Blue Moon Clone

[caioz1jp]

Ok So here is the side by side. The real is on the right.

Haze/Clarity:
Clearly this is a simple case of removing the irish moss/whirlfloc tablet.

Color:
I feel the colors are actually dead on but the haze of the real deal makes it look lighter.

Smell:
I'm a chemist and have bad allergies. Definitely not my department lol. At my best i would say the smell is close.

Taste:
Very Very close. Its almost like the spices are flip flopped. I feel like there is not enough coriander as the original has a spice on it. The orange feels more sweet and less orange. I also added my spices for the last 10 minutes together.

Mouth feel
Again this goes to the fining agents. I think if i remove that it will be perfect. Viscosity wise i think it is the same but the way the carbonation is released in your mouth is different between the two. I feel the original releases in smaller bubbles then mine.

My changes:
No whirfloc
Mash oats
Reduce Orange amount. (specific to my orange peel used)
I feel these changes will do more than enough to affect the over all product. What makes me confident about the flip the spice amounts is it seems to be the reverse of what wayne suggested. The original was 3:1 corianderrange.

Again. This is definitely a solid recipe here and Nilo you have done a great job. I want to brew waynes next just to see how different the current recipe is to the original.

 

[nilo]

Ok So here is the side by side. The real is on the right.

Haze/Clarity:
Clearly this is a simple case of removing the irish moss/whirlfloc tablet.

Color:
I feel the colors are actually dead on but the haze of the real deal makes it look lighter.

Smell:
I'm a chemist and have bad allergies. Definitely not my department lol. At my best i would say the smell is close.

Taste:
Very Very close. Its almost like the spices are flip flopped. I feel like there is not enough coriander as the original has a spice on it. The orange feels more sweet and less orange. I also added my spices for the last 10 minutes together.

Mouth feel
Again this goes to the fining agents. I think if i remove that it will be perfect. Viscosity wise i think it is the same but the way the carbonation is released in your mouth is different between the two. I feel the original releases in smaller bubbles then mine.

My changes:
No whirfloc
Mash oats
Reduce Orange amount. (specific to my orange peel used)
I feel these changes will do more than enough to affect the over all product. What makes me confident about the flip the spice amounts is it seems to be the reverse of what wayne suggested. The original was 3:1 corianderrange.

Again. This is definitely a solid recipe here and Nilo you have done a great job. I want to brew waynes next just to see how different the current recipe is to the original.

Caioz1jp, here's a photo of a side by side of #5, which shows it is slightly darker than the real. #6 reduced the crystal 10 from 2 to 1lb to address this issue and color should be much closer. I wonder, did you use 1lb of C10? How long was your boil? I used briess crystal malt.

 

[caioz1jp]

I cant remember now. In my recipe book i have it written down as 5lb lol. But i beleive when i went to the brew shop i copied it off your spread sheet.

 

[NFryan]

Just finished brewing #6 (modified) today. I will let you know how the finished product tastes.

Mashed 60 min 154
Batch sparged at 170

Wheat malt 5 lbs
2-row Briess 5lbs
Quick Oats 1 lb (mashed)
Crystal 10L 1 lb
Carapils .5 lb

Hallertauer - 1oz 60min
.75 oz whole Coriander 10 min (crushed)
1.5 oz Valencia peels 5 min

Strained wort
S04 yeast rehydrated at 90 degrees
OG - 158 - 160

 

[nilo]

Just made few changes to the poll format, find it at the link below
http://beertech.blogspot.com/p/polls_30.html

 

[nilo]

I have added Wayne's recipe to the pdf at https://docs.google.com/open?id=0BxL7TXS8tHPsNWM2YmQ1YTYtMGY1YS00YjJjLWE5ZDktMmQ2ODdmMzljNDUz

I'm not sure on what people brewed exactly, if any variation from Wayne's original recipe on page1, specially the coriander/orange amounts.
Let me know and I can update the recipe.

