Black Krausen ring in Stainless Fermenter??

[Jlaitila140]

I made my very first beer EVER (simcoe/centennial IPA) on the 25th of November, dumped yeast and trub on the 2nd of Dec, dry hopped today and noticed blackness in the yeast ring when i popped the lid.... I have read a few threads on it but can't find any definitive reasoning for this event, some say the beer is bad some say its fine.. I plan on Kegging the beer this Wednesday and taking a chance...does anyone have any idea what the black in the krausen ring is?

I cleaned and scrubbed it with hot water and dawn day prior to brew day... then with PBW and hour prior, then with star san during the boil.

The only thing that went outside of the bounds of normal was the mash temp got too high (raised to 170 due to a temp probe failure), but got it back to 152 within 15 mins,other than that everything went to plan.

any advise will help me sleep tonight
Thanks
JJ

 

[brewbama]

It's "normal" in stainless fermenters. I believe it's oil from the hops. A good cleaning with PBW and a sanitizer soak will do the trick.

 

[Jlaitila140]

Glad to hear that thanks... It was quite a shock opening it up and seeing that... Everyone I know uses glass carboys and never seen anything like that, so they of course had nothing encouraging to say... Thanks brewbama.

 

[jessup]

You use fermcap? That's nothing compared to what you'll see in your future. Usually I have like 3-6" of that gunk & after a few months that stuff will require elbow grease! You're playing with a small headspace while fermenting.

 

[Doctor_M]

Yeah that thing has zero headspace. What is that anyways? SS brewtech?

 

[Rev2010]

Yeah that thing has zero headspace. What is that anyways? SS brewtech?

I'm guessing his batch is over 5 gallons. If it is an Ss Brew Tech then they definitely have more headspace than that, just a hair under 2 gallons, they say they're 6.95 gallon.


Rev.

 

[Jlaitila140]

I didn't use Fermcap, haven't tried that yet. My fermenter is a custom job i found on E-Bay, its 12 1/2 Gallon, i haven't marked the 10 gallon spot yet, I pitched 2 smack packs of 1157 cali ale yeast, and use a hose to a bucket of water... I was expecting blow out in the bucket but didn't get it.

This is a pic of my conical, no names or markings on it.

 

[Jlaitila140]

deleted repeated post

 

[Jlaitila140]

It's "normal" in stainless fermenters. I believe it's oil from the hops. A good cleaning with PBW and a sanitizer soak will do the trick.

Well i racked the beer, tasted good (from the hydrometer vial) real citrusy from my simcoe dry hops, and the black ring came off very easy with the PBW.
My FG came in higher than expected at 1.022 with the OG at 1.058 (was expecting a 1012 so my question for you is

Do you think the raise of my mash to 175 from my thermometer failure (i got it back down within 20-30 min) affected the FG that much? or do you think the 2 smack packs was not enough for the 10 gallon batch (28 lb grain bill)?

Either way that was my very first batch i'm just glad it wasn't spoiled lOL. It'll be my beer flavored wine cooler i guess. there was about 15 things i did different and better on the second batch (honey brown) that will be ready just after christmas. Thanks for your help earlier.

 

[Rev2010]

Do you think the raise of my mash to 175 from my thermometer failure (i got it back down within 20-30 min) affected the FG that much? or do you think the 2 smack packs was not enough for the 10 gallon batch (28 lb grain bill)?

So your strike temp was at 175 initially? If so, then yeah that's without a doubt the reason as you denatured a good amount of the enzymes during that period. Surprised it didn't come out a higher FG actually for a 20-30 minute 175 rest period! Gonna be a sweet tasting beer, but still drinkable I'd imagine.


Rev.

 

[Jlaitila140]

The strike temp was at 165, the temp dropped to 152 after mash in for 5 or so mins then dropped to 135... I turned the burner on to bring it back up, when I FINALLY double checked with my turkey thermometer 3-5 mins later the temp was at 175 ( gage on my mash tun was at 140) ... I killed the heat and started recirculating the wort with my pump to speed up the cooling (also a lot of stirring) that took 20 or so mins to get the temp to 152. Figured out later grain packed I between the shell and the Adapter with the gage in it acted like a "insulator" to the stubby gage. I sense fixed that for my second batch... I just don't know what the higher temp did while it was up that high.

Crappy learning experience.

 

[jessup]

Here's something similar from my rack & cleaning yesterday. Black ring on top, nothing out of the ordinary.

 

[jessup]

Let's try that again

View attachment 1450547227504.jpg

 

[TWAL]

The black is from the oils used in manufacturing,mine did the same thing despite soaking twice w/ PBW.
I contacted S.S. Brewtech and they told me to use TPS cleaner, that despite any cleaning done prior to shipment there is still residual oils in there.
I got a box of TPS-PF / Phosphate free cleaner and soaked the the fermenter. I also broke it down as well as all the ball valves (in fact my entire brewery) and soaked everything stainless I have then rinsed and soaked again in PBW (OXY Clean) rinsed then rinsed in Star- San and let air dry.
A ton of effort but well worth it ,there was a lot more oil than I realised in the valves alone when I took them apart.
Everything is clean and there has been no black ring again since.
My beer in that 1st batch turned out good although it was definitely slightly off from the oils,and I lived to tell about it!

 

[Rev2010]

I contacted S.S. Brewtech and they told me to use TPS cleaner, that despite any cleaning done prior to shipment there is still residual oils in there.

I did use TSP on my SS BrewMaster Bucket and also passivated using 4x strength of StarSan and still saw some black in the krausen ring today when kegging and cleaning the fermenter - first use.

