Beer Allergy Diagnosis???

[Imp_atient]

So I've at times had allergic reactions to beer and I couldn't find a thread here that addressed the topic (I did end up finding some after more extensive searching)...

Symptoms: Runny nose, coughing, lung congestion (like asthma)

So today I drank a St. Peters Winter Ale, Faxe Strong Beer (bear with me, I'm aging my brews so I'm trying not to consume them before they reach their prime). Anyways, I'm totally fine and then...I drink an Imperial Coffee Stout and can't even finish it my airway is full of mucus and I'm blowing my nose constantly.

Then I thought back, I've had the same reaction to Guinness and Fort Garry Dark.

So, I'm not allergic to yeast or gluten. Most beers and all breads are fine.
I'm not reacting to histamines from the fermentation process because I eat a lot of high histamine food with no reaction. What else is there?

The only connection I can see here is dark beer...what the heck could be in stouts and dark beer that would cause this reaction???

I figured who better to ask then home brewers to know/suggest/contemplate what ingredient might be setting it off.

Cheers

 

[Lcasanova]

Before you said yeast/gluten I would have said that...now Im not sure. I'm "allergic" to beer- meaning I turn red (must be the Native American in me). Ever had an allergy test?

 

[Hermit]

Interesting, but if you think you have an allergy this is really something you should probably go to a doctor and get tested for. There is an off chance you could have a severe reaction to something similar without making the connection.

 

[hbomb]

Interesting. Obviously anything answered here is total speculation and you should see a doctor if its bothering you, but I would have guessed gluten too. I've also heard of breathing symptoms associated with liver problems, but I'm definitely no doc.

 

[Imp_atient]

Yeah, I've got an appointment with the doc on Jan 15th so we'll see. I'm not taking any advice given on this site as serious health advice...

I was just hoping for some thoughts while I wait or maybe some crazy brew nut might be like: "Dark malt has specific co-enzymes that stimulate the production of allergens in the hypothalamus...."

Cheers

 

[hilohwn]

I know of people which turn bright red when drinking (which is a form of an allergic rx), but to go through anaphalaxis is pretty serious. The next reaction you have could completely close your airway. I would definitely recommend seeing your doc and maybe carrying an epi pen. I work on an ambulance and have seen anaphalactic pt's.....bad stuff...
Maybe it's the different malt's your allergic to?
Good Luck..

 

[Chuck_Swillery]

Possiblity you having a negative reaction to the various B-vitamins in beer. You may just have a developed a sensitivity to them and certain brews will contain higher "doses" of B-vit. than others. Just a thought...

 

[Hermit]

Yeah, I've got an appointment with the doc on Jan 15th so we'll see. I'm not taking any advice given on this site as serious health advice...

I was just hoping for some thoughts while I wait or maybe some crazy brew nut might be like: "Dark malt has specific co-enzymes that stimulate the production of allergens in the hypothalamus...."

Cheers

They just roast it a bit longer and hotter.... I couldn't find much and this looks like no help. You might try a company that does the malting, explain your situation, and see if they can offer clues. Good luck and stay away from the darks.....

 

[JefeTheVol]

Let me preface this by saying Im only a 3rd year medical student. That being said, it sounds like you ARE having a "hay fever" like reaction to whatever is in those beers. I dont really know what you mean by "high histamine" foods, if what you mean as foods that cause a release of histamine in some people, then I guess I understand.

Your symptoms are from the immediate release of histamine from your own cells caused by a hypersensitivity reaction from something in the beer; not anaphylaxis, which is multi-systemic. Your doctor is most likely going to tell you to avoid the substance that offends your system; so what that means for you is, no dark beer.

Caramelization produces so many different kinds of chemicals(probably in the dozens to hundreds depending on the amount of non-enzymatic browning from the kiln) that you are probably having your reaction to one, if not more, of those compounds produced from a Maillard-like reaction after the barley is malted.

Combining sugars with amino acids results in the color change of the barley,Maillard Reaction, that is used in those darker beers, and because AA chains are notoriously responsible for immune reactions, my guess is that you are correct in thinking that those dark beers are causing your symptoms.

Hopefully your doctor will have better answers for you than me, but the first thing he is going to say is "remove the offense".

 

[killian]

I have had some issues when milling but never drinking (except gout) good luck I'm interested to see what your doc says

 

[david_42]

I'd agree with JefeTheVol on the Mallard chemicals.

 

[Hoppus_Poppatopolis]

Am I correct in thinking that the common thread in the beers which caused problems is roasted, unmalted barley?

