Black Heart Cascadian Dark Ale

[zgardener]

Brewed it up this weekend, hit OG spot on and it smells amazing. This is the first brew were I did a decent sized starter (1/2 gallon), lag time was only 3 hours. Another couple weeks and I'll hit this with 2 oz of whole leaf Cascade and .5 oz whole leaf Centennial.

Side note, while at AHS I was looking at their malt chart and it mentioned that midnight roasted wheat would do well in a black IPA, has anyone tried this?

 

[zgardener]

3 weeks in primary, racked to 2ndary a few days ago. Nice roasty notes, good hop presence, not as bitter as I was hoping, but still tasty. Dry hopping with generous amounts of whole leaf Cascade and Centennial.

Keg on Saturday, naturally carbonate with 2.25 grams of corn sugar. I'm trying to give this a little time to age so the roasted characters can mellow a bit, was a little harsh on the finish when I took my hydrometer sample. I'll definitely give this one another go, but probably with pellet hops and about 75% of the hops within the last 30 minutes and a large addition at flame-out.

 

[Doog_Si_Reeb]

Side note, while at AHS I was looking at their malt chart and it mentioned that midnight roasted wheat would do well in a black IPA, has anyone tried this?

I bought 2 lbs of the Midnight Wheat from AHS and used 1# in a Black IPA/CDA I brewed on 11/24. I am going to move it to secondary and add 3 ounces of dry hops this weekend. I'll take a hydro sample and give it a taste. In about a week I'll keg it and soon after I will report on how the Midnight Wheat affects the flavor. For my recipe, I used a recent IPA recipe that came out excellent and threw in 1# Midnight Wheat to blacken it up.

 

[zgardener]

I may look at using the midnight wheat, from my experience darker wheats tend to come out smoother and more malty than roasted barley.
Let me know how it comes out!

 

[bovineblitz]

I haven't brewed one of these types of beers yet, but I'm compiling a recipe of my own. To be honest, the thing that stands out the most in your recipe is the Black Patent. .75# seems like an awful lot. I would increase the de-bittered roast barley and lose the Black Patent altogether. If you want to reduce the flavor impact of the dark malts, you could add them later in the mash.

I used debittered black patent, and only 1/8 pound.

 

[Doog_Si_Reeb]

I may look at using the midnight wheat, from my experience darker wheats tend to come out smoother and more malty than roasted barley.
Let me know how it comes out!

I took a hydro sample this last weekend before adding 3 oz. of dry hops to the brew. I could detect a subtle roastiness from the midnight wheat. It was a very different flavor than I am used to with Roasted Barley. I'm planning to keg the batch early next week. I'll probably get it on the CO2, but I'll reserve judgment for at least a few weeks. It's relatively high-ABV so it will need some time to mellow. I'll post back on how it tastes in a week, and again in a month or so.

 

[zgardener]

Just kegged this sucker and took a sample, after 14 days on 2 oz on whole Cascade and 1 oz of whole Centennial it is much more mellow with an intense but pleasant punch in the finish. Naturally carbing this one so it can mellow out a little further and a slightly creamier mouth feel to balance out the 7.1% abv.
Can't wait to taste it in another 2,4,6,8 weeks!

 

[jgourd]

I used debittered black patent, and only 1/8 pound.

I've made a few CDAs now. both times I used debittered black. I have increased it in my latest batch to 1.5 lbs (about 10% of the grain bill). IBUs are about 80 and it's pretty well balanced and yummy. Won second place in a local club competition.

 

[zgardener]

I've made a few CDAs now. both times I used debittered black. I have increased it in my latest batch to 1.5 lbs (about 10% of the grain bill). IBUs are about 80 and it's pretty well balanced and yummy. Won second place in a local club competition.

Jgourd, would you mind sharing your recipe?

For this batch, I think the roastyness is just about right, I may up the chocolate by a couple of ounces, maybe an additional 4 oz of de-bittered black, but its probably not necessary.

Just read a one pager written by the head brewer at Russian River about making exceptional hoppy beers and warned of high % of crystal malts with American hops (suggested use <5%), this batch uses 8.6% crystal, next go 'round I'll knock that % down and compare.