 

[BeerBaronBob]

Nilo,

For brewers attempting this recipe for the first time, I would strongly suggest you plan to brew it at least three times before you decide on a recipe. Try it once with my suggestions, Try it once with Nilo's suggestions. Taste both of the finished products and decide which one of them tastes closer to what you want your beer to be. THEN tweak the third one to try to arrive at the best compromise for your system and tastes.

A slightly off topic note, I am getting back into pro-brewing. I am presently consulting with two start-ups. One in WY and one in SD. The brewery in WY has ordered their system and is expected to open around May 2013. The SD brewery just received approval for their funding and hopes to be open sometime next summer.

I am also doing recipe consulting for a recently opened micro in IA. A couple of my recipes should be available by spring. Perhaps by the fall of 2013 there might be a few places to try some other commercial variants of this "American White Ale"

First of all congrats on your recent consulting gigs Wayne... What a great time in history to be a brewery consultant!

I have been following your thread on and off over the last 3 years. Cloning a Blue Moon was one of my first priorities as a homebrewer. Since then I have been brewing many beer styles, 20 different this year alone. My Blue Moon attempts started with Wayne's recipe and progressed to try some of the variations suggested. Orange extract was a disaster. Weyermann Vienna vs Pale Malt I thought was not the flavor I wanted. My first attempts with the original recipe using Partial Mash are documented earlier in this thread and turned out great.

I recently made two BM batches one week after another, one for a neighbor's Christmas party and one just to compare with the first and have to share with my guests that dont want my darker/hoppier beers. I have both carbed and ready to taste side by side so I will post the detailed comments after that happens.

Recipe 1
Bohemian Pilsner
Weyermann Floor Malted Bohemian Wheat
Flaked Oats - Mashed
Carafoam
Crystal 40L

Recipe 2 - (Back to the original use of Pale but with a different Wheat)
Rahr Pale Malt
Weyermann Floor Malted Bohemian Wheat
Flaked Oats - Mashed
Carafoam
Med Crystal UK 55L

Both used
1 oz Hallertauer at 60 Min
0.75 oz Ground Corriander right into brewkettle at 10 min
1 oz Valencia Orange Peel at 5 Min

60 Min Mash at 154
90 Min Boils
1056 Amer Ale Yeast at 64F for 21 days
2.7 Vols carb in kegs

My initial tastes pick the original recipe using regular 2 Row Pale Malt over the Bohemian Pilsner. Had no issues with mashing Oats. Thanks to everyone who has shared their experiences on this thread.

 

[nilo]

#8 is completed, recipe found HERE
Comments HERE

Side by side

 

[Big_Cat]

Wow

 

[Toivo]

I just tapped a keg of this using the original basic recipe. The family really enjoyed it over Christmas. I had been making a version of Austin Homebrews begian wit that has always been a hit, but this new one is the best so far. I do have to add more orange to it since it came out very light on flavor and aroma. Great recipe and thanks to all who have added input to this thread.

 

[nilo]

Toivo, please take a minute to give your input in the poll found here
If the recipe you brewed is not listed on the link provided there, let me know.
I thought the poll was a good idea to capture everybody's feedback, but very few entries so far.

 

[BeerBaronBob]

Nice looking beers Nilo! Which one is which?

One minor correction to your Google docs document. The original recipe was using 2 Row Pale not regular 2 Row (Great Western is named)- a slight difference. I'm also not sure the original recipe used Briess malts at all so maybe that should be stricken as well.

You list Munch 10 as one of your ingredients in the last batch listed as a mistake? What brand did you use? Looks like this is the first time using Munich and it improved the score. Are you saying this might be a better version using Munich?

What temp are you fermenting at?

Thanks for sharing.

 

[nilo]

I have updated the original recipe and changed the format on google drive. Seems it takes a while to show up, user may need to download the latest revision by clicking on the left top arrow.
Details on #8 can be found here
I used briess Munich 10. The increase in chill haze, probably due to short boil and removal of irish moss, was the reason I liked this recipe better. I now removed my score from the recipe file as I think it is misleading and just my opinion. Best to look at the poll results.

