottle) and the gravity was 1.019. FYI, I was fermenting at about 70 which is about the middle of the road for that yeast. I ended up leaving it in the secondary for 19 days (so 27 total as opposed to the 20 they recommend in the instructions) and the gravity going into the bottling bucket was 1.009. So I still had good fermentation in the secondary.
I bottled this on Dec 7th so it's been about a week and a half. I wanted to test a bottle every week to check on carbonation and taste but I've been sick for over a week and didn't want to waste the beer. I'll check it as soon as I'm able.

As for your last question, absolutely, taste away. I tasted the sample when I took the first reading before I pitched my yeast and I've tasted every sample afterwards. Even when I was bottling I had a half bottle left and stuck it in the fridge. It was staring at me for a while so I tried it the other day but can't really comment on the taste because I couldn't taste anything with plugged sinuses.

I hope your beer turns out great. Can't wait to try mine.
Also, I have a Brew House Cream Ale that I used the Kolsch yeast with in the secondary right now too. That one smells great

Thanks very much for the reply!!

Ok i will definitely be tasting it then! It smells so good every time i walk by....I can't help but look in the bucket...probably not a good idea.

It started off smelling very fruity, but now it is smelling more and more like beer.

Let me know how yours turn out....I'm curious how different it will be to mine due to the different use of yeast.

 

[estoppel]

Of course you can taste some.

I still brew these kits from time to time and still use a secondary. My only advice is to completely ignore the instructions in terms of when it ready to transfer to to secondary. Only transfer to secondary once your specific gravity is consistent. 5 days is very rarely long enough and 3 days is border line retarded. I have had some beers lag for 26 hours before fermentation even began!

At the very least leave it for 10 days in "primary" before you move it to a carboy. If you don't need your primary (in order to brew again), just leave it in primary for the full three to four weeks until bottling day.

I still use carboys for age conditioning beers, but if I can avoid it, I do avoid secondary altogether. Putting your beers in a secondary was sound advice in 1978. 32 years and significant development in the strains of yeast commonly used for homebrewing later, it is not necessary. It only makes sense from a practical perspective (if you need the space) otherwise, secondary is for chumps.

This is my opinion only, and while shared by many, is objected to by some. So please understand that there are other schools of thought on this. I have produced great beers either way, so don't worry too much about it.

 

[CTS]

Thanks for the info!

I think i will take the SG on Sunday and then again Monday or Tuesday to see if it is still getting lower.

I'm assuming that I could just put it straight into the carboy and leave it there till i need to bottle/keg it.

All of the white foam has settled back down but now there is some dark stuff on the side, looks like yeast possible.....should i push it back down into the beer?

Thanks all for helping a new guy out!!

 

[birvine]

I would say, yes, once into the secondary you can leave it for weeks or months until it is really clear then keg away.
I think it is just crusted kreusen on the pail - probably just best to leave it alone and rack as clear as you can. I have never heard of any reason to get it back into the brew. Even when not visible there is a LOT of yeast in your brew so if you bottle there may be plenty enough to carbonate, and if not, you can add more yeast at bottling time if you like.

B

 

[estoppel]

Don't push that stuff back into your beer. It's just whatever is left from the Krausen. Just rack from underneath it and try not to stir up the brown stuff or the trub too much!

 

[CTS]

Thanks for the help.

I have one more question....Is it possible for the fermentation to be done in 2 days? I started it Wed and the reading was 1.047. I just took it now and the reading was at 1.012...

The reason i checked so early is because there is stuff starting to collect on the bottom and there has been no activity all day.

I am going to check the SG again on Sunday and see what the reading is. If its the same I think i am going to be putting it into the glass carboy for the secondary.

 

[birvine]

And here is where I may learn...

Some of my brews have completed their initial strong fermentation within a day or two. It is the point when fermentation visually slows right down that I transfer from the prim to secondary to get the brew into a glass carboy and out of a plastic unsealed pail. You should always check with the hydrometer, but from what you say, things sound just fine.

B

PS What I mean about learning is that maybe my quick transfer to a carboy within 2-3 days is incorrect, but I think all is well - the beer keeps tasting fine!

 

[estoppel]

Birvine and CTS: Once fermentation stops, I would still leave it for 24-48 hours. When the Yeast are busy eating all of the fermentable sugar, it creates CO2 and alcohol (which of course you know), but it also produces some other things that you may not want in your finished beer, including diacetyl. The yeast and gravity sort of work to clean this stuff up after fermentation ends. If you take it off the trub, it will lose some of its ability to clean these things out.

