Brett/Lacto Secondary Pitch Rates/Order

[D-Hutt]

I have a saison that is finishing up primary fermentation (pitched Wyeast 3726 PC), and had planned to just bottle and be done with it. But I've been thinking that I might want to experiment a bit. I'd like to pitch both brett and lacto into the beer during a secondary, or at bottling, to get some funk and sourness. Looking for more funk and just a bit of tanginess - not full-on face puckering. So, is there a particular order or method I should use to achieve this? What are the normal pitching rates for brett/lacto in secondary? I have access to the Wyeast packs from my local shop.

 

[D-Hutt]

Bump - did the question not make any sense?

 

[moti_mo]

There are a lot of variables that should dictate how you do this. For starters, lacto doesn't do well with higher alcohol contents or with higher IBUs, so people tend to pitch lacto very early on, either alone before sacch. or with sacch. at the start. That doesn't mean it won't do anything to sour your beer, but it might take a very long time, and it might not work at all. I pitched the WL berliner weisse blend (lacto + sacch.) into a wort with only ~4 IBU and 1.026 OG, and after 6 months, its still not very sour at all, which I've heard is somewhat common.

For the brett, just pitch the Wyeast pack that they give you, no starter or anything. I usually rack to a secondary and then pitch the brett. However, you want to make sure the brett has some good residual sugars to chew on. So what was your FG? If it was fairly low, you won't get a ton of brett flavor. If it was a bit higher, like 1.01 or higher, you should get lots of nice brett funk/flavor. You could also pitch some additional sugars for the brett to chew on. Fruit is always a great addition when pitching brett for a secondary. In terms of time, that can vary for a brett secondary. I've had great ones after one month and some took several months. If you pick the right fruits to add at brett pitching time, you can actually get a combination of brett funk and a bit of tartness from the acids in the fruit. It won't be like an all-out sour, but it will be very nice and have some sour qualities.

 

[D-Hutt]

The beer should be around a 1.012 FG - haven't checked yet. AC% is around 5-6. Is that too high for lacto?

 

[moti_mo]

My guess is that its too high for lacto, but I don't have a ton of experience adding lacto late in the game so I could be wrong. If you're really wanting to use lacto, I would do some more research.

With a 1.012 FG, adding Brett will give you a lot of great funk and flavor.

 

[D-Hutt]

Sweet. I'll skip the lacto this time around and just go with brett. If I pitch Brett L. instead of Brett B., would that get me a bit of sour with the funk?

 

[moti_mo]

The Brett really doesn't get you a ton of sour, although you might get some perceived tartness with Brett. L. I got a little bit of tart with my Brett L secondaried saison, but I also secondaried with 6 pounds of fruit, so I don't know if the brett was giving any of that tartness or if it was mainly the acid from the fruit. Probably the latter.

 

[D-Hutt]

Alright, thanks for the help. I'll give it a whirl and see what comes out.