Brew Masters on Discovery w/ Sam Calagione

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mlyday said:
Its done for this season. It was only 5 episode. I emailed them at that was their response. They said no dicision had been anounced for any more. Ill copy the email here when I get back to my pc.
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I hope it was enough of a success to move on to another brewery. I liked what they showed from Sam @ DFH, but the name of the show is "Brew Master(s)" after all. 5 weeks at any one brewery seems to be enough.
 
yea, if this is over, along with the end of Dexter and The Walking Dead, no sense in paying for satellite anymore . ..
 
This was their response.


Dear Viewer,

Thank you for contacting the Discovery Channel. We appreciate your interest in our programming.

The first season of Brew Masters consisted of five episodes and has concluded. At this time no information regarding a future season of this program has been released.

Please visit our website at www.discovery.com, and click on TV Schedule as this information will be posted as soon as it becomes available. Our schedules are published for the current and following month. If you are not able to locate the programming you are looking for, we recommend checking back periodically to see if it has been added to the current schedule.
 
Boooo...I was really enjoying this show! I'm definitely going to miss it, along with Dexter. At least I know Dexter will come back with another season...at least I hope so!!
 
mlyday said:
This was their response.


Dear Viewer,

Thank you for contacting the Discovery Channel. We appreciate your interest in our programming.

The first season of Brew Masters consisted of five episodes and has concluded. At this time no information regarding a future season of this program has been released.

Please visit our website at www.discovery.com, and click on TV Schedule as this information will be posted as soon as it becomes available. Our schedules are published for the current and following month. If you are not able to locate the programming you are looking for, we recommend checking back periodically to see if it has been added to the current schedule.
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Yes, On the discovery channel website, at the bottom of the page under the "viewer relations" section. The way I read it was that it was always planned to have the 5 episode, and they havent made any press release about a new season, so the person answering the email cant say anything.

Although I think the show could be better, it was a nice to grab a homebrew and sit on the couch and watch it for an hour. We are always pretty busy, so that was my guilty pleasure.
 
wildwest450 said:
Yes, most poorly run operations pump out 75,000 barrels of beer in a year, grow 400% in a 3 year span, and are currently expanding despite a crap economy.

Most businesses should be run so poorly.
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+10 ^^

And as far as this goes:
"Yeah they could, they just needed to forsee this being an issue when they formulated the recipe. Seems like something they should expect to see."

They're trying to emulate a thousands of years old recipe and you're surprised things don't go exactly according to plan. I'd rather buy a beer from a company that is willing to take the financial hit from dumping a batch rather then releasing poor product or even an "almost 120 minute" beer.

I work in the food production industry, and no matter how many protocols you have in place, including HACCP (Hazard Analysis Critical Control Points), s#$t does happen and sometimes you have to take a financial hit when a product is out of spec. Much better than shoving it out the door like those guys at Peanut Corp of America who pushed salmonella tainted peanuts after becoming aware of the problem. Which corporate model makes you more comfortable in our food chain??
 
It would be nice to see a different brewery each season but you have to remember it's tv and tv shows need "characters." While it would be awesome to see other breweries I have to wonder how many would do well in front of the camera.
 
IMO there are plenty of breweries with great people that would make awesome TV (Sprecher, Lakefront and Two Brothers come to mind immediately), but the problem is they need to find a brewery that has some name recognition across most of the nation.
 
IffyG said:
IMO there are plenty of breweries with great people that would make awesome TV (Sprecher, Lakefront and Two Brothers come to mind immediately), but the problem is they need to find a brewery that has some name recognition across most of the nation.
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I believe that it is the people involved in/with the brewery that make the show (Sam & his staff) and that there are plenty of other craft breweries with interesting owners such as Stone, Russian River, etc. that would be very interesting to follow. I would say that the majority of viewers were probably not familiarnwith DFH before this aired. Montanaandy
 
HerotBrewer said:
+10 ^^

And as far as this goes:
"Yeah they could, they just needed to forsee this being an issue when they formulated the recipe. Seems like something they should expect to see."

They're trying to emulate a thousands of years old recipe and you're surprised things don't go exactly according to plan. I'd rather buy a beer from a company that is willing to take the financial hit from dumping a batch rather then releasing poor product or even an "almost 120 minute" beer.

I work in the food production industry, and no matter how many protocols you have in place, including HACCP (Hazard Analysis Critical Control Points), s#$t does happen and sometimes you have to take a financial hit when a product is out of spec. Much better than shoving it out the door like those guys at Peanut Corp of America who pushed salmonella tainted peanuts after becoming aware of the problem. Which corporate model makes you more comfortable in our food chain??
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I didn't say serve the beer that didn't work out. Nice strawman.

I said, if you're using a yeast that you know can't pull off 18% all the time, use a blend of yeasts or something.
 
IffyG said:
IMO there are plenty of breweries with great people that would make awesome TV (Sprecher, Lakefront and Two Brothers come to mind immediately), but the problem is they need to find a brewery that has some name recognition across most of the nation.
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Name recognition plays a role, but its more about personality. Like him or not, Sam C. has an aura about him that people are drawn to. He is an entertaining person to watch. There's a lot of good breweries out there but there aren't many brewers that viewers will tune in to watch on a weekly basis.
 