 

[ChshreCat]

Is there sulfite in some beer? I know that sulfite in wines can cause reactions like that.

Do you ever get this problem after drinking commercially produced wine?

 

[GrizlyGarou]

Does it happen on your third beer everytime, or just the dark ones regardless of how many you've had before it?

Allergic reactions to things can get really, really bad. I used to be able to eat crab and lobster, but now I can't really do that breathing thing too well if I do. Get worse the last three times I ate shellfish, so I decided lobster and crab weren't really worth dying for and stopped. I'm not sure if I'd make the same decision for beer or not, though...

 

[remilard]

Is there sulfite in some beer? I know that sulfite in wines can cause reactions like that.

Do you ever get this problem after drinking commercially produced wine?

There are sulfites in all beer, but in no case that I am aware are there added sulfites (only naturally occurring). In any case, if sulfites were above 10 ppm, they label would have to indicate it (in the US).

 

[Brew-Happy]

My suggestion is from an experimental stand point. If you have an LHBS, go and buy a few ounces of each of the dark malts (chocolate, black barley, etc). Then without drinking any beer that day, eat one of the types of dark barley ( and only one). This would identify if you are allergic to one of the malts. If you try more than one you get a confounding effect and won't be able to tell if it is one or more of the malts you react to.

If you don't react, then we are looking at an interaction of the yeast and a dark malt. What that would be would take a lab full of expensive equipment.

Of course, this idea has a potential to cause you harm as you could go into a larger allergic reaction. So try this at your own risk and in the presence of someone who could drive you the hospital.

Odds are you are sensitive to a common ingredient to the beers you listed. Unfortunately, Fort Garry does not list the types of malts they brewed the dark ale with.

You could contact them for a list of types of malts they use, then compare it to Guiness' ingredient list and the Imperial Stout you mentioned. This would help to identify the culprit.

Good luck!

 

[android]

i know that when i over indulge in beer, my allergies are always worse the next day... i don't necessarily get any effects when i'm drinking, but my sinuses are always all messed up the next day (particularly in the winter). i'm interested to hear what your doc tells you.

 

[Imp_atient]

I dont really know what you mean by "high histamine" foods, if what you mean as foods that cause a release of histamine in some people, then I guess I understand.

I was reading (from a non-reliable internet e-health source) that histamines are a byproduct of the fermentation process and that there are some foods that contain natural histamines (spinach and tomatoes were two listed). Therefore by drinking beer you are introducing histamines to your system which can in rare instances ???cause them to bind to mast cells??? and create an allergic reaction.

Anyways, this is sort of fun. I'm going to try an experiment tonight and see if I can find any academic literature. I have one stout and one light beer left in the fridge so I'll try both and see what happens.

I have exactly the same reaction to animal dander and all my friends have pets so I'm pretty used to being stuffed up by something or other. Might as well be productive about it.

 

[JefeTheVol]

I was reading (from a non-reliable internet e-health source) that histamines are a byproduct of the fermentation process and that there are some foods that contain natural histamines (spinach and tomatoes were two listed). Therefore by drinking beer you are introducing histamines to your system which can in rare instances ???cause them to bind to mast cells??? and create an allergic reaction.

Thats the problem with some of those internet health sites, they use a lot of laymen terms/explanations that differ from health professional's language. One of the things I have learned about medicine is that there is a medical term for everything.

Histamine doesnt bind to mast cells to cause inflammation, it is released by them, and binds to different H Receptors on a lot of types of tissue to stimulate the inflammatory reaction. The allergen/antigen binds to IgE on the surface of the mast cells and then they degranulate with a bunch of chemicals that cause your symptoms. Mainly histamine.

Maybe what the article was getting at is that fish and other food, contain histadine, which can be converted to histamine, under particular circumstances. But I would advise against trying to figure out what your allergic to by ingesting the substance, that sounds like a bad idea. Make sure you have benadryl on hand if you decide to do that, it could save your life.

Good luck with your doctor's appointment and I hope he doesnt advise you to avoid beer, alltogether. That would suck.

 

[Imp_atient]

But I would advise against trying to figure out what your allergic to by ingesting the substance, that sounds like a bad idea.

Yeah, good point. I suppose I should drop my "Using Poison Ivy as Toilet Paper" experiment next week as well. Rats.

Seriously though, thanks for all the info, I'll have to wait a month now to see what the doc says. I'll ditch the dark beer consumption idea, I hate Benadryl, it gives me "kicky" legs, you know when you can't keep your legs still?

