Bought a pump - Recirculate mash or not - so confused :/

[fiveohmike]

Hey Guys,

I just bought a March pump assembly from More Beer. I am using this to do whirlpool hop stands at 170 degrees, and to chill rapidly using the whirlpool arm attached to my my immersion chiller.

So that brings me to this...since I will have the pump.... should I recirculate the mash. I have googled the everliving **** out of this but there are so many contradictions (even on this site).

Does doing a RIMS, direct fired as needed, increase your efficiency and beer clarity?

I read about problems with stuck mashes, but it seems you could bump up your grain mill size a bit (I am at .32 with conditioned grain) or add rice hulls (which i tend to do anyways).

The main thing I am worried about I guess is hot side aeration...is this a real problem? If the pump is primed properly it seems like it would be not.

Whats the consensus on this as of 5/14/2015?

Thanks!

 

[GilaMinumBeer]

The only real reason to do RIMS/HERMS is for long mashes in equipment with poor heat retention.

 

[LandoLincoln]

Recirculation of the mash does two things:

1) It keeps temps stable (if using HERMS or RIMS)
2) It can give you super clear wort going in to the BK

If your MLT is currently a cooler then it probably does a pretty good job of keeping the temps stable. And having super clear wort going into the BK doesn't translate into getting super clear beer at the end of the fermenting process. But it sure does look nice, until you add in the hops and then everything goes muddy.

If you're NOT using a cooler for your mash tun, then yeah, you really need to look into a RIMS or HERMS system, since you're likely losing a lot of heat during the mash.

As for efficiency...hmm...it may affect it somewhat, but there's a few things that affect efficiency a lot more. Like grain crush and pH of the mash.

Clogged false bottoms are the same concern with or without a recirculating system. Recirculating doesn't make the problem any better or worse.

The general homebrewing consensus about hot side aeration on a homebrew scale is that it's not a concern.

 

[Homercidal]

I have a pump and I don't recirculate.

Once I get my electric system built I plan to incorporate it into my rig more. Right now I just use it for chilling.

Once I get my HLT set up I plan to pump my wort through a coil submerged in the hot liquor and use the HLT temp controller to regulate mash temp. My impetus is so that I don't have to be dead nuts on strike water temp and I can adjust slightly and hold steadily.

Wort clarity is a distance second benefit. So far, from my experience, wort clarity from mash tun doesn't necessarily equate to clear beer, so although I'll get a warm fuzzy from seeing clear wort going into the Bk, I know that my beer could still be cloudy as sht.

 

[blizz81]

Agree with what was said above, and will add that as far as temperature goes, even if you have a cooler / aren't losing (much) temp through a mash, I would postulate (from my own empirical observation, and general thought of the practice) recirc still provides a more even, precise temperature through the whole body of the mash by nature of the recirculation. Any benefits from this vs. normal cooler performance are negligible, but still something I suppose, depending on how much of a "control" / "variables" freak you are when it comes to brewing.


When I went into RIMS / HERMS research, one thing I was hoping for was precise and easy step mashes. I gave up hope on that on both options, as both really seem to have their issues vs. the traditional infusion or decoction methods.


The fringe benefits to me along with holding temp and clear wort were 1) it gave me the opportunity to switch to a bottom-draining keg as my mash tun vessel, more or less eliminating dead space and 2) gave me a DIY project to tinker with, which was fun.

 

[acidrain]

If you recirculate without a RIMS or HERMS (I prefer HERMS) you will loose heat. If you're using a cooler, it would be best to just mash at the correct temp, and let it sit.
If you are mashing in a Keggle like me, then you are already loosing too much heat, and need to recirculate through some heating mechanism.
Yes, it will make clear wort.
No, it does not increase efficiency.

 

[tally350z]

I use my cooler for my 5 gallon batches, I use my Herms system for 10 gallon batches and I use the pump to do a extended vorlauf of sorts. Near the end of the mash I will recirculate for 7-8 minutes to settle the grain bed nicely. Then I will close the valve on the pump and move the tubing to the BK and start filling. Works like a charm and no issue with HSA

 

[fiveohmike]

I guess I should say I am using a MoreBeer 15 Gallon Heavy Duty mash tun. In about 65 -75 degree weather I lose about 5 degrees per hour so I direct fire and stir once or twice during a 60-90 minute mash rest.

As I said I am mainly using the pump for whirlpooling and chilling so recirculating is not a big deal unless there was some mega tangible benefit

 

[fiveohmike]

I use my cooler for my 5 gallon batches, I use my Herms system for 10 gallon batches and I use the pump to do a extended vorlauf of sorts. Near the end of the mash I will recirculate for 7-8 minutes to settle the grain bed nicely. Then I will close the valve on the pump and move the tubing to the BK and start filling. Works like a charm and no issue with HSA

Oh thats a good point about the vorlauf, I will definitely try that.

 

[Silentdrinker]

The only real reason to do RIMS/HERMS is for long mashes in equipment with poor heat retention.

The only?

I guess step mashing and consistency doesn't count?

 

[DurtyChemist]

I would beg surprised if you recirculate and you don't see an increase in efficiency. You're constantly moving the enzymes around allowing them a potential increase in connecting with substrate and thereby increasing your sugar extraction vs letting the mash sit there.

 

[Cyclman]

Thanks OP for the thread. I have a direct fired Blich MT, and will use the pump (getting one in a month) to recirc when heating the mash (doing it manually is such a hassle). I will also use it to recirc when chilling.

I have a 3-tier gravity system, other than these pump uses, is there something I am missing?

 

[jtp137]

I have a herms system and sometimes think if all the money and effort was worth it. I miss the simplicity of an igloo cooler with a hose braid

 

[schematix]

I used to get about 85-90% efficiency in my 10G cooler with false bottom.

With my 15G blichmann MLT with blichmann RIMS rocket i get 92-93% efficiency.

But apples to apples, i used to mash for 60 and only 60 minutes in the cooler. Now that i can do more complex mashes and don't have to worry about dropping too much temperature, I haven't mashed for less than 90 minutes.