One thing I found sort of interesting was that twice now they've had stuck fermentations and did a lot of the same things homebrewers do (rousing, repitching, etc.)...with the same results. As I was watching I kept thinking; "That usually doesn't work." and then it didn't, as usual.
 
SpanishCastleAle said:
One thing I found sort of interesting was that twice now they've had stuck fermentations and did a lot of the same things homebrewers do (rousing, repitching, etc.)...with the same results. As I was watching I kept thinking; "That usually doesn't work." and then it didn't, as usual.
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Yes, I enjoyed that as well, particularly since I've commented a couple times on these forums that repitching to a stuck fermentation may not necessarily restart it and had several people tell me, quite rudely to be honest, that I didn't know what I was talking about. Personally, I've never had one stick, but have heard several professional brewers talking about this, but, hey, what do I know right?!?!? :mad:
 
bovineblitz said:
I didn't say serve the beer that didn't work out. Nice strawman.

I said, if you're using a yeast that you know can't pull off 18% all the time, use a blend of yeasts or something.
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Then it wouldn't be that specific beer, it would be something different. Just like using an ale yeast in place of a lager yeast or Brett, they are different and offer different characteristics. Also they never state it, so how do we know they don't already use a blend of yeast? all they stated was that they use a sake yeast.

That said I bet any of the bigger (BMC and craft brews) breweries throw away as much beer as Sam does, if not more.
 
dvdanny said:
Then it wouldn't be that specific beer, it would be something different. Just like using an ale yeast in place of a lager yeast or Brett, they are different and offer different characteristics. Also they never state it, so how do we know they don't already use a blend of yeast? all they stated was that they use a sake yeast.

That said I bet any of the bigger (BMC and craft brews) breweries throw away as much beer as Sam does, if not more.
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You obviously don't get my point.

If they had originally made 120 with this in mind, say at 1.040 they pitch a champagne yeast or something like that, then yes it WOULD be 120.

Obviously I don't have inside knowledge, but from the information we're given (that hypes drama of course), it doesn't look that well thought-out to me. That's all I'm saying. If you know your beer is THAT close to the limit, then cover your ass.
 
bovineblitz said:
You obviously don't get my point.

If they had originally made 120 with this in mind, say at 1.040 they pitch a champagne yeast or something like that, then yes it WOULD be 120.

Obviously I don't have inside knowledge, but from the information we're given (that hypes drama of course), it doesn't look that well thought-out to me. That's all I'm saying. If you know your beer is THAT close to the limit, then cover your ass.
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Ok, what happens if the champagne yeast overly drys out the beer?

I still call it acceptable lose, it was only one batch it's not like every single batch of 120 goes bad, just that one. There were previously successful batches of 120, hell i've had one, so why change a good thing?
 
bovineblitz said:
Obviously I don't have inside knowledge, but from the information we're given (that hypes drama of course), it doesn't look that well thought-out to me. That's all I'm saying. If you know your beer is THAT close to the limit, then cover your ass.
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I think they do cover their ass. That stuff is expensive. And I am sure built into the price is a component for having to dump a batch every now and then.
 
dvdanny said:
Ok, what happens if the champagne yeast overly drys out the beer?

I still call it acceptable lose, it was only one batch it's not like every single batch of 120 goes bad, just that one. There were previously successful batches of 120, hell i've had one, so why change a good thing?
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Then use a different high alcohol yeast. Use potassium sorbate at the FG.

The point isn't my specific example, the point is, attack the problem from multiple angles, don't just sit and pray.
 
bovineblitz said:
Then use a different high alcohol yeast. Use potassium sorbate at the FG.

The point isn't my specific example, the point is, attack the problem from multiple angles, don't just sit and pray.
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Like they showed in the last episode with the other beer they tried to ferment out, I'm sure they ran the same experiments on 120 as well. But like Sam or someone else said on the show, it didn't meet the flavor profile of 120, or even in the range of past year's batches.

Add champagne yeast or alpha amalaze or some super high gravity yeast, isn't going to produce the same flavors as they consistently get in other batches. Like someone else said, champagne yeast is going to change the flavor of the beer, it may dry it out.

That may be fine in our homebrews, we're not usually striving for the same expected level of consistency from batch to batch that they are. They have much more at stake.

They can't just pass off a beer that doesn't meet whatever complex tasting standards they have laid out for each beer. If it's nowhere in the ball park of 120 or whatever beer, they're not going to put their reputation at stake.

I'm sure they didn't take these decisions to dump lightly, I'm sure it was a lot more challenging than it looked in either episode. Kind of like in our labs here at the medschool when they have to put a research dog down. It's devastating for morale.

And I'm sure they explored every option imaginable to save it, including high grav yeast, AA, and things that none of us in our wild imagnings as brewers probably would consider. I bet they tested it all and dumping it was the last thing they could do after exhausting all other options.

I've wondered why they didn't blend the questionable beer with another and call it something else, but in one of the episodes they mentioned they had limited fermenter and it was better for them to free it up and get a fresh batch in rather than creating something new.