Then I'll have to sit up all night and think of things to put in the "You know you're a brewer when..." thread.

 

[Hodor_Baggins]

My Dad hasn't been able to have a beer for ~30 years because he is severely allergic to hops. The last beer he had, he ended up in the ER because it triggered a massive asthma attack.

I know you mentioned dark malts, so this might not be it, but there's always that possibility.

 

[Imp_atient]

OH NO! That sucks. I usually taste my hops, smell my hops and if I'm priming with a hops tea I drink some....so I'd definitely be in trouble if that was the case.

This is kind of a saddening thread...alas the quest must go on...

 

[Imp_atient]

Okay, so I did an experiment anyways and timed it like a boil....(with antihistamines nearby...relax)

I drank 250ml of Hockley stout (1 cup). BTW, Hurray Ontario Craft Brewers....booyah!

Within 5 minutes - Stoned feeling
15 min - Chest congestion and tightening
30 min - Sneezing, runny nose + itchy neck (lymph nodes???)
45 min - Coughing up mucus (mild, like you know it's over)
60 min - Back to normal

Half and hour after this I drank 500ml (2 cups) of light beer. I was perfectly fine, no reaction.

So the quest continues. Now SWMBO wants to use the computer to watch the Oprah Obama interview...my beer forum conversation is trumped.

Lots of solid suggestions from everyone!!!!....there are no dark malts available to chew on where I live but sounds good. After my experiment I think I've narrowed it down enough to do some research. I'll hit up the university library and get back. Hopefully this isn't completely self centered and others with similar "afflictions" (ha ha) can relate!

 

[Stagnasty]

Okay, so I did an experiment anyways and timed it like a boil....(with antihistamines nearby...relax)

I drank 250ml of Hockley stout (1 cup). BTW, Hurray Ontario Craft Brewers....booyah!

Within 5 minutes - Stoned feeling
15 min - Chest congestion and tightening
30 min - Sneezing, runny nose + itchy neck (lymph nodes???)
45 min - Coughing up mucus (mild, like you know it's over)
60 min - Back to normal

Half and hour after this I drank 500ml (2 cups) of light beer. I was perfectly fine, no reaction.

So the quest continues. Now SWMBO wants to use the computer to watch the Oprah Obama interview...my beer forum conversation is trumped.

Lots of solid suggestions from everyone!!!!....there are no dark malts available to chew on where I live but sounds good. After my experiment I think I've narrowed it down enough to do some research. I'll hit up the university library and get back. Hopefully this isn't completely self centered and others with similar "afflictions" (ha ha) can relate!

Its a sign from God to drink Light Beer !!!

 

[middleofnowhere]

How is Lakehead these days? I went there for a semester in 1996, spent 10 grand to realize university wasn't for me...lol then I broke a record for sitting on a couch the longest and then quit. lol

 

[Imp_atient]

Its a sign from God to drink Light Beer !!!

Aren't those folks more concerned with turning water into wine??? Lord knows after a hard day of carpentry a beer is quite refreshing.

How is Lakehead these days? I went there for a semester in 1996, spent 10 grand to realize university wasn't for me...lol then I broke a record for sitting on a couch the longest and then quit. lol

Um, it's alright. I'm teaching there now...which I never expected. Just imagine marking the assignment of a student who

broke a record for sitting on a couch the longest and then quit

Trust me, you're not the only one.

Several of the paper mills in town are going under, real estate is cheap like borscht, and a local craft brewer opened up and went under in about a year....which makes me sad...I bought his beer but this town is just too obsessed with commercial, cheap beer. If we're in a recession we may as well drink good beer....right?

So strange, you cross the border into the States and it's like people understand brewing, Duluth and Grand Marais get it but T-bay doesn't.

 

[middleofnowhere]

We have the same problem here with the craft brews. The only craft brews you can get here is unibroue, and we have to enter quebec for those.

What do you teach there?

Fyi, I was the original couch sitter...lol

 

[Imp_atient]

What do you teach there?

Outdoor recreation classes...

 

[middleofnowhere]

Fun stuff. I was a kinesiology student, I wish I stayed. Now I work at a mine...boo.

 

[Imp_atient]

After my experiment I did a brief search on PubMed and Allied Health Source yielding very little medical research into beer allergies.

I'll revise my search terms and see what I can come up with. Considering the amount of people who have posted and are allergic to beer in some way, shape or form...I think perhaps a literature review would be fun.