Also, I don't brew in an unsealed plastic, pail, I brew in a well sealed bucket with a rubber inset for an airlock. Lots of wine guys will tell you to just use their "primary" bucket that comes with their "starters kits", but it has been my experience that a sealed bucket has produced far far better beers. As I just mentioned, fermentation produces CO2 which rises out of the beer and makes your airlock bubble. It sort of acts as a layer of protection to keep wild yeast and other undesireable things out of your beer.

If you have a a carboy big enough, you could just put it straight in there (with enough space for krausen) but you may want to use a blow off tube instead of an airlock. If not, you could buy a sealing bucket.


But at the end of the day, if you are making beers which you enjoy drinking, you are doing everything right.

 

[xoltri]

So here's another update on my Innis & Gunn clone. I tasted the three beers side by side: Actual Innis & Gunn, the cream ale with vanilla, oak extract and whiskey, and the cream ale with just oak extract and whiskey.

First notice is that my variation is missing the oak/vanilla aroma. Innis & Gunn has a very strong pleasant aroma that mine was lacking.

Color was exactly the same between the beers.

My versions had a stronger hop bite that was out of place compared to the Innis & Gunn. The only thing I can think of to try different is to use either the Pale Ale or Red Ale kit next time as they are only 18IBU vs the Cream Ale's 22IBU.

Finally, my versions were way way lighter on the oak flavor than the Innis & Gunn. I took a sample of my beers, about 1/3 of a bottle, and added 2 tbsp of oak extract and it started to approach the oak flavor of the Innis & Gunn but was still lacking in the aroma.

Overall I think I am getting close to getting something with a similar flavor to Innis & Gunn. Adding the 750ml of whiskey and the oak definitely gets you something similar, and the vanilla addition helps also. But the over bitter hops and lack of aroma make it fall short. I think next time I will try the red ale kit, and maybe try actual oak staves instead of the extract, but I have to do some research on that.

 

[stp]

Thanks very much for the reply!!

Ok i will definitely be tasting it then! It smells so good every time i walk by....I can't help but look in the bucket...probably not a good idea.

It started off smelling very fruity, but now it is smelling more and more like beer.

Let me know how yours turn out....I'm curious how different it will be to mine due to the different use of yeast.

Tried my Prairie Wheat last week and I was very impressed! After carbing for 2 weeks it was perfect. It's been at room temperature for 3 weeks now so I'll be moving it to the basement. Have less to move since I already have about 4 litres gone. Don't think it'll last long enough to see if it ages well.

To be honest I wasn't overly impressed with how it tasted going into the bottling bucket. Now that it's carbed it seems to have a totally different flavour. Or it seems that way to me at least. I was very relieved after the first sip! It has a fruity aroma but not an overly fruity taste. I can taste a little bit of the banana esters from the Wyeast but it's not too much, as other people that have tried it wouldn't have picked it out if I hadn't mentioned it. I'm glad I don't have any of the bubblegum flavours that I could have got from my yeast if temps were too high. It will be interesting to hear about your flavours with the included yeast.

One thing I didn't do (which I will try and do next time) was adjust the priming sugar. I was extra careful racking out of the primary and secondary so I ended up with only 21.5 liters in the bottling bucket as opposed to 23. But then I used the whole package of sugar. Not really a big deal but some people said that these kits come with too much sugar to begin with. I'll leave a bit out on the next brew and see if I notice a difference.

I took a bunch of pics with my new camera so once I figure out how to resize and post I'll be sure to do that.

Hope your beer turns out great too

 

[NewfZX7]

So here's another update on my Innis & Gunn clone. I tasted the three beers side by side: Actual Innis & Gunn, the cream ale with vanilla, oak extract and whiskey, and the cream ale with just oak extract and whiskey.

First notice is that my variation is missing the oak/vanilla aroma. Innis & Gunn has a very strong pleasant aroma that mine was lacking.

Color was exactly the same between the beers.

My versions had a stronger hop bite that was out of place compared to the Innis & Gunn. The only thing I can think of to try different is to use either the Pale Ale or Red Ale kit next time as they are only 18IBU vs the Cream Ale's 22IBU.

Finally, my versions were way way lighter on the oak flavor than the Innis & Gunn. I took a sample of my beers, about 1/3 of a bottle, and added 2 tbsp of oak extract and it started to approach the oak flavor of the Innis & Gunn but was still lacking in the aroma.