Meh, I'm not worried. The hydrometer sampled tasted just fine. Matter of fact, it tasted extremely clean, not sure if that's due to using campden tablets for the first time or perhaps it's too soon to tell, but I'm sure my beer will be fine. Gotta say, I love this fermenter, the yeast and trub, pretty much only yeast from what I could tell, collected so nicely in the conical section. The beer also looked clearer than usual and I didn't use Whirlfloc on this one.


Rev.

 

[SanPancho]

It'll be my beer flavored wine cooler i guess..

go spend a few bucks on amylase enzyme at the brew shop. it'll get that FG down for you in a few days at room temp.

look up the threads here for info/details.

 

[jessup]

I'll compare hoppy krausen ring to low ibu & see if there's a difference. My SS fermenters are well used & couldn't imagine theres still oil from constant cleaning of pbw>starsan between batches. My head retention IS usually poor, though, regardless of what I do to improve.

 

[TWAL]

My SS fermenters are well used & couldn't imagine theres still oil from constant cleaning of pbw>starsan between batches. .

Probably not but I was surprised to see the black oil in a few ball valves I had that were used and cleaned (Not broken down) at least a 1/2 dozen times.

None of us are blind as a result so it doesn't seem there is much to be worried about.

 

[Jlaitila140]

The black is from the oils used in manufacturing,mine did the same thing despite soaking twice w/ PBW.

I contacted S.S. Brewtech and they told me to use TPS cleaner, that despite any cleaning done prior to shipment there is still residual oils in there.

I got a box of TPS-PF / Phosphate free cleaner and soaked the the fermenter. I also broke it down as well as all the ball valves (in fact my entire brewery) and soaked everything stainless I have then rinsed and soaked again in PBW (OXY Clean) rinsed then rinsed in Star- San and let air dry.

A ton of effort but well worth it ,there was a lot more oil than I realised in the valves alone when I took them apart.

Everything is clean and there has been no black ring again since.

My beer in that 1st batch turned out good although it was definitely slightly off from the oils,and I lived to tell about it!

TPS-PF? Is that completely different than TSP? I'm in the military and we use TSP (tri sodium phosphate) to clean fine carbons and oils out of oxygen use components but I never thought of using it in a brewery... Is it the same thing?

 

[Jlaitila140]

M

 

[Jlaitila140]

TPS-PF? Is that completely different than TSP? I'm in the military and we use TSP (tri sodium phosphate) to clean fine carbons and oils out of oxygen use components but I never thought of using it in a brewery... Is it the same thing?

 

[Jlaitila140]

Sorry for the same reply still trying to figure out this app. Lol

 

[TWAL]

It's nearly the same thing,it's the phosphate free version of TSP.
Same company (Savogran) same box except green rather than red.

 

[tagz]

Wait. You're very first batch of beer was fermented in a stainless conical?

 

[Jlaitila140]

Wait. You're very first batch of beer was fermented in a stainless conical?

Yeah, i was setting up my system and found a good deal on two conicals 12 1/2 gal fermenters. I'm active duty and move around a lot, so with a 10 gal AG system i can to in those 2 fermenters that i would need at least 6 carboys, and don't have to deal with them breaking in the move. All i have to worry about is my 2yo daughter knocking them over. (not a very sturdy stand)

 

[Jlaitila140]

It's nearly the same thing,it's the phosphate free version of TSP.
Same company (Savogran) same box except green rather than red.

Do you think the regular TSP would work just the same? I've only seen it used in high oxygen breathing systems, don't know if its safe for use in "human consumption" systems.

 

[Rev2010]

Do you think the regular TSP would work just the same? I've only seen it used in high oxygen breathing systems, don't know if its safe for use in "human consumption" systems.

Not sure what you're referring to, but I used the red labeled TSP to clean my Ss Brew Bucket. No problem.


Rev.

 

[tagz]

Yeah, i was setting up my system and found a good deal on two conicals 12 1/2 gal fermenters. I'm active duty and move around a lot, so with a 10 gal AG system i can to in those 2 fermenters that i would need at least 6 carboys, and don't have to deal with them breaking in the move. All i have to worry about is my 2yo daughter knocking them over. (not a very sturdy stand)

Dang, that's pretty sweet.

 

[TWAL]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that the TSP -PF just substitues sodium carbonate for the Sodium phoshate.

http://www.savogran.com/pdfs/TSP_PF_PD.pdf

SS Brewtechs instructions were to "use TSP (NON Chlorinated Only !!)".
I wasn't sure if the TSP was harmful to the stainless so I went w/ the TSP-PF.
TSP-PF was the only version that was free of anything so I used it.

It's a lighter duty version of the regular TSP and not as toxic to the environment or people i guess.
It worked great.Either way you will need to thoroughly rinse after the TSP (either version) then clean w/ oxy or pbw ,warm water rinse/soak, then hit it w/ Star San and let air dry.

Here's the instructions from S.S. Brewtech >>

https://ssbrewtech.zendesk.com/hc/e...First-Use-And-Removing-White-Powdery-Deposits


https://ssbrewtech.zendesk.com/hc/e...per-cleaning-of-ball-valves-before-first-use-

 

[Jlaitila140]

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong but I believe that the TSP -PF just substitues sodium carbonate for the Sodium phoshate.

http://www.savogran.com/pdfs/TSP_PF_PD.pdf

SS Brewtechs instructions were to "use TSP (NON Chlorinated Only !!)".
I wasn't sure if the TSP was harmful to the stainless so I went w/ the TSP-PF.
TSP-PF was the only version that was free of anything so I used it.

Thats great information thanks... I have BIX TSP concentrate but i cannot find any information on if it is chlorine free or not.... I made another batch with the same fermenter so i'll see in a a week when i dry hop if theres a black krausen ring again, and i scrubed the crap out of it with PBW. so we'll see, i'll post the results.