BIAB and sparging

[RWurster]

Thanks for the answer, that makes sense.

 

[Iowayankees]

I use a BIAB with my brewzilla- had seen someone along the way use a 4 way rod to hook on to the cinch so that there is room to sparge. Anyone have seen this and can share ideas to build or buy this addition?

 

[RocketBrewer]

I use a BIAB with my brewzilla- had seen someone along the way use a 4 way rod to hook on to the cinch so that there is room to sparge. Anyone have seen this and can share ideas to build or buy this addition?

I have a couple extras I built that I was planning to sell. If you're interested, shoot me a PM

 

[Alan Reginato]

With a conventional mash tun, you need the grains crushed but not too crushed or you get a stuck mash because you would depend on the crushed grains and their intact hulls to form the filter. With that coarser crush, the beta amylase can be denatured during the slower conversion during the mash which then leaves the alpha amylase enzyme that creates more dextrines. It takes some time at normal mash temperatures to denature the beta enzyme and that happens faster at the higher mash temps so you can vary the fermentability of the wort by varying the mash temp, low temp to preserve the beta amylase as long as possible to get a very fermentable wort, higher for a beer with more body.

When you take advantage of the ability of BIAB to deal with very finely milled grains you can get a very high mash efficiency but since the grain particles are so small they gelatinize nearly immediately and the enzymes are able to access all or nearly all the starches right away. Conversion of starches to sugars is very quick and is completed before any of the enzymes can be denatured. I've tried mashing at 152 and at 158 and get the same final gravity from both.

To work around that, I let someone else affect the fermentability of the wort by incorporating some caramel malt. I can just add body with carapils or add sweetness with caramel 10 or 20. It gets me the same effect without losing mash efficiency.

How much time, for these temperatures?

How much mash efficiency?


Thanks, in advance!

 

[RM-MN]

How much time, for these temperatures?

How much mash efficiency?


Thanks, in advance!

I don't recommend less than 30 minutes for the mash although I have found that the conversion happens long before that time. The problem with going shorter time than that is it takes time to extract the flavor. If you want flavorless beer, do an extremely short mash with the grains milled to near flour.

Mash efficiency is directly related to the quality of the milling plus the mash time. I expect near 100% mash efficiency. As the milling of the grain gets coarser, it takes more time to approach the 100% mash efficiency until you finally get coarse enough that you cannot get there.

 

[doug293cz]

I don't recommend less than 30 minutes for the mash although I have found that the conversion happens long before that time. The problem with going shorter time than that is it takes time to extract the flavor. If you want flavorless beer, do an extremely short mash with the grains milled to near flour.

Mash efficiency is directly related to the quality of the milling plus the mash time. I expect near 100% mash efficiency. As the milling of the grain gets coarser, it takes more time to approach the 100% mash efficiency until you finally get coarse enough that you cannot get there.

It would be better if you used the word "conversion" efficiency above. Conversion efficiency is a measure of the percentage of starch that gets converted to sugar, and that's what you are talking about.

Mash efficiency is usually used to mean the percentage of potential sugar that makes it into the boil kettle. The brewing software I am familiar with uses this definition for mash efficiency. Mash efficiency is equal to conversion efficiency times lauter efficiency. Lauter efficiency is the percentage of the sugar created by conversion in the mash that makes it into the boil kettle. It is equal to 1 (or 100%) minus the amount of sugar that remains in the spent grains after draining, and optionally sparging. The less sugar remaining in the grain, the higher the lauter efficiency.

Brew on

 

[The Mad Brewer]

Used my cereal grain killer today for the 1st time, other than having to tighten a few things up, it was nice to be able to do it over a bucket and keep the mess outside and I'm very pleased with the result

 

[The Mad Brewer]

I bought a piece of 1/8” stainless welding rod when I was getting my CO2 cylinder filled at the welding shop.

