B. Nektar Zombie Killer Clone

[markklug]

I've done a few ciders and one cyser that I backsweetened with cherry juice. Also a big fan of Zombie Killer and looking to do a good clone. I feel like the organic cherry juice I found at the local health food store was a great match and I have access to a thistle honey also. Not sure how much difference the honey varietal will come through. Posting to get feedback on the cider side of things. I know Zombie Killer is just a cider with honey and cherries added. Wondering if it would be best to cold crash the cider at about 1.010 to retain some of the apple sugars, or backsweeten with apple concentrate so that some of the sweetness comes from a natural apple sugar instead of just from the honey and cherries. Anyone try this or have thoughts on the idea?

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

Zombie Killer is really a cyser which is a bit different than the clones in this thread. You can still get damn near the same thing in the end yourself, taste wise, by backsweetening a cider. Try the recipe I posted on pg. 2 and but cut the honey down to 1lb. Personally which variety of honey isnt as important as the quality.
Just make sure to pasteurize all the bottles ~3 days after bottling. Lemme know if you have any more questions.

 

[markklug]

Zombie Killer is really a cyser which is a bit different than the clones in this thread. You can still get damn near the same thing in the end yourself, taste wise, by backsweetening a cider. Try the recipe I posted on pg. 2 and but cut the honey down to 1lb. Personally which variety of honey isnt as important as the quality.
Just make sure to pasteurize all the bottles ~3 days after bottling. Lemme know if you have any more questions.

Thanks......still debating whether to let it go dry. I made a cyser with fresh 2.5 gallons cider from pressed apples and 3 pounds raw wild rose honey. A great cyser by itself, but then added organic cherry juice as it went in to the keg with another pound of wild rose honey. It is very good.......but my sense is that it does not have the same apple underlying flavor because I let it go dry. Will see if anyone else weighs in but leaning towards using your recipe but cold crashing before it goes dry. Cheers

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

Thanks......still debating whether to let it go dry. I made a cyser with fresh 2.5 gallons cider from pressed apples and 3 pounds raw wild rose honey. A great cyser by itself, but then added organic cherry juice as it went in to the keg with another pound of wild rose honey. It is very good.......but my sense is that it does not have the same apple underlying flavor because I let it go dry. Will see if anyone else weighs in but leaning towards using your recipe but cold crashing before it goes dry. Cheers

FWIW with my ciders I usually let them ferment dry then add apple juice, honey, and whatever else I may backsweeten with then pasteurize. The honey helps bring out the apple but adding apple juice when you backsweeten really put the flavor back to where I wanted it. For a while I was doing it without the apple juice but, like you, found I wasn't getting enough apple flavor. Maybe letting it go dry is what causes it(makes sense to me) but apple juice definitely fixes it lol.
Whatever you go with definitely post back with results!!

 

[dios_es_un_tortuga]

Just tried the commercial product. Quite tasty, but not exactly named appropriate I think. Zombie killer conjures up a rather harsh sensation. Maybe a whiskey. I think that even Michonne and Andrea (book) would consider this a tad light. That said, after I finished drinking it, it occured to me that it might be a good idea to put a hydrometor in and see what sort of FG B nektor is using. I'll do this myself if I get another bottle anytime soon. This is third on my list of to be cider brews so I'll do it myself if no one does before then. If anybody has a bottle handy and wants to contribute to the general knowledge before then though, it'd be appreciated.

 

[scottvin]

I tried some recently and loved it! Here is my clone attempt:

3 gallons apple juice
SNA - 2tsp DAP, 1tsp Fermaid-K
EC-1118

Completed
Poured the three gallons of apple juice in a cleaned and sanitized 3 gallon better bottle.
Added 1tsp of the SNA and EC-1118 (not hydrated).
24 hours later, added 1tsp of SNA
24 hours later again, added 1tsp of SNA

Once fermented, I will:
Rack to keg and add 1 pound of honey along with 16 ounces (maybe more) of Tart Cherry Juice.

I will let everyone know how it turns out!

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

1L of tart cherry juice was the amount I used in a 6gal batch and it came out perfect so 2 cups should be about right for 3gal. Though if there's any advice I can give its to add the tart cherry juice to taste at bottling. Its strong stuff. As well 1# of honey is a lot, I use 1# for a batch twice the size and it comes through well. I've tried 2#s, the equivalent of what your talking about doing, and the honey was too much.