Overall I think I am getting close to getting something with a similar flavor to Innis & Gunn. Adding the 750ml of whiskey and the oak definitely gets you something similar, and the vanilla addition helps also. But the over bitter hops and lack of aroma make it fall short. I think next time I will try the red ale kit, and maybe try actual oak staves instead of the extract, but I have to do some research on that.

Thanks for the update. I was following your posts hoping you were going to say it worked perfectly! Sounds like a good start though.
I find Innis & Gunn has a kind of sweet caramel flavor as well. I wonder if there is some point where caramelized sugar could be dissolved in. It might balance out some of the bitterness as well.
I'm quite new at this, just throwing out some ideas.

I have made the BH Stout pretty much to the exact instructions and it turned out way better than I expected. A month after it has been bottled it is
even more delicious.
I have two more kits bottled now, Winterfest and Munich Dark. With the Munich I only added half the water in the recipe. On the BH site they say this will make a Bock style. Can't wait to try them in a couple of weeks!

 

[birvine]

In the past few weeks of voraciously reading HBT threads... as an FYI to all experimenting with these kits (or extract or AG) contrary to my earlier comments in December, please experiment with a primary that is actually weeks long versus only a few days.

With respect to the I&G, I simply can't find a clone recipe online that anyone seems to replicate the original. And I am not fluent enough in beer-recipe-creation to know exactly what to do in order to bring out specific flavours or compnents in a brew.

B

 

[xoltri]

In the past few weeks of voraciously reading HBT threads... as an FYI to all experimenting with these kits (or extract or AG) contrary to my earlier comments in December, please experiment with a primary that is actually weeks long versus only a few days.

I am trying this with my latest batch. I am making the American Premium Lager kit with Wyeast 1056 that I had previously washed back at the beginning of November. There was about 85ml of yeast slurry in the jar, and I made a 1L starter with 100g of DME boiled for 15 minutes. In less than two days the starter had finished fermenting so I pitched it into the beer yesterday.

I'm using a primary with a snap on lid and am going to just leave it alone for 3 weeks, then rack it onto the priming sugar and bottle. We'll see how it turns out with the extended primary / yeast starter.

 

[CTS]

Tried my Prairie Wheat last week and I was very impressed! After carbing for 2 weeks it was perfect. It's been at room temperature for 3 weeks now so I'll be moving it to the basement. Have less to move since I already have about 4 litres gone. Don't think it'll last long enough to see if it ages well.

To be honest I wasn't overly impressed with how it tasted going into the bottling bucket. Now that it's carbed it seems to have a totally different flavour. Or it seems that way to me at least. I was very relieved after the first sip! It has a fruity aroma but not an overly fruity taste. I can taste a little bit of the banana esters from the Wyeast but it's not too much, as other people that have tried it wouldn't have picked it out if I hadn't mentioned it. I'm glad I don't have any of the bubblegum flavours that I could have got from my yeast if temps were too high. It will be interesting to hear about your flavours with the included yeast.

One thing I didn't do (which I will try and do next time) was adjust the priming sugar. I was extra careful racking out of the primary and secondary so I ended up with only 21.5 liters in the bottling bucket as opposed to 23. But then I used the whole package of sugar. Not really a big deal but some people said that these kits come with too much sugar to begin with. I'll leave a bit out on the next brew and see if I notice a difference.

I took a bunch of pics with my new camera so once I figure out how to resize and post I'll be sure to do that.

Hope your beer turns out great too

I'm glad yours turned out well. I tried mine after 8 days in the bottle and its definitely not ready. Its starting to carb real nice but just does not taste very good yet. It also turns out I might of had to high of a fermentation temp and got some fusels from that mistake. Here is the thread to that...
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/question-about-bottle-conditioning-taste-217201/

Mine also has a very good fruity smell, and now that you mentioned it bananas do come to mind for me as well. The beer itself did not have a real fruity taste. I will have to get back to you when the beer really matures, and hopefully when the fusels go away...if they do!

Good call with measuring the priming sugar next time, I just got as much of the beer that I could get and then added all the sugar to it....Maybe measuring might be a good idea for me next time also. Its funny because I thought to myself as i was boiling it that it seems like a lot of sugar.

I will post some pictures as well once I try it again....probably going to wait the full 3 weeks in the bottle before I try again (ya right, who am I kidding)

A good place for picture hosting is photobucket . com, FYI

 

[birvine]

An update on my BH Pilsner - I kegged it a few days ago. Gave it a quick sample and it seems really good, though needs some time in the keg to blend. Looks great so far.