If you have a bench vise and a hammer, you can bend it so there is a slight overhang on the ends. This fits my 15” kettle nicely.
View attachment 765074

Bought a rod that I will bend in the shape like you did and try it out this weekend thank you for the tip

 

[The Mad Brewer]

I use what I call DBIAB - Double Brew in a Bag - make it easy on yourself. Use two bags, I have a stainless rod that goes over the top to clip the bags to.

Super easy, easy to remove grains, half the weight. No hoist needed.
View attachment 764868

Worked great much easier really helped keep the mess down, Thanks again

 

[LitBrewing]

I ran into basically the same problem as the OP today. I have a 14g pot, but I am wanting to make 9.5g of beer, so the water+grain is too much for my 14g to hold if I don't add water.

I used an old refigerator grate that rests on top of the kettle after pulling the grains out, I set it on that, works fairly well but the wet grains tend to not want to sit there, and when trying to pour hot water over the grains to rinse it gets all over the place. Today ended up spilling some grains into the kettle, and spilling water/drained wort all over. What a mess! I used a clean bag to just filter out the grains for the wort, so I believe it should be fine.
\
Instead of about 12 preboil i ended up with about 9g, just made sure to match the pre-boil gravity I was aiming. We shall see how the end results turns out!
I thought about trying to us a bucket, but they aren't really wide enough to fit 20+ lbs of grain.

I guess I need to maybe get a super wide mouthed container, and rinse in there.

Anyone have ideas for something larger than a standard bucket size to sparge in that isn't too expensive?

 

[marc1]

I ran into basically the same problem as the OP today. I have a 14g pot, but I am wanting to make 9.5g of beer, so the water+grain is too much for my 14g to hold if I don't add water.

I used an old refigerator grate that rests on top of the kettle after pulling the grains out, I set it on that, works fairly well but the wet grains tend to not want to sit there, and when trying to pour hot water over the grains to rinse it gets all over the place. Today ended up spilling some grains into the kettle, and spilling water/drained wort all over. What a mess! I used a clean bag to just filter out the grains for the wort, so I believe it should be fine.
\
Instead of about 12 preboil i ended up with about 9g, just made sure to match the pre-boil gravity I was aiming. We shall see how the end results turns out!
I thought about trying to us a bucket, but they aren't really wide enough to fit 20+ lbs of grain.

I guess I need to maybe get a super wide mouthed container, and rinse in there.

Anyone have ideas for something larger than a standard bucket size to sparge in that isn't too expensive?

I use the pot I used before I moved to 10 gallon batches for sparges. It's 50 quarts. I keep it next to the regular brew kettle, and have a second pulley set above it. I hoist the bag out with the first pulley, let it drain, then hook in the second pulley and loosen the first. The grain bag then gets guided to the sparge pot with ~5 gallons of room temp water in it. Untie, stir, let it sit a few minutes, then hoist it out again. After it drains I guide the bag of grains into a plastic bucket, dump the sparge into the main kettle (which is already on the way to boiling), and continue the boil.

 

[wsmith1625]

I use the pot I used before I moved to 10 gallon batches for sparges. It's 50 quarts. I keep it next to the regular brew kettle, and have a second pulley set above it. I hoist the bag out with the first pulley, let it drain, then hook in the second pulley and loosen the first. The grain bag then gets guided to the sparge pot with ~5 gallons of room temp water in it. Untie, stir, let it sit a few minutes, then hoist it out again. After it drains I guide the bag of grains into a plastic bucket, dump the sparge into the main kettle (which is already on the way to boiling), and continue the boil.

That's an interesting setup. I like the 2 pulley system to avoid lifting a heavy grain bag. Have you considered using the 2nd pulley to lift the sparge pot?

 

[marc1]

That's an interesting setup. I like the 2 pulley system to avoid lifting a heavy grain bag. Have you considered using the 2nd pulley to lift the sparge pot?

With only 5 gallons of wort, lifting it isn't a problem. If it ever did become problematic, I'd probably use a pump.

 

[LitBrewing]

I think i'm gonna use a pulley draped over a branch nearby to lift it out, hopefully I can get most of the drainage and sparge water to fall into the kettle after lifting. With a 5g batch it's not a problem, and I don't even need to sparge but I have been doing larger batches which means 20+ lbs of grain before getting wet.