In the end its up to your taste but I figured I'd put that out there.

 

[scottvin]

Thanks, I will take that in to consideration about the honey.

Just an fyi - I had an extra bottle of ZK and I let it go still and took a gravity reading which was 1.030.

Just some more info to keep in mind.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

Thanks, I will take that in to consideration about the honey.

Just an fyi - I had an extra bottle of ZK and I let it go still and took a gravity reading which was 1.030.

Just some more info to keep in mind.

That's good to know thanks.

 

[JonM]

Thanks, I will take that in to consideration about the honey.

Just an fyi - I had an extra bottle of ZK and I let it go still and took a gravity reading which was 1.030.

Just some more info to keep in mind.

Awesome - another thanks!

 

[JonM]

I mixed this up according to KeyWestBrewing's revised recipe and it tastes great and the color is perfect! I'm kegging, so I'll just add my $0.02.

I cold crashed the dry cider to get rid of the yeast, which meant I was adding honey to cold cider, and the honey didn't want to readily dissolve. I think I solved the problem by leaving the dip tube out (that step is really important because it will instantly clog if there's undissolved honey at the bottom of the keg), purging the keg with CO2, sealing it, and shaking the bejeebers out of it. I plan on leaving the dip tube out for a couple days and giving the keg a shake a couple times a day. I figure everything should be dissolved in a couple days to a week.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

I mixed this up according to KeyWestBrewing's revised recipe and it tastes great and the color is perfect! I'm kegging, so I'll just add my $0.02.

I cold crashed the dry cider to get rid of the yeast, which meant I was adding honey to cold cider, and the honey didn't want to readily dissolve. I think I solved the problem by leaving the dip tube out (that step is really important because it will instantly clog if there's undissolved honey at the bottom of the keg), purging the keg with CO2, sealing it, and shaking the bejeebers out of it. I plan on leaving the dip tube out for a couple days and giving the keg a shake a couple times a day. I figure everything should be dissolved in a couple days to a week.

Glad to hear your happy with the results so far! FWIW you can heat the honey up in a little water before you mix it in. Ive found it helps it dissolve and mix evenly into solution.
Looking forward to some pics!

 

[JonM]

Success! The honey all dissolved and no more clogs in the dip tube.

I made a half batch, but the ratio of 1 lb of honey and 1L of tart cherry juice to 6 gal of cider is great. The apple, cherry and honey flavors are all there and no one is more prominent than the other - perfect balance. Thanks for the recipe!! I can tell this is going to be a big hit.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

Success! The honey all dissolved and no more clogs in the dip tube.

I made a half batch, but the ratio of 1 lb of honey and 1L of tart cherry juice to 6 gal of cider is great. The apple, cherry and honey flavors are all there and no one is more prominent than the other - perfect balance. Thanks for the recipe!! I can tell this is going to be a big hit.

That's good news!! Post up some pics soon!!

 

[scottvin]

I will be putting this together tonight

I think I willl add 3/4 pound of honey with 16 ounces of RW Knudsen Organic Just Tart Cherry juice to the 3 gallons fermented apple juice in my keg. I am going to try to warm up the honey (in the bottle) in some warm water and mix it in the cherry juice before adding to keg, then racking over it. thoughts?

 

[QuercusMax]

That's basically what I've been doing: put the honey and the juice in a pot on the stove, along with some KMeta, and bring it up to about 170 to sterilize. Then I rack the fermented cider into the keg, pour the juice/honey in, seal the lid, purge, and shake the dickens out of it.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

I will be putting this together tonight

I think I willl add 3/4 pound of honey with 16 ounces of RW Knudsen Organic Just Tart Cherry juice to the 3 gallons fermented apple juice in my keg. I am going to try to warm up the honey (in the bottle) in some warm water and mix it in the cherry juice before adding to keg, then racking over it. thoughts?

That's a little more honey than I prefer but taste is subjective so try it out and see how you like it. That's the same amount of cherry juice I use though and I think its a good balance. Good advice on pasteurizing the honey too. I'd still heat the bottle up a little to make it easier to pour out.

 

[scottvin]

won't shaking the keg introduce O2 into to cider/cyser/zombie killer?

 

[QuercusMax]

Not if you purge it of O2 first - that means filling it with C02, releasing the pressure, and repeating a few times. That's standard procedure when kegging. Although I will admit I've forgotten to do it on occasion with 5 gallon batches and haven't noticed any problems, but with a 3gal batch there's much more O2 hanging out.