 

[jstebell]

I'm trying a little experiment. I've always brewed kits so I just want to get some opinions on my "Blue Moon Clone" its not really a clone but I just want a good bigger version of Blue Moon. I'm using AHS' Blue Moon extract kit with some added grains. To get more body and a higher ABV. The recipe is as follows.
AHS Blue Moon extract kit
2# light wheat specialty grains
1# flaked oats
8oz Carapils
Steep grains for 60min at 155 and strain and "sparge" with 1 gallon water at 170.
Boil size 3.5 gallon
Batch size 5.5 gallon
Using Wyeast American Wheat 1010

Any more experienced brewers than my self please give me your thoughts. Thanks

 

[el_caro]

The answer is probably in there somewhere but I cannot find it.
Is it necessary or recommended to rack this one to secondary before going to bottling?
Brewed 6 days ago and it has gone from 1.054 to 1.008. Quite a bit of trub came over from the kettle to the FV.

 

[jwalker1140]

Plenty of threads re: whether to secondary or not. The one that includes 'Palmer' and 'Zainasheff' in the title is kinda the uberthread. It's worth a read if you're on the fence. Perhaps the main argument for using a secondary is that it helps the beer clerar, which isn't something you should be too concerned with here.

My recommendation would be to hold it in the primary for another week or two and then rack straight to your bottling bucket.

 

[el_caro]

As you mention there are many threads and much discussion on the merits of secondary use. Just notice many of the posters on this thread seem to be advocating secondary for this particular beer. My thinking was to leave it 2 or 3 weeks in the primary and then bottle.

 

[WVBeerBaron]

After reading this entire thread, taking notes and working out a recipe here is what I ended up brewing last weekend:

6lbs Two-Row
4lbs White Wheat Malt
1lb Flaked Oats
1lb Flaked Wheat
0.75 ounces Hallertau Hops 60 minutes
0.50 ounces coriander light crushed in a coffee grinder 10 minutes
2.50 ounces fresh orange zest 5 minutes
1.00 ounce dried sweet orange peel 5 minutes
4 tablespoons corn starch 3 minutes (made small slurry with cold water)

Mashed at 157 degrees for 45 minutes. effeciency was low, 55% or so.
1200ml starter of WLP001 on stir-plate.
1 minute pure oxygen
OG 1.042

Could not find valencia oranges or dried valencia peel, i used whatever the grocery store had (sunkist).

This is the 4th time I've brewed a Blue Moon Clone, a few of the others were a AHS kit (extract and partial mash). They turned out good but always come with belgian yeast instead of chico, which made them taste more like a traditional wit. I also used 1.5oz coriander once, way too much. I find that the citrus flavor gets scrubbed out during primary so i may add a few cups of orange juice at kegging.

 

[sloanfamilydsm]

This was my first attempt at a "Blue Moon" clone. I tried to follow the OP's recipe but ended up using what I had on hand. I'm excited to see how it turns out.

Blue Moon
5.0 Gallon Recipe

4.00 lbs. Pale Malt(2-row)
4.00 lbs. Wheat Malt
1.2 lbs. Flaked Oats

21 grams Centennial Pellet (11.6AA) 60 min

34 grams Ground Coriander 10 Min.
13 grams Orange Peel (Penzeys) 5 Min.

Wyeast British Ale II #1335 yeast cake from a Pale Ale

Protein rest 30min @ 122
Saccrification 60min @ 153

1.046 gravity
66% efficiency

 

[FuzzeWuzze]

Gonna be making this up today hopefully.

I was going for the #6 recipe since that has the most votes.

I didnt realize when i got the ingredients that you boiled the oats, so they got thrown into my bag of grains when i got them from the LHBS...

Gonna follow everything else ingredient wise for #6, just do the oats in the mash like in #1. Hopefully it comes out good, how long does it take for this to get to its prime? As a wheat beer i cant imagine more than a few weeks?