 

[The Mad Brewer]

I ran into basically the same problem as the OP today. I have a 14g pot, but I am wanting to make 9.5g of beer, so the water+grain is too much for my 14g to hold if I don't add water.

I used an old refigerator grate that rests on top of the kettle after pulling the grains out, I set it on that, works fairly well but the wet grains tend to not want to sit there, and when trying to pour hot water over the grains to rinse it gets all over the place. Today ended up spilling some grains into the kettle, and spilling water/drained wort all over. What a mess! I used a clean bag to just filter out the grains for the wort, so I believe it should be fine.
\
Instead of about 12 preboil i ended up with about 9g, just made sure to match the pre-boil gravity I was aiming. We shall see how the end results turns out!
I thought about trying to us a bucket, but they aren't really wide enough to fit 20+ lbs of grain.

I guess I need to maybe get a super wide mouthed container, and rinse in there.

Anyone have ideas for something larger than a standard bucket size to sparge in that isn't too expensive?

The fridge grate is an excellent idea im gonna try.

 

[MHBT]

No sparge makes better wort then sparge, only reason to sparge is to squeeze out as much extract as possible to make a profit, its more for commercial breweries imo, at home i think its better to add more grain

 

[LitBrewing]

No sparge makes better wort then sparge, only reason to sparge is to squeeze out as much extract as possible to make a profit, its more for commercial breweries imo, at home i think its better to add more grain

For making a 9g batch I am forced to add water after the mash out because the kettle can't hold all the grain and water at once. I have to add water, so might as well pour it over the grains to get a little more efficiency vs just adding it to a more concentrated wort.

The other solution would be to buy a bigger kettle, but then I need a bigger bag, etc. Just more expense...

 

[MHBT]

For making a 9g batch I am forced to add water after the mash out because the kettle can't hold all the grain and water at once. I have to add water, so might as well pour it over the grains to get a little more efficiency vs just adding it to a more concentrated wort.

The other solution would be to buy a bigger kettle, but then I need a bigger bag, etc. Just more expense...

True that , i guess it all depends on individuals equipment

 

[DBhomebrew]

No sparge makes better wort then sparge

This statement might need some unpacking. Better wort?

 

[MHBT]

This statement might need some unpacking. Better wort?

Yeah I believe so

 

[hotbeer]

I think i'm gonna use a pulley draped over a branch nearby to lift it out, hopefully I can get most of the drainage and sparge water to fall into the kettle after lifting. With a 5g batch it's not a problem, and I don't even need to sparge but I have been doing larger batches which means 20+ lbs of grain before getting wet.

If you have another kettle of a large enough size, then fill that with your additional water you are calling sparge water and lower your bag in it. Push the bag around some to get all the water evenly distributed through out the bag. Then pull the bag out and let it drain.

That way you won't have to worry that your sparge water is channeling through the grain and out the bag missing all the stuff you are hoping to rinse off or out of the grain.

Depending on your amount of additional water need for boil you might divide that in half and do two rinses.

Then you can combine that with your other wort for your boil and any other make up water you might need.

 

[odie]

I have my bag in a basket. I just sparge directly into the basket after it finishes draining. Really bumps my lauter efficiency.

 

[balrog]

Do what makes you happy. That's what I say. I don't squeeze, I don't sparge, I simply lift the BIAB bag and gravity does what gravity will do for 10 min or so.

What's important, to me at least, is to be able to repeatedly do something. So I say pick a process and stick with it.

 

[MHBT]

Do what makes you happy. That's what I say. I don't squeeze, I don't sparge, I simply lift the BIAB bag and gravity does what gravity will do for 10 min or so.

What's important, to me at least, is to be able to repeatedly do something. So I say pick a process and stick with it.

Amen

 

[brewmanStan]

Amen

I agree. I've bent and broken every rule in the book when it comes to brewing but still manage to make good beer. My method has developed to where I haven't had to sparge in the last five or so years, and I squeeze. Works for me.