 

[jgourd]

My latest recipe:

Back in Black IPA v2
--------------------
Batch Size: 6.00 gal (9.25 gal preboil)
Estimated OG: 1.068 SG (actual: 1.068 SG)
Estimated FG: 1.016 SG (actual: 1.020 SG)
Estimated IBUs: 74 (Tinseth; actual: 78)
Estimated Color: 40 SRM (actual: 42 SRM)
Brewhouse Efficiency: 73% (actual: 72%)
Boil Time: 90 minutes

Grains:
12.50# Maris Otter Malt (81.97%)
1.50# De-bittered black malt (9.84%)
0.75# Caramel/Crystal 90L (4.92%)
0.50# Carapils/Dextrine (3.28%)

Hops:
1.50 oz Centennial (9.1%) @90 min
1.25 oz Cascade (4.6%) @20 min
1.25 oz Centennial (9.1%) @20 min
1.25 oz Cascade (4.6%) @5 min
1.50 oz Columbus (14.5%) @5 min
2.00 oz Cascade (4.6%) @0 min
1.00 oz Columbus (14.5%) @0 min
1.00 oz Cascade (4.6%) (dry hop)
1.00 oz Columbus (14.5%) (dry hop)
1.00 oz Centennial (9.1%) (dry hop)
1.00 oz Simcoe (12.2%) (dry hop)

Yeast:
White Labs WLP001 (California Ale) (California Ale)

Mash/Sparge Schedule:
Single Infusion, 154F; Batch Sparge
Mash for 60 min at 154F w/ 4.96 gal of water at 170F
Mashout w/ 2.43 gal of water at 210F; hold for 10 min
Batch sparge w/ 4.02 gal of water at 183F; hold for 10 min

Fermentation Schedule:
Primary Fermentation: 12 days @66F
Secondary Fermentation: 7 days @70F

 

[Doog_Si_Reeb]

I took a hydro sample this last weekend before adding 3 oz. of dry hops to the brew. I could detect a subtle roastiness from the midnight wheat. It was a very different flavor than I am used to with Roasted Barley. I'm planning to keg the batch early next week. I'll probably get it on the CO2, but I'll reserve judgment for at least a few weeks. It's relatively high-ABV so it will need some time to mellow. I'll post back on how it tastes in a week, and again in a month or so.

I can't help but feel like an ass for quoting myself.

I have had the brew on CO2 for a few days now and it tastes wonderful! The midnight wheat lends a subtle dryness to the finish but I don't taste any roast/burnt/chocolate flavors from it. I used 1 lb of Midnight Wheat and it blackened the heck out of the beer. It's nearly opaque and completely refreshing.

 

[zgardener]

Great recipe! I'm sitting here drinking it now. Could stand a slight bit more carbonation, but this beer is great! By far the best I've ever made. Thanks for y'alls input and comments.

 

[jangelj]

I can't help but feel like an ass for quoting myself.

I have had the brew on CO2 for a few days now and it tastes wonderful! The midnight wheat lends a subtle dryness to the finish but I don't taste any roast/burnt/chocolate flavors from it. I used 1 lb of Midnight Wheat and it blackened the heck out of the beer. It's nearly opaque and completely refreshing.

Can you post the whole recipe, please? I didn't see it earlier in the thread. i have a # of midnight wheat I want to use this weekend.
Thanks,
john

 

[zgardener]

Can you post the whole recipe, please? I didn't see it earlier in the thread. i have a # of midnight wheat I want to use this weekend.
Thanks,
john

Here is the final bill
Next time I may think about using .5 lb of the debittered black, very tasty, but the roastyness imho overshadows the hops just a hair too much
I'll probably knock the crystal back to 1# also.
Midnight wheat would be a good replacement for the chocolate malt, will give great roasted flavor notes and aroma as well as awesome body.

12# 2 Row
1.25# Crystal 60
.75# De-bittered black barley
.5# Chocolate Malt

Mashed @ 155 for 60 minutes. 1.2 qts/lb

90 minute boil
Whole leaf hops

.5 oz Centennial (75)
1 oz Centennial (60)
1 oz Cascade (30)
1 oz Cascade (15)
Dry hop w/ .5 oz Centinnial and 2 oz Cascade

 

[jangelj]

hmmm. I've not use the midnight wheat before. How could I incorporate that into this recipe? Should I use it instead of the debittered black barley?

 

[zgardener]

hmmm. I've not use the midnight wheat before. How could I incorporate that into this recipe? Should I use it instead of the debittered black barley?

Not sure, never used it before myself, I'd like to say that you could replace the chocolate malt and even the de-bittered black with it, but I'd put it into a recipe calculator (I use tastybrew.com, too cheap to drop the $20 for beer smith) and play around with it.

I think you're right about replacing the de-bittered with the midnight, that's probably the best route. I'd keep the chocolate malt (at least .25#, I really like the chocolate notes with the citrus of the cascades).

Hopefully someone with more experience with the midnight will chime in.

 

[Doog_Si_Reeb]

I used 1# of the midnight wheat in mine and it made it extremely dark. It's darker than the stouts I have made in the past. Based on my limited experience, I would recommend using the midnight wheat 1:1 in place of the debittered black malt. I'm not saying it's better, but if you wanted to use midnight wheat in place of debittered black, then it should be close to a 1:1 swap. If you want the flavor characteristics of chocolate malt, then by all means, leave that in the recipe. The midnight wheat just darkens the beer and adds a subtle dryness in the finish.