This morning I brewed one of BH's pale ale kits. Split it in half - brewing one portion as a pale ale which I'll dry hop in a few weeks; to the other portion I added chocolate malt, black patent and roasted barley in order to replicate a Porter recipe I found. I'll report later how it turned out.

B

EDIT [19-Jan-2011]: Had a glass of the Pilsner; still yeasty as it was only kegged a few days ago, but I would say it is going to be a great brew!

 

[xoltri]

So I had one of the Winterfest ales that I bottled about a week ago. It's not quite fully carbed up yet but pretty close. I used the 1098 Brit Ale yeast. Turned out really good, lots of flavor and the spices are definitely not overpowering. It's very full flavored, I like it!

 

[NewfZX7]

So I had one of the Winterfest ales that I bottled about a week ago. It's not quite fully carbed up yet but pretty close. I used the 1098 Brit Ale yeast. Turned out really good, lots of flavor and the spices are definitely not overpowering. It's very full flavored, I like it!

Mine carbed up nicely after a week, but the all the flavors seemed like they were separate. It's been over two now, but I think I'm going to wait at least another week before I try it again hopefully it will blend together a little more. I used the supplied Coopers yeast, next time I'll go with a liquid yeast as well. The Munich Dark I put down seems to be getting better after it's second week in the bottles.
I just started an IPA kit with a 1099 Whitbread Ale yeast. I'm going to leave it week in the primary and then harvest the yeast and re-pitch it into a Stout kit.


Edit: Went ahead and tried the Winterfest again. It has been 18 days since bottling and it has changed dramatically in the past 7 days or so. The flavors are melded together now and the beer is slightly bitter, really nice! I can tell this is going to be even better when it matures more.

 

[Broncoblue]

Brewhouse's cream ale is pretty damn good. Its a no boil kit, just add water.

 

[xoltri]

So I'm drinking my American Premium Lager kit now, bottled on Jan 31. I made it with 1056 American Ale yeast which I washed and put in a fridge in November; about 50ml of yeast slurry in the jar. I took that yeast and made a 1L starter with 100g DME boiled for 15 minutes. I used RO water to make up the 8L required and left it undisturbed in the primary for 3 weeks. No airlock, just the snap on lid.

Cleanest tasting beer I've made yet from these kits. And so much less work than doing a secondary. I'd highly recommend this method!

I'm excited to have some of my friends and family try this batch.

 

[stp]

So I'm drinking my American Premium Lager kit now, bottled on Jan 31. I made it with 1056 American Ale yeast which I washed and put in a fridge in November; about 50ml of yeast slurry in the jar. I took that yeast and made a 1L starter with 100g DME boiled for 15 minutes. I used RO water to make up the 8L required and left it undisturbed in the primary for 3 weeks. No airlock, just the snap on lid.

Cleanest tasting beer I've made yet from these kits. And so much less work than doing a secondary. I'd highly recommend this method!

I'm excited to have some of my friends and family try this batch.

Glad to hear that you tried it just with the primary with the snap on lid and it turned out okay. I have been hesitant to try this as I wasn't sure how sanitary it would be for a longer period of time. I'd love to not transfer to a secondary but I can't make it past 10 days before I get too worried and transfer it so I can put an airlock on it.

And just as an update, I'm getting more and more impressed with these kits;
I have the Cream Ale that's been in bottles for about 5 weeks and it's really good. I used Wyeast 2565 (Kolsch) and am very happy with how it turned out (having one right now actually )

I also just bottled what I hope to be nice brown ale. I used FlyGuy's recommendation and steeped 3/4lb of crystal and added it to a Munich Dark Lager kit. I pitched Wyeast 1028 London Ale and fermented for 30 days. I'm excited for this one

And I'm also a week away from kegging my first beer! Finished my keezer and a Prairie Wheat is almost ready to go in. I did a Prairie Wheat as my first brew and thought it would be a good idea for it to be the first in a keg too. That way I can compare the two a lot easier.

If I keep liking these kits I fear it's going to be a while before I go to extract.......well, at least until I've gone through all the styles....

 

[estoppel]

I am a fan of these kits. But I have to tell you, the day you make the jump to extract, you'll be quite proud of yourself.

I made 10-15 of these kits before I jumped to extract and hacked most of them. They all turned out pretty good. But at the end of the day, I didn't feel like I was brewing my own beer. I felt like I was brewing someone else's beer. Jumping to extract only required a canning pot ($20 from walmart) and it allowed me to make pretty much any beer style I wanted.