Though I bet if they bottled the 120 and slapped a label like "DFH-ONETWENTYWEFUQUEDUPUS ALE" we still would probably have snapped it up.

But I'm sure they entertained that idea as well.....These guys aren't idiots, Sam's got a huge team behind them, including a marketing department (plus he seems to be the king of shilling something), and he's no idiot himself......Like I said I'm sure neither of the dumpings were taken lightly.
 
It's probable that they do have all sorts of checks in place, it would have just been nice to at least have heard them discuss them. Maybe the issue wasn't just a stuck fermentation, who knows... they don't tell us much on the show.

Don't think that I'm hating on DFH cuz I'm actually a big fan, I wondered how the operation would come off in my eyes after watching the show and I basically found my answer. It won't stop me from enjoying their products, but I've always thought that their specialties are hit or miss (like the time I got a 4 pack of Midas that was so sweet that I sadly dumped them all and decided never to buy bottled Midas again). I to generally try everything new they come out with and really love the Chicory stout, Immort Ale, and Palo Santo.

And, I'm done making my recipe formulation point, nobody seems to understand what I'm saying, you're just responding that "it would change the beer"... what I'm saying is consider the issue before you get to that point, make a slightly different beer in the first place that accounts for the possibility of your yeast crapping out due to high ABV.
 
bovineblitz said:
It's probable that they do have all sorts of checks in place, it would have just been nice to at least have heard them discuss them. Maybe the issue wasn't just a stuck fermentation, who knows... they don't tell us much on the show.
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I think we expect too much out of an hour show...Remember this isn't really a show made for beer geeks like us, who spend hours on here analyzing every nuance of the brewing process. The people at DFH may indeed do that just like we do, but that's not going to make good television, that's actually going to make boring television for the 9 bazillion people on this planet who aren't die hard beer geeks like we are.

(Think about your wife, or GF or Coworker whose eyes glaze over when you and your beer geek buddies start yammering about this or that nuance. I know my girlfriend who doesn't even really like beer goes into zone mode when we're at a microbrewery with a bunch of my brewing friends and we start deconstructing the hopbill.)

Hell my GF even thought Brewmaster's was boring to watch.

Remember the show is not really for us. It's a show for people with a limited understanding of the brewing process, so they aren't going to go everyweek into every iota of the brewing process, especially trouble shooting issues. But it's going to go over most folks heads.

Plus as someone who has worked in the tv industry (especially the non fiction where we often shoot first and script after) we shoot hours and hours of footage and then pare it down to tell the story we want to tell. Every minute of Sam's 8 hour day, or even the 6 hour brewing process that we all know and love....would take 6 or 8 hours to incorporate everything in it...

And yeah, we'll watch brewing tv online, or what so and so's lieve webcast of his brewday...hell, we'll watch videos of carboys bubbling on youtube, but "Joe six pack" won't.

And thats what is going to make or break a show, of x-million average joe's watch it.
 
bovineblitz said:
And, I'm done making my recipe formulation point, nobody seems to understand what I'm saying, you're just responding that "it would change the beer"... what I'm saying is consider the issue before you get to that point, make a slightly different beer in the first place that accounts for the possibility of your yeast crapping out due to high ABV.
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I get what you're saying, man. In the show where they dumped the 120 Minute, they did say that they had to revisit the recipe to try and avoid problems in the future. Since they were revisiting the recipe anyway, they all sat down and came to a consensus on what they wanted out of the beer. That's when they were trying past batches of 120 Minute and settled (I think) on emulating the 2006 recipe. So, I think they did just what you are talking about except they're doing it after they've had the problem. I'm sure they thought they did that before they had the problem, but they obviously didn't know something or forgot to take something into account. It's tough to be too critical of that mistake since we don't know any details at all, really. Hindsight is 20/20 and all that, so they redid their recipe taking into account all the problems they observed while still producing the flavor they want from 120 Minute.

As for those saying they should go to other breweries - Discovery is based in Silver Spring, MD. DFH is pretty much the closest brewery that is both distributed widely and does some exciting new things. I'm sure that went and still goes into their decision making process. Plus, does anyone know, did Sam Calagione pitch the idea for the show? Is it all his idea? Or did they come to him? I wouldn't be surprised if he pitched the idea.
 
I
dvdanny said:
Then it wouldn't be that specific beer, it would be something different. Just like using an ale yeast in place of a lager yeast or Brett, they are different and offer different characteristics. Also they never state it, so how do we know they don't already use a blend of yeast? all they stated was that they use a sake yeast.

That said I bet any of the bigger (BMC and craft brews) breweries throw away as much beer as Sam does, if not more.
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Everyone says they can't change this beer or it won't be 120. Didn't this beer used to be 20% abv before they chose to back it off to 18% because of stuck fermentations?
 
Shooter said:
Sam did say on the BN interview that he hoped, at some point, the show might be passed on to a different brewery. Now, how likely that is, is anyone's guess.
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I didn't see that interview. That's pretty cool. I hope the show doesn't get canceled and that it continues to evolve in this fashion. I'm really enjoying seeing the people who brew the beer, getting to know their names, and so on.
 

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