 

[fischfam]

Has anyone tried this with the BIAB method? Since I will not be sparging really, other than a rinse of the bag in hot water, a quick soak squeeze and out. For this I lowered the efficiency down to 68% Other than that I am using the rations from the original recipe.

 

[fischfam]

#8 is completed, recipe found HERE
Comments HERE

Side by side

if the Munich was a mistake should I add 10oz of 10L or 20+ w/o the Munich? Also what is the cornstarch for?

 

[jwalker1140]

Just another reference point: I just listened to the Aug. 9, 2007 podcast of Basic Brewing Radio, which was an interview of John Legnard of Sandlot Brewery. He spoke briefly about Blue Moon around the 12:45 mark. The highlights:

Typical (neutral) ale yeast, not a Belgian strain
Pale Malt
Wheat
Oats
Orange peel - added last 3-5 minutes (would lose ~half if added 7-10 min)
Coriander

No mention of amounts or ratios. He said it's one of the easier beers for a home brewer to make because it's unfiltered and done quickly.

 

[webby45wr]

Has anyone tried this with the BIAB method? Since I will not be sparging really, other than a rinse of the bag in hot water, a quick soak squeeze and out. For this I lowered the efficiency down to 68% Other than that I am using the rations from the original recipe.

I attempted my first BIAB with Nilo's #7 a few weeks ago. My only deviation from the recipe was the use of Nottingham because my LHBS was out of S-04. I got 68% efficiency. It got a little hot during the mash (gotta really stir), so I hope it turns out well. I'm planning to bottle this weekend and will post about the initial tasting.

 

[eulipion2]

Has anyone tried this with the BIAB method? Since I will not be sparging really, other than a rinse of the bag in hot water, a quick soak squeeze and out. For this I lowered the efficiency down to 68% Other than that I am using the rations from the original recipe.

I used Wayne's recipe as a guide, adjusted for my system. Full-volume BIAB and No-Chill, 75% efficiency.

5.25 lb US 2-row
4.5 lb Weyermann Light Wheat Malt
1.0 lb Flaked Wheat
4 oz Acid Malt (for pH adjustment)

1.325 oz Hallertau (3.9%, pellet) 70 min (90 min if chilling)
1 oz Valencia Orange Peel - in cube (10-5 min if chilling)
.325 oz Fresh Ground Coriander - in cube (10-5 min if chilling)

US-05

Mash: 90 min @ 154º
Mash-out: 15 min @ 170º
Boil: 90 min

OG: 1.049
FG: 1.009
ABV: 5.3%
IBU: 16
SRM: 5.5

 

[nilo]

if the Munich was a mistake should I add 10oz of 10L or 20+ w/o the Munich? Also what is the cornstarch for?

I would stick to 1lb of C10. Starch was to thicken the beer. Note that boil was 30min only and irish moss removed for the same reason.

 

[fischfam]

Silly question but I haven't had time to read all 72 pages here so,. If chill haze is something you want in this brew, I guess that there is no need to break out my wort chiller for this batch?

 

[Wayne1]

You do not want "chill haze". You do wish to have a somewhat opaque presentation.

I do not quite understand why you would think you do not need to cool the wort quickly. In every brew you want to drop the temp of the wort as fast as possible. The proteins from the wheat will usually make the finished beer fairly cloudy.

Nilo seems to have trouble with his beers dropping bright and thin body. That is why he adds the corn starch. I have never had this trouble.

Once again, I suggest you brew the first recipe as I describe. See what you end up with. THEN and only THEN should you try to experiment. Every one has different equipment and their technique is a bit different. You should not think your first attempt at any recipe will be perfect. Try it one way and then adjust for your tastes and gear.

 

[Boegman]

Wayne - I'm getting back into AG brewing after 12 years off. Want to do your original BM clone for the Mrs. Can you re-post the original recipe? Can't seem to find it in this massive thread!

 

[jwalker1140]

Wayne - I'm getting back into AG brewing after 12 years off. Want to do your original BM clone for the Mrs. Can you re-post the original recipe? Can't seem to find it in this massive thread!

It's on the first page, msg #6.