Also, I always fill my kegs with starsan and push it out of the keg with c02 before racking, so there should theoretically be less oxygen in there to start with.

 

[scottvin]

So I added 12 oz of honey and 2 cups of tart cherry juice. I heated the cherry juice and mixed in the honey so it was all liquid. i then racked the 3 gallons of cider over the mixture. It was still quite tart and dry. It read 1.014 in the hydrometer. I will let it settle for another day but i still might add more honey and or Apple juice if it isn't sweet enough


Sent from my iPad using Home Brew

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

So I added 12 oz of honey and 2 cups of tart cherry juice. I heated the cherry juice and mixed in the honey so it was all liquid. i then racked the 3 gallons of cider over the mixture. It was still quite tart and dry. It read 1.014 in the hydrometer. I will let it settle for another day but i still might add more honey and or Apple juice if it isn't sweet enough


Sent from my iPad using Home Brew

I wouldn't let it sit or the yeast will kick up again and eat the sugar. The idea is to backsweeten then kill off the yeast to retain all that extra sugar for flavor. Either way add the honey/cherry juice to taste and go with what you like.

 

[scottvin]

I wouldn't let it sit or the yeast will kick up again and eat the sugar. The idea is to backsweeten then kill off the yeast to retain all that extra sugar for flavor. Either way add the honey/cherry juice to taste and go with what you like.

I used sorbate/sulfite to kill the yeast so I am not worried about that

 

[QuercusMax]

One more update about my latest ZK:
It's been in the keg just over 3 weeks now, and it initially had some of the "cider vinegar" taste I got from the previous batch. That is now gone and it's smooth and very drinkable. I'm not really a cider guy (I make it for my wife), but I've been known to pull a pint or two of the latest batch after drinking some IPAs.

 

[QuercusMax]

I just received Honorable Mention for this in the Wizard of Saaz competition today. Once I get the judging sheets I'll post what they say.

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

I just received Honorable Mention for this in the Wizard of Saaz competition today. Once I get the judging sheets I'll post what they say.

That's badass!! Congrats!!

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

I just received Honorable Mention for this in the Wizard of Saaz competition today. Once I get the judging sheets I'll post what they say.

What category did you enter this in... 28B or 28D?

 

[QuercusMax]

I entered it as 28B, fruit cider, and the judges didn't seem to have a problem with that. I might have gotten a slightly higher score if I had entered it as Medium or Semi-Sweet - to *me* it's pretty darn sweet, but now I know how to enter it...

Here's a link to the scoresheets... I think maybe using a different yeast than the Cote de Blanc might cut down on the sulfuriness one of the judges picked up?

 

[noblesquirrel]

So a bit late to the party, but I made a batch of this a year ago for a party and it was stellar. I took a bit of a different approach and did score a 42 in competition, as a fruit mead. Here's what I did:

Started with 4 gallons of apple cider and .75 gallons of tart cherry juice from Trader Joe's. Added in 5lbs of Starthistle honey. I fermented with Wyeast sweet mead yeast since it is known to be a bit lazy. I fermented down to 1.020 from 1.080, so closer to 8%abv, but I was fine with that. I cold crashed it at 1.02 and added sorbate and sulfite. I kept it near freezing for about 2 weeks before racking to a carboy for a month. It was crystal clear but needed some structure so I added a couple of cinnamon sticks, which accentuated the cherry stone notes. It did still drop a touch more, to 1.015, but it was amazingly refreshing and had a great integration of flavors, so much so that this weekend me and a friend are putting together something similar, this time using blueberries. I think the sweet mead yeast was key in getting it to slow down/stop.

 

[h0psnobery]

So about how long does this take to ferment from 1.04 to 1.008? I'm a noob at meads, but this looks great and id like to start with it. Is that yeast nutrient/energizer necessary? If so, when does it go in?

 

[KeyWestBrewing]

So about how long does this take to ferment from 1.04 to 1.008? I'm a noob at meads, but this looks great and id like to start with it. Is that yeast nutrient/energizer necessary? If so, when does it go in?

About the same as beer maybe a little longer. I usually don't use any extra nutrient or anything since Nottingham packs already have some in it.

And FWIW I think most juices are 1.050. At least the ones I've always used are.