I have recently turned to AG. But I brewed extract for four years and loved every minute of it.

I still like these kits, but I encourage everyone else who also enjoys them to consider doing extract brews. It will cost you an extra $10 a batch, but it's worth it.

 

[xoltri]

Drinking my latest kit, the honey blonde ale. Again I used the 1056 washed yeast I've had in the fridge for a couple months, made a 1L starter with 100G of DME boiled for 15 minutes in 1L of water, and used RO water to make up the 8L. I also again did the 3 week primary. Turned out amazing! It has a pleasant slight aroma of honey.

I've made 11 of these kits so far and I have some insight to share. All of the beers that I made from these kits where I did a 1 week primary and then 2 week secondary have a sort of musty, grassy aroma that hits you in the top back of the nose. Not sure how else to describe it. The one that is really bad is the cream ale I made several months ago. With that beer I did something really bad. As per the instructions I left it in the primary for 5 days then racked it to a carboy. But then in the carboy a bunch of yeast settled out within the next couple of days, and I wanted to harvest that yeast so I racked it again and harvested the yeast. Well it has that same bad off taste but is by far the worst of all of the beers I have made to date, even though I made it way back in September 2010. It is pretty much undrinkable, but I am holding out that it will get better one day. I attribute it to the beer not having a chance on the yeast to clean up those bad flavors, which is the problem the 3 week primary solves 100%.

 

[birvine]

I have done extract and BH - they are great kits. I still say if you are somewhere without a supplier of good brewing supplies but can get these kits, then go for it.

B

 

[abrdnck]

I've made a few of these kits, and I like the fact that they are easy to get and easy to make. I am currently enjoying one of my Dupe-All ales that I brewed last summer, and it will be a sad day when they are all gone.

I am hoping to do a few more kit hacks, and am looking for some advice. Using a BH kit as a base, I'd like to make up a Belgian Dubbel and also a Saison. I'm curious if anyone has tried this, and if so what is your recipe and how did it turn out?

 

[WinoOutWest]

Question for those extended primary proponents: My thinking, seeing as I don't have sealed primary is to rack into a carboy after the vigorous fermentation is complete but to stir it up a bit and take the yeast cake with it to the carboy. It seems to settle out in the carboy pretty quickly. Then leaving it for a month in the carboy and consider this an extended primary fermentation. Any flaws with my thinking here?

 

[estoppel]

I am an extended primary proponent because secondary is unnecessary and it is not worth the sanitation risk to rack into a second fermenter.

Just do a 2 week primary and keg it if your fermenter isn't quite sealed (if you insist on using it), Personally, I would just ferment in the carboy and wouldn't bother with an unsealed primary fermenter.

You are proposing to take all of the risks associated with a secondary and then to forego the benefit of having "clearer beer" by stirring up trub. I also don't see any particular benefit to stirring up the trub.

 

[xoltri]

Question for those extended primary proponents: My thinking, seeing as I don't have sealed primary is to rack into a carboy after the vigorous fermentation is complete but to stir it up a bit and take the yeast cake with it to the carboy. It seems to settle out in the carboy pretty quickly. Then leaving it for a month in the carboy and consider this an extended primary fermentation. Any flaws with my thinking here?

I don't have a sealed primary either, but yet I've done 3 batches so far with a 3 week primary and they've all turned out awesome. Just bottled my 4th last night, the Prairie Wheat that I made with Wyeast 1056 American Ale.

I have done what you describe, which is to rouse the yeast after the 1 week primary before racking to secondary. I did it with the Winterfest Ale and it turned out great too, it didn't have that bad grassy taste that the usual 1 week primary beers had and it didn't have trouble clearing. But for me it's an extra step, another thing to sanitize and clean, and ultimately a waste of time IMO.

 

[WinoOutWest]

Okay followup question on the extended primary.
Not planning ahead very well I started a Brewhouse Honey Blonde Ale with an extra kg of honey added. It (including all the sediment from the primary) has been racked over into an air locked secondary now but I am leaving next week for 2 weeks which will make it about 4.5 weeks "in the primary". My question is am I safe leaving it "in the primary" for 4 or 5 weeks vs making alternate arrangements to have my wife bottle it for me. (not an attractive option for either one of us!)

 

[estoppel]

I guess I was unable to convince you to just leave the trub or just not bother with secondary!

Anyways, 5 weeks is fine. I have left it for 6 without ill effect.